Indian Air Force Confirms Jaguar Re-engine Plan

[Tejasvinam]

BOSS that is the POINT , WHO Makes the decision on the FMS??? definitely NOT THE IAF!, so STOP pointing the finger at THEM... its the MoD (DAC) who make the final decisions on ANY procurement !.... Have u followed the Rafale deal ?? negotiations are done by who the MoD or the IAF?

Nope, the IAF does the recommendation and the MoD usually accepts the recommendation.

No one sensible or sane in a position of power dis-regards the recommendation of any service chief. The last time that happened was during Nehru era.

The MoD purchased Rafale ONLY because the Rafale was recommended by the IAF. Even then the recommendation was found to be faulty since it did not match the budget of the IAF. That is why the Rafale deal was restructured by scrapping the MMRCA.

 

[GuardianRED]

Nope, the IAF does the recommendation and the MoD usually accepts the recommendation.

No one sensible or sane in a position of power dis-regards the recommendation of any service chief. The last time that happened was during Nehru era.

The MoD purchased Rafale ONLY because the Rafale was recommended by the IAF. Even then the recommendation was found to be faulty since it did not match the budget of the IAF. That is why the Rafale deal was restructured by scrapping the MMRCA.

lol... wow, you are now digging yourself a hole.

The Recommendation made by the IAF is always made on equipment to get based on their requirements - ITS THE MoD JOB to negotiation on the prices - SO which recommendation by the IAF is found to be faulty?? the price??? who job is that?

Please read on the MMRT - the IAF has recommended on the A330 - Which by the way is kept on hold (or cancelled soon) by which dept?

 

[Tejasvinam]

lol... wow, you are now digging yourself a hole.

The Recommendation made by the IAF is always made on equipment to get based on their requirements - ITS THE MoD JOB to negotiation on the prices - SO which recommendation by the IAF is found to be faulty?? the price??? who job is that?

Please read on the MMRT - the IAF has recommended on the A330 - Which by the way is kept on hold (or cancelled soon) by which dept?

Obviously the IAF recommendation is going to be on the equipment and not the cost. But they do need to take the Cost, existing technology, tactics for use and long term strategy into consideration before making a recommendation. That is what professionals do.

MoD did negotiate the price, only the price for 126 Rafale was found to be unreasonable. So MoD had to step up and look for alternatives.

Again the A330 recommendation ignored the COST of the acquisition. Also the IL 78 requires a shorter take off and landing strip, has more take off capacity and has smaller dimension than the A330.

Most importantly the IL 78 costs less than 100 Million $, while the A330 costs more than 300 million $.

Even the fuel price has come down to 12$ a barrel and IAF already has experiencing flying and maintaining the IL 76 family of aircraft's.

IF a decent spares stores can be maintained then the IL is a far better deal than the A330. A lot less cool, but a lost more cost effective for a air-force that has the budget of IAF.

So yes, the IAF messed up again since it was unable to answers to the questions raised by the Finance ministry. Its about time the IAF realised that it is not judging a 'Science Fair' while it recommends a buy. It needs to stop acting like a 10 year old kid in a toy shop who wants to coolest toys while 'daddy' has to tell him whats possible and whats not. Maybe that kid needs to grow up so that daddy do not have to tell him anymore how expensive his toys are.

 

[GuardianRED]

Obviously the IAF recommendation is going to be on the equipment and not the cost. But they do need to take the Cost, existing technology, tactics for use and long term strategy into consideration before making a recommendation. That is what professionals do.

MoD did negotiate the price, only the price for 126 Rafale was found to be unreasonable. So MoD had to step up and look for alternatives.

Again the A330 recommendation ignored the COST of the acquisition. Also the IL 78 requires a shorter take off and landing strip, has more take off capacity and has smaller dimension than the A330.

Most importantly the IL 78 costs less than 100 Million $, while the A330 costs more than 300 million $.

Even the fuel price has come down to 12$ a barrel and IAF already has experiencing flying and maintaining the IL 76 family of aircraft's.

IF a decent spares stores can be maintained then the IL is a far better deal than the A330. A lot less cool, but a lost more cost effective for a air-force that has the budget of IAF.

So yes, the IAF messed up again since it was unable to answers to the questions raised by the Finance ministry.

LOL...... you are a going to decide on what a professional the IAF should be?? The IAF looks at Flyaway cost , Not what each frame cost . above all THEY see the Technical advantages it brings

The MoD stepped up?? .. lol, that is funny - that was negotiation is!! find the best solution !

U do know what is the MMRT is , what is stands for? u do know that this tender was issued twice and both times it had won. ?? THE A330 won because it is it was TECHnically Superior and it is a True multirole and have better capabilities compared to the IL:78, Please do read up on IT!

 

[Tejasvinam]

LOL...... you are a going to decide on what a professional the IAF should be?? The IAF looks at Flyaway cost , Not what each frame cost . above all THEY see the Technical advantages it brings

The MoD stepped up?? .. lol, that is funny - that was negotiation is!! find the best solution !

U do know what is the MMRT is , what is stands for? u do know that this tender was issued twice and both times it had won. ?? THE A330 won because it is it was TECHnically Superior and it is a True multirole and have better capabilities compared to the IL:78, Please do read up on IT!

No, not me, its the Finance Ministry who is going to decide if the IAF calculations is correct or not.

And so far they IAF has been unable to justify its calculations that showed A330 as L1. Hence the delay in purchase, so yes, the fault lies directly with the IAF.

Price Negotiations happen to find the best price, not the best solution. LOL.

True, the A330 was technically superior that is why the IAF thought it was judging a "Science Fair" and gave the first prize to A330. Only the real world is not a 'science fair'.

So rather than advice me to read up, maybe you too needs to grow up and smell the coffee.

 

[Bheemsen]

Can anyone please post details of current state of capabilities of Jaguar operated by IAF and what will be its capabilities after upgrade.

 

[kaykay]

Heard they are considering an AESA radar for Jaguars too....

 

[Super Commando Dhruva]

Can anyone please post details of current state of capabilities of Jaguar operated by IAF and what will be its capabilities after upgrade.

Please Ignore few points in it.

 

[GuardianRED]

No, not me, its the Finance Ministry who is going to decide if the IAF calculations is correct or not.

And so far they IAF has been unable to justify its calculations that showed A330 as L1. Hence the delay in purchase, so yes, the fault lies directly with the IAF.

Price Negotiations happen to find the best price, not the best solution. LOL.

True, the A330 was technically superior that is why the IAF thought it was judging a "Science Fair" and gave the first prize to A330. Only the real world is not a 'science fair'.

So rather than advice me to read up, maybe you too needs to grow up and smell the coffee.

Wow , Now we can really see the Lack of any knowledge is showing.

The Negotiation for the Rafale, included, type weapon systems, training system, off set clause etc ... NOT JUST the price... There is an entire thread here please read it!

The MRTT is called Multi - Role Tanker Transport - for u to understand that it means it its role is NOT just a tanker, but can be configured to cargo, personnel transport or medical facilities when needed i.e it can be re- configured depending on the situation , as required in the ASR. the IL78 can't do this very easily (This is why reading helps)

Lol. using your logic,please tell us why the IAF went for C17? isn't this aircraft really really expensive? why not still go for the IL76? much cheaper? No?

Stop leaving in your la la land and wake up to the real world