India is a Hindu nation, says RSS Chief Mohan Bhagwat

[INDIC]

If it was infused into Hindu scriptures then it comes from Hinduism genius

That does not mean Rig Veda is a book on mathematics .....it just means that further expansion of that particular field of mathematics took place from there.

BTW what other ancient literature has got lost due to their non association with religion ?

It only mean genius that ancient Indians recorded their religious and non-religious knowledge in a common books.

 

[possumlot]

It only mean genius that ancient Indians recorded their religious and non-religious knowledge in a common books.

Why ? shortage of paper ?

 

[Indrani]

In our culture Sis-in-laws are looked at like Sisters who are either Older/Younger and deserving of respect and care.

Daughter-in-laws are looked at like daughters of the house. However I don't understand how this attitude makes us any more or less 'Hindu' if that's what you're driving at.

I have Middle-Eastern friends who treat them exactly like this. SO....



Didi the word is 'Pwned'. there is no 'a' in it. 'Pawned' has entirely another meaning.

Nah that was not Arab culture or Islamic culture as seen by the wedding of the prophet to his "supposed" daughter-in-law. That also is the reason why women in Arab households observe purdah from their own relatives because this attitude of being considered a sister or a daughter when not related by blood was just not there. Of course nowadays lot of middle Easterners could treat them or consider them as such because Indian influences have taken a deep hold in many places.

I know the older meaning of pawn is different than what I wrote, but this is the newer additional meaning of pawned and it was appropriate.

Pawned
Many people attack "pawned" as a misspelling of "pwned", but it has, in fact, become an acceptable spelling. The original origin of the word "pwn" was a typo, probably from a high-speed chat, of the word "own". Think how "the" is now "teh" in traditional l337 internet slang. In any case, looking at the origins of the word "own," one could deduce that it implies some dominance over something or someone. When "own" and "owned" became "pwn", "pwned" and "pwnage", the words came to mean the same thing; dominance and superiority. The new word "pawn" is very simmilar in the sense; its plain definition is to belittle or reduce someone or something to pawn status, essentially, "owning" them.
1. I pawned you! All your bases now belong to us!
2. Drake pawned Dopple in Warcraft III. You cannot stop the Orcish Hordes!

Urban Dictionary: Pawned

 

[Bilal9]

Why ? shortage of paper ?

I think it was more of the fact that very few people (munis) actually knew how to read, much less write. Paper was rare. most ancient texts were written on shila-lipi (stoneplates) or later, flattened palm-fronds (tal potro). Of course I'm talking about my area's language (Sanskrit and Pali).

 

[possumlot]

I think it was more of the fact that very few people (munis) actually knew how to read, much less write. Paper was rare. most ancient texts were written on shila-lipi (stoneplates) or later, flattened palm-fronds (tal potro). Of course I'm talking about my area's language (Sanskrit and Pali).

The whole reasoning is faulty.

The fact is Veda's is a book of knowledge. Veda's literally means knowledge.

It contained ALL kinds of knowledge, including knowledge about the universe and god.

However like everything in India, Hinduism too finds its origins in the Vedas. Most people are just too prejudiced to get this simple fact.

BTW the Veda's were learnt and taught by rote learning 1000's of years before they were written down. Very few people mastered ALL the Vedas. Most just learnt one, or two or three.

Its a bit like getting your bachelors, masters, phd etc.. in ancient times.

 

[scorpionx]

You and logic do not go together. Your extreme discomfort with Hinduism and its history or its accomplishments is the root of your bigotry against Hindus and Hinduism. Your aim of life is to serve as a minion of Islam and see to it that under no circumstance is Hinduism to be apportioned anything that is not due in equal measure to Islam. So all your life you spend attacking, maligning, or sabotaging Hinduism or its followers.

I can not help much if you suffer so much from comprehension issues. No body is maligning Hinduism here. When someone says laws, science, art etc everything have their roots in religion. I just do not agree with it. I do not become a minion of Islam or a Hinduism hater when I believe in that. For example, when I am told that mathematics has it's roots in religion, sorry I do not agree with it just because chandas follow a certain sets of mathematical model. In my view, every form of music follows a mathematical model and it has to follow the rules strictly. It has nothing to do with religion, neither it means that mathematics has its roots in religion. Given that, when I do not believe in such weird logic I do not become a minion of Islam or an abuser of Hindu religion. It is only your sense of sheer superiority feeling over religion (which is not reasonable at all) makes everybody who disagrees a communist, anti-Indian and secular.

 

[Indrani]

I can not help much if you suffer so much from comprehension issues. No body is maligning Hinduism here. When someone says laws, science, art etc everything have their roots in religion. I just do not agree with it. I do not become a minion of Islam or a Hinduism hater when I believe in that. For example, when I am told that mathematics has it's roots in religion, sorry I do not agree with it just because chandas follow a certain sets of mathematical model. In my view, every form of music follows a mathematical model and it has to follow the rules strictly. It has nothing to do with religion, neither it means that mathematics has its roots in religion. Given that, when I do not believe in such weird logic I do not become a minion of Islam or an abuser of Hindu religion. It is only your sense of sheer superiority feeling over religion (which is not reasonable at all) makes everybody who disagrees a communist, anti-Indian and secular.

