India is trying to be Industrial giant with an illiterate, unhealthy labour force !

[Guynextdoor2]

- being an international university it will be not under UGC which is understandable but that is done from very start
- salary for what ? personal benefits


- exactly selection of VC not according to any rule, but from political links

if you can call this a university

then what can be done , because it don't look
rather look like

This is just some building where the first classes are started. And no great university will be formed if the opinions of people like you ad bureaucrats stupidly claiming UGC regulations go about. And yes- if it's money for 'personal benifits' , then that should be given too. What do you think is happening here? Stepehn Hawking will come to Nalanda because of UGC regulations and pay grade? Toni Morrison will teach here for the love of it and has to pay receipts on the government subsidized canteen? Nobel Prize Winning Economists will teach economic classes because UGC has given them a stipend of Rs. 2000 ?
Of course since the BJP has no clue how to do it they'll throw muck at it. The only one who seems to be aligned is Nitish Kumar. It is usually conventional that the Chief minister is a VIce Chancellor/ chancellor but in order to remove political interference he dropped any such demand. And NOT INTERESTED in anything that you want to question Sen on. You don't have it in you to understand what he was doing. All that you can do is take apart a great initiative in the country,

 

[Sage]

Why did you change the title? You thought you will get more traffic if you put words of your choice as title?....

Cool down dude .....I saw it on the social media and it was titled so ....you can see the URL also written as
Where poor are concerned, there is very little change: Amartya Sen
And the article does say the same as well

What he doesn't say that if he has a political agenda or not. It is not wrong to affiliate himself with any political party, what wrong is selectively blaming one party for the misdeeds it is not responsible for. Somebody ask him, why there is malnutrition even after 60 years of Congress rule, and why Modi shouldn't run the industrial drive because of that.

With employment, major segment of the population can afford to have 2 times of nutritious meal.

A bit more explanation would be needed ....But I have an impression that everyone on this forum hates congress ...Too bad I love Priyanka

 

[Chanakya's_Chant]

- being an international university it will be not under UGC which is understandable but that is done from very start
- salary for what ? personal benefits


- exactly selection of VC not according to any rule, but from political links

if you can call this a university

then what can be done , because it don't look
rather look like

This is just some building where the first classes are started. And no great university will be formed if the opinions of people like you ad bureaucrats stupidly claiming UGC regulations go about. And yes- if it's money for 'personal benifits' , then that should be given too. What do you think is happening here? Stepehn Hawking will come to Nalanda because of UGC regulations and pay grade? Toni Morrison will teach here for the love of it and has to pay receipts on the government subsidized canteen? Nobel Prize Winning Economists will teach economic classes because UGC has given them a stipend of Rs. 2000 ?
Of course since the BJP has no clue how to do it they'll throw muck at it. The only one who seems to be aligned is Nitish Kumar. It is usually conventional that the Chief minister is a VIce Chancellor/ chancellor but in order to remove political interference he dropped any such demand. And NOT INTERESTED in anything that you want to question Sen on. You don't have it in you to understand what he was doing. All that you can do is take apart a great initiative in the country,

Man - Nalanda's infrastructure is awful! Chaired by Mr Amartya Sen (2007-2015), Nalanda university had an initial funding of $500 million (> Rs 3000 Crore) and an estimated future funding of $500 million more.

Gross corruption? of course! Audit reports of the CAG highlight -

- defalcation and reckless misuse of funds
- lack of accountability
- criminal breach of trust
- criminal misappropriation of public funds and
- embezzlement of about Rs.3,000 crore of taxpayers’ money.

Dr. Sen is a great economist - I have high regards for him but the way the Nalanda project was handled under his leadership doesn't really reflect the caliber of a Nobel Laureate - He might be clear but rampant corruption was being practiced right under his nose! And then he messed up with Dr. Kalam without any reason - Dr. Kalam would have done much better as its chancellor.

At times after seeing the type of infrastructure Nalanda has - I find it a "disgrace" to our ancestors - an insult to Nalanda's heritage which was once at the pinnacle of higher learning.

