India’s low-caste still “untouchables”

[S_O_C_O_M]

India’s low-caste still “untouchables”​

Published 09 August, 2010, 07:22


In the traditional Hindu society, caste prejudice is illegal but it is still an issue for many, especially when it comes to the “ritually impured.”

The so-called Dalits, or “untouchables,” are not allowed to get involved with the upper caste in any way.

It is a problem that’s been simmering, but now Soni Devi says it’s fast reaching the boiling point. She is a newly-appointed cook in this primary school in Jaanipur. She is there to prepare the government-funded midday meal.

But despite Soni’s best intentions, some of the students turn their noses up at her culinary creations, because she is a Dalit. In traditional Hindu society, only upper-caste cooks are allowed to cook community meals.

“Some upper-caste children don’t want to eat food made by me,” she said. “Their parents consider the food polluted by my touch. What can I do? I’m here to make lunch in this school. I treat the children here just like my own kids.”

120 million children across India receive a mid-day meal every working day, in the largest school lunch program in the world. But when the Education Ministry decided to send Dalit cooks to village schools, where the majority of pupils are upper-caste Hindus, many found that too hard to swallow.

“The mid-day meal can entice poor parents to send their children to school. The kids look forward to it. But there are some parents who don’t want their children to eat food made by low-caste people and have removed their children from here, and also threatened us as well,” said school principal Ram Kumar Pathak.

Meet the Singh family, a member of the upper caste Rajput community. They refused to allow their 10-year old son Parmanand to continue studying in a school which they felt didn’t respect their customs, and pulled him out immediately.

“We are upper caste. We believe strongly in the caste system. We cannot eat food made or touched by somebody from a lower caste. That’s why we moved our child from this government school and put him into a private one,” Parmanand’s mother Gita Devi explained.

Activists say this kind of reaction demonstrates the difficulty in eradicating the caste system. Discrimination on the basis of caste is illegal in India, but the practice is still entrenched in rural areas, where the kind of work you do, and who you can eat with, is largely divided along caste lines.

“We low-caste people are treated like dirt,” said low-cast villager Umi Devi. “The upper castes order us about, they tell us, ‘Stay on one side, wash the utensils, sit there’-- anything to humiliate us. They want us to remain low and never rise up.”

As for the government, it is most willing to bridge social divisions and says legal action will be taken against villagers who oppose Dalit cooks in schools.

India?s low-caste still ?untouchables? - RT Top Stories

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

What ever is your intentions are cast system still prevails in some parts of india. May be younger generation will refuse follow this that's the only hope because govt is not able to reach every where and social workers are not able to change their age old mind set.

 

[muse]

Bhagath

I surprised to hear responses such as yours - seems to me, generally Indians are cool with caste - I mean I have read many responses such as yours, and it seems Indians are not interested to understand WHY caste just won't die.

Seems to me that Caste came into being, in other words, was CREATED, as a solution to problems -- of course Caste has now changed over and over again through time and instead of solving a probrlem, it's now a problem intself - in other words, it seems Indians have a two fold attituce towards it - they like the "community" and "exclusivity" it offers, but on the other hand the kinds of values it is based on, are a problem - is that a fair understanding?

Perhaps the Indian Government is not a part of the solution - I mean it's not like high caste types don't occupy high positions in government, isn't it? And some Indian posters have pointed to what they call "positive discrimination" by the government, that's pretty much promoting caste system isn't it?

How can we better understand this problem for Indians?

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Bhagath

I surprised to hear responses such as yours - seems to me, generally Indians are cool with caste - I mean I have read many responses such as yours, and it seems Indians are not interested to understand WHY caste just won't die.

Seems to me that Caste came into being, in other words, was CREATED, as a solution to problems -- of course Caste has now changed over and over again through time and instead of solving a probrlem, it's now a problem intself - in other words, it seems Indians have a two fold attituce towards it - they like the "community" and "exclusivity" it offers, but on the other hand the kinds of values it is based on, are a problem - is that a fair understanding?

Perhaps the Indian Government is not a part of the solution - I mean it's not like high caste types don't occupy high positions in government, isn't it? And some Indian posters have pointed to what they call "positive discrimination" by the government, that's pretty much promoting caste system isn't it?

How can we better understand this problem for Indians?

Frankly where i live(Kerala) cast system is not that strong as in other parts of india. And i belong to christian and that too reduce my exposer to cast system. ' positive discrimination is ok but should not be based on religion. I mean the god you believe dose not or should not influence your social or economical statues.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Dalit Families Evicted, Houses Razed​

JAIPUR: Thirteen Dalit families living under an open sky for the past two months at Satpuda village in Chittaurgarh district of Rajasthan after their houses on the government's surplus land were destroyed by the people of dominant castes have demanded action against the culprits and land allotment under the ongoing “Prashasan Gaon Ke Sang” (administration with villages) campaign.

