India Tops in Illiteracy and Defense Spending

[notsuperstitious]

I would just like to mention two quick points -

1) Literacy rate of India and Pakistan -

India - 61% Pakistan - 49.9%

http://hdr.undp.org/en/media/HDR_2009_EN_Complete.pdf

2) Expenditure on defence as a percentage of GDP -

India - 2.5% Pakistan - 3%

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2034rank.html

And yet we have this thread. I welcome all the criticism India receives. But, as I have said numerous times before on this forum, shouldn't Pakistanis be more concerned about the state of affairs in their own country rather than poking their noses in India's internal matters?

And our illiterates aren't going around killing people in other countries too.

Thank you for your post that shows people their aukaat

We love you too

 

[RiazHaq]

Agreed,

But then since we have world's second largest population, the illiteracy percentage will be definately be more

China is more populous than India, and yet it has only 70 million illiterate adults versus India's 270 million.

Why is that? Is it not a matter of focus and priority?

http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0018/001865/186525E.pdf

Guns Versus Butter Debate in South Asia - PakAlumni Worldwide: The Global Social Network

 

[RiazHaq]

And our illiterates aren't going around killing people in other countries too.

Thank you for your post that shows people their aukaat

We love you too

India has been spending more than 3% of its GDP on defense for several years, according in-depth analysis done by Col Nair.

The accounting gimmicks make defense spending look much less than actual. And there is very little oversight of how much money is actually spent by the Indian military.

Indian defense budget's specified limit of 3% of GDP has been observed only by excluding several items like the cost of the MoD and the expenditure on military pensions which by itself amounts to 15% of the total defense outlay. Several other items like the Jammu and Kashmir Light Infantry (JAKLI, a regular regiment of the army consisting of thirteen battalions) and the Coast Guard are also excluded. A substantial part of the cost of the nuclear arsenal and allied systems is excluded. All para-military forces including the ones directly involved in border management are excluded. The Parliamentary Committee on Defense spends most of its time on personnel matters and resolving issues of protocol between the service chiefs and the defense secretary. The Committee looks at DE but beyond stating that DE should be pegged at 3% of GDP, it has nothing substantial to contribute. Clearly, parliamentary oversight and control seems to be missing. For several years, DE in aggregate has crossed 3% of GDP.

Haq's Musings: India's Arms Buildup: Guns Versus Bread

 

[Skeptic]

Mods please take a note of this


These are the kind of threads which are deliberately started by some people without looking in the mirror

India is a country with a population of 1 Billion plus and Indpencence of 60+ years still it has 60-70% literacy compared with pakistan at still under 50% and the author insted of concentrating on his on motherland and problems has the courage and shamefullness to point a finger on India who is transparent in defence deals and keeps its budget at 3% ...........WHY ?

And why do you have to cry if he does. This is an open forum and everyone has a right to comment about other nations, else what is the point. If he has no right to comment upon Indian issues then we dont have a right to even be on a Pakistan Defence forum.

If directed properly, this is actually a very constructive criticism. Not that I agree that expense to education should be linked directly to defence, they are very different issues, but yes, you will need to accept that India is way behind the world in overall literacy scene.

And what is the point comparing to Pakistan? Are hey the benchmark we are aiming from? Or can it make our situation any better if we are better than Pakistan? Why not compare with other countries who gained independence at the same time.

It is the same bug of corruption and red tape that has left India lagging. This is not exactly a flame rather it's the poster's perception. Get your heads out of sand, and I apologize if I sounded a little harsh.

If you disagree counter his arguments, dont go running to mods at drop of the hat.

 

[RPK]

China is more populous than India, and yet it has only 70 million illiterate adults versus India's 270 million.

Why is that? Is it not a matter of focus and priority?

http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0018/001865/186525E.pdf

Guns Versus Butter Debate in South Asia - PakAlumni Worldwide: The Global Social Network

Government cant force everybody to study. it again based on individual. In india we have many great potilical leader & businessmen who never went to school.

Blank comparision wont help

 

[footmarks]

China is more populous than India, and yet it has only 70 million illiterate adults versus India's 270 million.

Why is that? Is it not a matter of focus and priority? http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0018/001865/186525E.pdf

Guns Versus Butter Debate in South Asia - PakAlumni Worldwide: The Global Social Network

India is far more populous than Pakistan. Yet it has more than 700 million literates. Thats almost double the entire population of Pakistan and approx 4 times more than Pakistan's Literates?

Now, Is it not a matter of focus and priority?

 

[Storm Force]

India may have 270 million illiterates but that does mean that India has 900 million that are literate.

Also india maybe bottom of the human development index and have hundreds of millions starving. BUT its stil the 2nd fastest growing Economy at 7% in the world with GDP set to go past UK (CURRENTLY RANKED 5 IN THE WORLD) BY 2020.

Indian defense budget at $30 billion+ may seem excessive but that comes with having a $1.3 trillion GDP. Its actually only 2.3% of its gdp and probably half the % that pakistan is spending

GLASS HALF FULL I THINK ## don,.t be so negative abt india they are growing fast VERY FAST

 

[RiazHaq]

And our illiterates aren't going around killing people in other countries too.

Thank you for your post that shows people their aukaat

We love you too

India is killing its own people in large numbers through poverty, hunger, lack of sanitation etc.

The worst victims of neglect are the innocent children, two million of whom dies each year from preventable causes.

An estimated 200,000 farmers have been forced to end of their lives of poverty and deprivation in the last ten years.