This is a sample of the campus that has been built as if resembling a Sulabh (public toilet) complex.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Man - Nalanda's infrastructure is awful! Chaired by Mr Amartya Sen (2007-2015), Nalanda university had an initial funding of $500 million (> Rs 3000 Crore) and an estimated future funding of $500 million more.

Gross corruption? of course! Audit reports of the CAG highlight -

- defalcation and reckless misuse of funds
- lack of accountability
- criminal breach of trust
- criminal misappropriation of public funds and
- embezzlement of about Rs.3,000 crore of taxpayers’ money.

Dr. Sen is a great economist - I have high regards for him but the way the Nalanda project was handled under his leadership doesn't really reflect the caliber of a Nobel Laureate - He might be clear but rampant corruption was being practiced right under his nose! And then he messed up with Dr. Kalam without any reason - Dr. Kalam would have done much better as its chancellor.

At times after seeing the type of infrastructure Nalanda has - I find it a "disgrace" to our ancestors - an insult to Nalanda's heritage which was once at the pinnacle of higher learning.

This is a sample of the campus that has been built as if resembling a Sulabh (public toilet) complex.

Man - Nalanda's infrastructure is awful! Chaired by Mr Amartya Sen (2007-2015), Nalanda university had an initial funding of $500 million (> Rs 3000 Crore) and an estimated future funding of $500 million more.

Gross corruption? of course! Audit reports of the CAG highlight -

- defalcation and reckless misuse of funds
- lack of accountability
- criminal breach of trust
- criminal misappropriation of public funds and
- embezzlement of about Rs.3,000 crore of taxpayers’ money.

Dr. Sen is a great economist - I have high regards for him but the way the Nalanda project was handled under his leadership doesn't really reflect the caliber of a Nobel Laureate - He might be clear but rampant corruption was being practiced right under his nose! And then he messed up with Dr. Kalam without any reason - Dr. Kalam would have done much better as its chancellor.

At times after seeing the type of infrastructure Nalanda has - I find it a "disgrace" to our ancestors - an insult to Nalanda's heritage which was once at the pinnacle of higher learning.

This is a sample of the campus that has been built as if resembling a Sulabh (public toilet) complex.

Man HOW CAN YOU TALK ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE WHEN THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE MAIN BUILDINGS HAS NOT EVEN BEGUN YET??????
This is just some small admin block where 2 courses are being taught for the time being. In this project the tie-ups are more important first. And you can get Nobel Laureates in Hotel Ashok, You do need to take them to 5 star hotels.

 

[Shotgunner51]

Japan, as the example you cited, did not initially concentrate on the masses, but rather on creating an educated elite ruling class that would drag society to industrialization by exploiting Japan's unique cultural emphasis on social harmony and deference to authority, so I am not sure it's the best example for India to follow.

Well spotted, this cultural emphasis is unique to Japan as well as other East Asian countries.

Why not embrace the successful model of China's special economic zones?

I don't think China's model applies here for the fundamentals are very different, say culture, language or political system.

Neither should it be used as benchmark, since China is just another "ordinary developing country", hence India should be more willing to apply model of giants like Russia or US, or UK will be fine. Also, industrialization is not the only way to become "developed country", check Greece.

 

[scorpionx]

Agree to some extent - India’s under-performance can be traced to a failure to learn from the examples of so-called Asian economic development, in which rapid expansion of human capability is both a goal in itself and an integral element in achieving rapid growth. Japan pioneered that approach, starting after the Meiji Restoration in 1868, when it resolved to achieve a fully literate society within a few decades. As Kido Takayoshi, a leader of that reform, explained: “Our people are no different from the Americans or Europeans of today; it is all a matter of education or lack of education.” Through investments in education and health care, Japan simultaneously enhanced living standards and labor productivity — the government collaborating with the market.

Despite the catastrophe of Japan’s war years, the lessons of its development experience remained and were followed, in the postwar period, by South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore and other economies in East Asia. China, which during the Mao era made advances in land reform and basic education and health care, embarked on market reforms in the early 1980s; its huge success changed the shape of the world economy. India has paid inadequate attention to these lessons.