Influential people of Satpuda demolished the houses of Meghwal and Kalbelia Dalits settled for about 20 years on the outskirts of the village on October 7 allegedly at the instance of the administration. No official assistance for rehabilitation or financial relief has been provided to the victims so far.

A fact-finding team of the Centre for Dalit Rights (CDR), which visited the village on Monday, found that the Dalit families were not served with the mandatory notices for eviction under the Land Revenue Act, while each of them possessed ration cards and had their names listed in the electoral rolls.

Dalit families told the six-member team, led by CDR director Satish Kumar, that the Tehsildar and revenue officials visited Satpuda on October 6 and “verbally instructed” the villagers to raze the “illegal houses”. “The next day, the dominant people brought huge machines and flattened the entire locality. We lost all of our belongings,” victim Mangi Ram told the team.

The landless Dalit families struggling hard to make ends meet had requested the administration to allot land to them in 2004, but no action has been taken as yet in this regard. On the other hand, the administration has not paid any attention to the alleged encroachments by the dominant Rajput community at a nearby surplus land.

Police apathy

Alleging that the higher caste people were “hand in glove” with revenue officials in the village, the Dalit victims told the team that the police had not registered any case against the perpetrators of the crime and the latter were threatening them with dire consequences if they tried to lodge complaint.

Mr. Kumar regretted that the State Government, which was “making tall claims” about allotment of land free of cost to poor Dalits, had remained a mute spectator to the forcible and illegal eviction of Dalits by unauthorised people in Satpuda case.

The CDR team met Chittaurgarh Collector Arushi A. Malik and demanded immediate relief to the Dalit families along with reconstruction of their houses and registration of cases under the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes (Prevention of Atrocities) Act, 1989, as well disciplinary proceedings against the Tehsildar and revenue officials.

Mr. Kumar said the poor Dalit families deserved the benefit of the Indira Awas Yojana after their inclusion in the below poverty line category, while agricultural and residential land should be allotted to them under the “Prashasan Gaon Ke Sang” campaign.

The CDR, which has also sent a memorandum with these demands to the National Human Rights Commission and the National Commission for Scheduled Castes, has pointed out that no encroacher on the government's surplus land can be evicted without the due process of law.

Other members of the team were Gopal Ram Verma and Babulal Kiroriwal of CDR, Khemraj Chaudhary of Prayas Sansthan, Bhanwar Meghwanshi of Dalit Adivasi Adhikar Abhiyan and K. C. Sharma of the People's Union for Civil Liberties.

The Hindu : Other States / Rajasthan News : ‘Dalit families evicted, houses razed'

 

[unicorn]

Caste system will never vanish from India because they are born with it.Very unfortunate for them as it is their most fundamental problem.Even the realization of the young generation will not be able to help in future.

 

[jayron]

Caste system will never vanish from India because they are born with it.Very unfortunate for them as it is their most fundamental problem.Even the realization of the young generation will not be able to help in future.

Sorry to disappoint you. But caste system is losing its importance and the people of the oppressed classes are more empowered now.

BTW, what is your opinion about Pakistan's caste system?

 

[desioptimist]

I share the view of the pakistani friend, the caste system is here to stay for quite some time.
However, in high and upper middle class, class does not matter any more.

Some states, people are more caste conscious than others,so will take longer in some places than other.

About positive discrimination based on caste, it is debated for quite long. People have fought for and against it.

Also, govt is bringing positive discrimination in favour of religious minorities. What are your views on that?

I support limited positive discrimination, if disparity is too much and there is no other way.(Which is the case in India)

 

[Dance]

Sorry to disappoint you. But caste system is losing its importance and the people of the oppressed classes are more empowered now.

BTW, what is your opinion about Pakistan's caste system?

What are you talking about?

Pakistan may have the feudal system which is bad but there is no "caste system" in Pakistan.

 

[GUNS-N- ROSES]

What are you talking about?

Pakistan may have the feudal system which is bad but there is no "caste system" in Pakistan.

pakistan doesnt have cast system but surely pakistani society has its own set of divisions. thats same as cast system. shias wont listen to sunnis. sindhis arent comfortable with punjabhis. baluchs are treated with disdain. and muslims who migrated to pak are still called mohahirs.

point is each society has its evils. now they r two ways to go about it. one way is to work towards eradication of that evil. and beleive me on that front we indians are surely (even though slowly) progressing. the other way is to make fun of the society (which most pakistani members do). i do not agree with that idea.

 

[Dance]

pakistan doesnt have cast system but surely pakistani society has its own set of divisions. thats same as cast system. shias wont listen to sunnis. sindhis arent comfortable with punjabhis. baluchs are treated with disdain. and muslims who migrated to pak are still called mohahirs.

point is each society has its evils. now they r two ways to go about it. one way is to work towards eradication of that evil. and beleive me on that front we indians are surely (even though slowly) progressing. the other way is to make fun of the society (which most pakistani members do). i do not agree with that idea.