Indian planning commission member Syeda Hameeda has acknowledged that malnutrition in India is worse than Pakistan and Bangladesh.

Haq's Musings: Is India a Nutritional Weakling?

 

[conworldus]

China has a 9 year mandatory education system. The parents will be punished if the child is not sent to school. Although this is not strictly enforced in some rural areas (hence 70 million illiterate), it still helped lower the illiteracy rate.

Also China invests way more in education than India does. Money matters.

2009 Chinese central government education budget (provincial government budgets excluded): 198 billion yuan or approxi. 28 billion dollars.

I can't find exact figures of India but I think it is around 5 billion for the Union government.

Moreover, for many thousand years, education has been the key to social status and wealth in China, where aristocracy is based on merit but not bloodline. Hinduism on the other hand emphasises on a caste based bloodline, so lower caste people have little incentive nor access to education. This attitude still influences its modern society.

China is more populous than India, and yet it has only 70 million illiterate adults versus India's 270 million.

Why is that? Is it not a matter of focus and priority?

http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0018/001865/186525E.pdf

Guns Versus Butter Debate in South Asia - PakAlumni Worldwide: The Global Social Network

 

[Skeptic]

China has a 9 year mandatory education system. The parents will be punished if the child is not sent to school. Although this is not strictly enforced in some rural areas (hence 70 million illiterate), it still helped lower the illiteracy rate.

Also China invests way more in education than India does. Money matters.

2009 Chinese central government education budget (provincial government budgets excluded): 198 billion yuan or approxi. 28 billion dollars.

I can't find exact figures of India but I think it is around 5 billion for the Union government.

Moreover, for many thousand years, education has been the key to social status and wealth in China, where aristocracy is based on merit but not bloodline. Hinduism on the other hand emphasises on a caste based bloodline, so lower caste people have little incentive nor access to education. This attitude still influences its modern society.

As I mentioned, the amount is not a problem for India, the implementation is. India has allocated 6% of GDP for education. Of this 3.6% was spent.

Expense on education far behind target: official

That would be twice the amount mentioned by you (kindly check if that is correct). Therefore, it is not the defence expense which has caused the problem, much rather the leakage in our current system(read corruption).

 

[RiazHaq]

India is far more populous than Pakistan. Yet it has more than 700 million literates. Thats almost double the entire population of Pakistan and approx 4 times more than Pakistan's Literates?

Now, Is it not a matter of focus and priority?

India's population is 7X Pakistan's and yet it has only 4 times more literates than Pakistan?

Arguments aside, Pakistan clearly needs to do lot more in terms of literacy and human development than it has done so far. It has a long way to go. And the country needs to seriously reevaluate its priorities and focus.

Haq's Musings: Low Literacy Rates Threaten Pakistan's Future

 

[conworldus]

As I mentioned, the amount is not a problem for India, the implementation is. India has allocated 6% of GDP for education. Of this 3.6% was spent.

Expense on education far behind target: official

That would be twice the amount mentioned by you (kindly check if that is correct). Therefore, it is not the defence expense which has caused the problem, much rather the leakage in our current system(read corruption).

I was only comparing the central governments spending. I have no local government spending data. The number in the article is about total educational spending of the society I think. I don't really knw the Chinese data on this one, but I think it is very very high. There are so many different types "classes", "adult education", "children education" offered in China and it is difficult to estimate how much it is spent.

 

[Skeptic]

India's population is 7X Pakistan's and yet it has only 4 times more literates than Pakistan?

Arguments aside, Pakistan clearly needs to do lot more in terms of literacy and human development than it has done so far. It has a long way to go. And the country needs to seriously reevaluate its priorities and focus.

Haq's Musings: Low Literacy Rates Threaten Pakistan's Future

I wonder why your calculative mind could not figure out a simple error made by this member.

61% of 1.1 Billion ~ 9 times (50% of 175 million)

 

[Skeptic]

I was only comparing the central governments spending. I have no local government spending data. The number in the article is about total educational spending of the society I think. I don't really knw the Chinese data on this one, but I think it is very very high. There are so many different types "classes", "adult education", "children education" offered in China and it is difficult to estimate how much it is spent.

Yup it is higher. China spends 2.5% of GDP on education.
China economy at crossroads after 30 years of reform | Reuters

The point being India has allocated 2x in % of GDP to education than China. and almost 1x in defence.

Time to quit musing now I guess.

For details of Education in India:
http://stats.uis.unesco.org/unesco/...?ReportId=121&IF_Language=eng&BR_Country=3560

66.0% of adults and 82.1% of youth are literate

Seems like results are coming in for future.
Moreover since we are dwelling over Pakistan:

http://stats.uis.unesco.org/unesco/...?ReportId=121&IF_Language=eng&BR_Country=5860
54.2% of adults and 69.2% of youth are literate
Spends on Education is 2.8% of GDP.

For China:
http://stats.uis.unesco.org/unesco/...?ReportId=121&IF_Language=eng&BR_Country=1560

93.3% of adults and 99.3% of youth are literate
% of GDP data has not been updated here. It was 1.9% in 1999. .

 

[Skeptic]

India's population is 7X Pakistan's and yet it has only 4 times more literates than Pakistan?

Arguments aside, Pakistan clearly needs to do lot more in terms of literacy and human development than it has done so far. It has a long way to go. And the country needs to seriously reevaluate its priorities and focus.

Haq's Musings: Low Literacy Rates Threaten Pakistan's Future

Actually the number of literates is more than 5 times the total population in Pakistan. Now please stop these childish pissing contest.