But on the other hand it is noteworthy that Sen advocates the "Kerela Model" of economic development and often criticizes the Gujarat one - He wants the Kerela model to be implemented in India as a whole with proper modifications varying from state to state - Kerela model is a model based on improving health, education and quality of life for people - It fares extremely well in Human Development Index and is classified as a "High HDI" one - Gujarat doesn't even comes close.

BUT the fact that the Kerala model has not brought economic prosperity is in contrast with Gujarat, which has been corporatised in a dazzling manner but has abysmal development indicators.

Education has not brought with it the social enlightenment it should have - such leads were never built upon and converted into opportunities by Kerela. These gains through the Kerela model are increasingly becoming meaningless because they have not been built on. There has been no value addition.

Gujarat might rank low in social indicators but when it comes to Industries and employment - It has much more to offer than Kerela which is well ahead of it in those very same social indicators.

So we have two models to choose from. One, where the investor is wooed and social indices are given short shrift. The other where the investor is frightened off and social indices are commendable. Not much to choose from really, unless the two models are merged to make one glorious blueprint for India.

@scorpionx @Bussard Ramjet @LeveragedBuyout - your views.



Skill development is the key to manufacturing productivity - out of unregistered (or informal) manufacturing and registered manufacturing - the productivity and dynamism of the former is considerably less. Thus, only skills led manufacturing is capable of being transformative.

Well said. Rather than seeing it as a much polarized debate between a growth and private entrepreneurship driven development model and a redistribution and state driven development model (which will not lead us to anywhere) I would like to focus on the basic advantages of putting stress on basic education that Sen had explained in much details in his Uncertain Glory ( I am sure you have read it). Sen's primary argument has been, since the first five year planning in the 50's, primary education in India, unlike China, Japan or Korea is an agonizingly neglected sector. This, as he has argued is the primary reason that led India failing miserably in other social indicators, as well as in economic growth. The merits of education based development (not as attractive as rate of change figures) are as follows,

1. Capability to read and write improves our quality of life. An informed life has better and more opportunities to communicate with others in this modern world than an illiterate one.

2. Economic and employment opportunities largely depend on educational achievement. A skilled educated workforce, in this globalized trade and commerce helps in quality control in and large scale production of goods.

3. Illiteracy muffles the political voice of the people. Inability to read newspapers, periodicals may well contribute in depriving them off their democratic, human or legal rights.

4. General health education in primary schools can have bigger impact than specialized health education. Kerala is a astonishing example where consistent endeavor for basic education has led to achieve excellent records in improving public health.It is interesting to note that extensive schooling of women can bring important changes such as reducing fertility rate, infant mortality rate etc.

This is why Sen advocates having a skilled, qualified workforce by which India can exploit the opportunities of Industrial development in a much better manner (Just like Japan as you said in your post). For him, a growth driven development model perhaps crippled with the obvious fact that despite having an enviable growth record since the 90's, a bulk of Indians are still malnourished, without basic health care, sanitation and drinking water. If we had worked more for the betterment of these poor people since independence, the economic growth could have been exploited by us in a much more efficient way.

 

[Nicky G]

The likes of Sen would be most disappointed with India's development.

Anyway, he should take his laughable thesis to the companies setting up shop here.

 

[Echo_419]

- being an international university it will be not under UGC which is understandable but that is done from very start
- salary for what ? personal benefits


- exactly selection of VC not according to any rule, but from political links

if you can call this a university

then what can be done , because it don't look
rather look like

Any idea when a real campus will be built which do some justice to the name
& @Guynextdoor2 congrats on the elite status bro

Well spotted, this cultural emphasis is unique to Japan as well as other East Asian countries.



I don't think China's model applies here for the fundamentals are very different, say culture, language or political system.

Neither should it be used as benchmark, since China is just another "ordinary developing country", hence India should be more willing to apply model of giants like Russia or US, or UK will be fine. Also, industrialization is not the only way to become "developed country", check Greece.