The caste system can no way be compared to some ethnic divisions or religious divisions that occur in a lot of countries including india. And a lot of what you said is total BS sindhi's and punjabis not getting along, Baloch's treated with disdain

 

[GUNS-N- ROSES]

The caste system can no way be compared to some ethnic divisions or religious divisions that occur in a lot of countries including india. And a lot of what you said is total BS sindhi's and punjabis not getting along, Baloch's treated with disdain

well its ok for me if u disagree. a division is a division, caste or no caste.

 

[jayron]

What are you talking about?

Pakistan may have the feudal system which is bad but there is no "caste system" in Pakistan.

What is your Caste? - Pakistani Caste System
Just as this writer has never met anybody who is looking forward to his next appointment with the dentist, he has also not met anybody who doesn’t go a little pale when an envelope arrives from the income tax department. So when this ominous looking sachet turned up a couple of days ago from the Darakshan police station at this writer’s residence, he was greatly relieved to discover that all that the envelope contained was a printed data collection form which asked a resident to provide basic information about a householder and his family which would help the law enforcement agency to act expeditiously in the event of an emergency.

The police didn’t specify just how details on the form would help the flatfoots nab an intruder. However, though one greatly appreciated the gesture, one couldn’t help being a little irked by the inclusion of a word which had been scribbled in, as if as an afterthought. The word not only stuck out like a sore thumb, but also conveyed the impression that the answer to the query might determine the degree of promptness and alacrity with which the police would tackle a problem should it arise. The word, in case the reader hasn’t guessed it after reading this far, was …caste.

What is quite inexplicable is that the word which ought to have been thrown out in 1947 still appears in government forms and applications. One remembers an incident in a sessions court in the late 1990s, when it made an ignominious verbal appearance, and this writer who had kissed the Blarney Stone in Ireland to acquire the gift of eloquence, was, for the first time in his life, at a loss for words.

He was appearing as a witness in a case where a student, in a fit of unrequited passion, had emptied the chamber of his pistol on the premises of the cultural centre of which the writer was executive director. The day had apparently started rather badly for the lady judge who had a powerful voice which could be heard in the parking lot. She had a cold and her stenographer had not turned up. This meant she had to record details in long hand. This posed something of a problem as the pen, after recording the witness’ name and family details, refused to cooperate. Suddenly, the judge looked up from her desk and fixing this writer with a cold stare said, “caste?”

This was the moment of truth. There was pin drop silence in the hall and one got the impression that all eyes were turned on the witness who felt that if he gave a derisory answer, he might be banished to the salt mines. For a brief second, he contemplated telling the judge that he believed there were no castes in Islam and if she wanted to find out if somebody was a Brahmin, Kshatriya, Vaishya or Shudra, she should cross the eastern border. But as he had only three seconds to come up with an answer, before he was suspected of being an immigrant from the Transvaal, he took a deep breath and said, “Rajput.”

This seemed to satisfy the judge and everybody else in the courtroom who nodded sagely, and it must have satisfied the police. Regrettably, the caste system is alive and kicking in Pakistan.

What is your caste? – The Express Tribune

 

[ps80]

Caste system will never vanish from India because they are born with it.Very unfortunate for them as it is their most fundamental problem.Even the realization of the young generation will not be able to help in future.

Replace "Caste System" with "Shia-Sunni-Ahmadiyya-Ismaili Problem", and "India" with "Pakistan" (Please don't take offense!)

See...both countries have big problems to take care of in the 21st century.

 

[Dance]

Caste_system_among_South_Asian_Muslims

Castes in Pakistan

The social stratification among Muslims in the "Swat" area of North Pakistan has been meaningfully compared to the Caste system in India. The society is rigidly divided into subgroups where each Quom is assigned a profession. Different Quoms are not permitted to intermarry or live in the same community. These Muslims practice a ritual-based system of social stratification. The Quoms who deal with human emissions are ranked the lowest.

Lower castes are often persecuted by the upper castes. A particularly infamous example of such incidents is that of Mukhtaran Mai in Pakistan, a low caste woman who was gang raped by upper caste men.

Stephen M. Lyon of University of Kent has written about what he calls "Gujarism", the act of Gujjars in Pakistan seeking out other Gujjars to form associations, and consolidate ties with them, based strictly on caste affiliation.

Caste system among South Asian Muslims - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lol did you just really compare that with your caste system? And then one of your sources was wikipedia I can also find millions of articles on how the caste system in india is considered a human rights abuse by the UN and all that. Anyways stop going off topic this is about untouchables in india not this "caste system" in Pakistan