I agree India is to diverse to copy cat other nations model we need our own model to achieve the developed status & no respectable country would follow the Greek model

Man HOW CAN YOU TALK ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE WHEN THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE MAIN BUILDINGS HAS NOT EVEN BEGUN YET??????
This is just some small admin block where 2 courses are being taught for the time being. In this project the tie-ups are more important first. And you can get Nobel Laureates in Hotel Ashok, You do need to take them to 5 star hotels.

7 saal hogaye aur abhi bhi construction start nahi hua
Do tell why?

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Any idea when a real campus will be built which do some justice to the name
& @Guynextdoor2 congrats on the elite status bro



I agree India is to diverse to copy cat other nations model we need our own model to achieve the developed status & no respectable country would follow the Greek model



7 saal hogaye aur abhi bhi construction start nahi hua
Do tell why?

That's the case with most really major institutes. And this one is gonna be even longer. Go to IIM trichy, they don't have a campus yet ad have started classes. This one, Sen got many governments of foreign countries (especially Budhist ones) so that they all put in money. Korea, Japan, Thailand, Lanka....to them Nalanda is more than just 'patna university'. They see it as the revival of the old status that this place had in their history. Now you want wreck that all because Sen doesn't like Modi? Keep going on like this and all those governments will pull back.

 

[magudi]

7 saal hogaye aur abhi bhi construction start nahi hua
Do tell why?

Bhai mere he won't tell you but i'll tell you why

https://twitter.com/x/status/618507301276614656

 

[Echo_419]

Bhai mere he won't tell you but i'll tell you why

https://twitter.com/x/status/618507301276614656

Bhai @Guynextdoor2 iska jawaab hai

 

[magudi]

Bhai @Guynextdoor2 iska jawaab hai

Also bhai just so you know how sinister this world works

here is an article from economist before our general elections :

Can anyone stop Narendra Modi?He will probably become India’s next prime minister. That does not mean he should be

What's its relevance here ? Well one of the main stakeholder's of The Economist is Rothschild - Sen's second wife

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Bhai @Guynextdoor2 iska jawaab hai

So? Does anyone ever mention that most of these meetings are done great academmics proposed for Nobel Prize and Ministers of countries? And you expect any of these groups to come together 'fast'? 'He is spending money on 5 star hotels'. What do you think- he'll host them in Dasaprakash hotel and buy them tea at the local darshini?

Also bhai just so you know how sinister this world works

here is an article from economist before our general elections :

Can anyone stop Narendra Modi?He will probably become India’s next prime minister. That does not mean he should be

What's its relevance here ? Well one of the main stakeholder's of The Economist is Rothschild - Sen's second wife

Yeah, this is one year AFTER the elections and 3 weeks ago NDTV ran a debate 'is NDA going the UPA 2 way?'

 

[magudi]

Yeah, this is one year AFTER the elections and 3 weeks ago NDTV ran a debate 'is NDA going the UPA 2 way?'

Yaar tu hamesha mujhe quote krta h.

Live and let live . Peace !

 

[LeveragedBuyout]

I don't think China's model applies here for the fundamentals are very different, say culture, language or political system.

Neither should it be used as benchmark, since China is just another "ordinary developing country", hence India should be more willing to apply model of giants like Russia or US, or UK will be fine. Also, industrialization is not the only way to become "developed country", check Greece.

I suspect your comment is sarcastic, but I'll reply as if it were not. All developed countries have more developed and less developed regions, from the American coasts, to the European blue banana, to China's coastal areas. Indeed, China's model of development is quite normal and repeatable (as it was done before China and will continue to be pursued by others after China's development).

India's main problem is that it is not a unified economic bloc (at least, not until GST reform happens), so setting up special economic zones and favoring states that are willing to play ball actually seems especially appropriate for India. Jumping directly into competition with the developed countries will not work, because the knowledge base is too undeveloped, the talent pool is too small, and the culture and processes necessary to emphasize high quality products are not in place.