Because Hinduism was not religion in the first place. The word Hindu does not exist in the entire corpus of Hindu literature. The "ism" applied here was to the practices of the ancient people of this country with its varied and often contradicting belief systems. Maths exists independent of religion, but it was the followers of this "religion" in the course of living their religious life that discovered these mathematical models. Just like they did with art, culture, spiritual sciences, yoga etc. All of them when are associated with Hinduism, why should maths be different.

The other day I was arguing about the bloodied history of Islam in India and immediately you came up with Ashoka's battle implying that we were barbarians long before Islam came to the continent. That and many such examples can be given when you rush to snatch away any and every positives attached with Hinduism in your service and protection of Islam. Couple that with your often brandishing of Sachar committee report which was a malicious device invented by UPA in the pursuit of vote bank politics and propagating the victimhood psyche of the Muslims of India so that they can position themselves as the saviors of Muslims from the evil Hindu. Again and again, your role as the minion of Islam can only escape the blind. I do not have any sense of superiority because I understand that given the length of time Hinduism had over every other religion in this world, it is but obvious it would have had a lead at least in a few areas of knowledge. This same "sheer superiority over religion" I am more than willing to share with all the Dharmic faiths given their more or less same timeline and intersecting history , which makes me anything but a supremacist or exclusivist.

 

[possumlot]

I can not help much if you suffer so much from comprehension issues. No body is maligning Hinduism here. When someone says laws, science, art etc everything have their roots in religion. I just do not agree with it. I do not become a minion of Islam or a Hinduism hater when I believe in that. For example, when I am told that mathematics has it's roots in religion, sorry I do not agree with it just because chandas follow a certain sets of mathematical model. In my view, every form of music follows a mathematical model and it has to follow the rules strictly. It has nothing to do with religion, neither it means that mathematics has its roots in religion. Given that, when I do not believe in such weird logic I do not become a minion of Islam or an abuser of Hindu religion. It is only your sense of sheer superiority feeling over religion (which is not reasonable at all) makes everybody who disagrees a communist, anti-Indian and secular.

Your logic is again faulty. (as usual I may add)

Gayatri mantra was designed to follow a specific chandas which is mathematical progression. It was so by design, not by accident.

Music like EVERYTHING ELSE in this universe CAN be represented mathematically but music itself is not designed mathematically. Music does not follow ANY mathematical rules.

 

[scorpionx]

Because Hinduism was not religion in the first place. The word Hindu does not exist in the entire corpus of Hindu literature. The "ism" applied here was to the practices of the ancient people of this country with its varied and often contradicting belief systems. Maths exists independent of religion, but it was the followers of this "religion" in the course of living their religious life that discovered these mathematical models. Just like they did with art, culture, spiritual sciences, yoga etc. All of them when are associated with Hinduism, why should maths be different.

If practitioners of mathematics, law or astrology follows a certain "religion", it does not mean these have their roots in religion. Way of life can influence the mathematical model of music but by any means it proves that mathematics originates from religion. Beethoven's mathematical model too produced some of the best forms of music but that does not mean that particular model has its root in Christianity.

The other day I was arguing about the bloodied history of Islam in India and immediately you came up with Ashoka's battle implying that we were barbarians long before Islam came to the continent. That and many such examples can be given when you rush to snatch away any and every positives attached with Hinduism in your service and protection of Islam.

Only reference of Ashoka came when you claimed that mass atrocity of civilians lives and property did not exist before the Islamic invasion before 8th Century. I said it was not an unprecedented phenomenon. There is simply no proof that ordinary citizens were not enslaved or massacre before Islamic invasion. It does not abuse Hinduism. It is a specific way of thinking that not believing without any proof. By the way, bringing Ashoka is not exactly criticizing Hindu religion because it is believed by a set of scholars that he was converted to Buddhism before the Kalinga war.

Couple that with your often brandishing of Sachar committee report which was a malicious device invented by UPA in the pursuit of vote bank politics and propagating the victimhood psyche of the Muslims of India so that they can position themselves as the saviors of Muslims from the evil Hindu. Again and again, your role as the minion of Islam can only escape the blind.

About Sachar report, you were arguing with the first twenty pages of report where your points were simply accepted by me. Child and infant mortality rate is lower among Muslims and it is explained well in the report. It was your ignorance that you refused to pay attention to the rest 400 pages.

I do not have any sense of superiority because I understand that given the length of time Hinduism had over every other religion in this world, it is but obvious it would have had a lead at least in a few areas of knowledge. This same "sheer superiority over religion" I am more than willing to share with all the Dharmic faiths given their more or less same timeline and intersecting history , which makes me anything but a supremacist or exclusivist.

The superiority about religion comes when you start confusing "ism" with religion just as your friend did in the beginning of his argument. The superiority comes when you start calling others communists and traitors when they do not conform with your methodology of understanding religion or culture. We can debate day and night over this but it leads no where, I am afraid.

Music does not follow ANY mathematical rules.

Ok.

 

[scorpionx]

The point is that the mathematical property of the gayatri mantra was known.

If music does not follow any mathematical rules then which mathematical property you were talking about? I did not understand this point, so please clarify.

 

[possumlot]

If practitioners of mathematics, law or astrology follows a certain "religion", it does not mean these have their roots in religion. Way of life can influence the mathematical model of music but by any means it proves that mathematics originates from religion. Beethoven's mathematical model too produced some of the best forms of music but that does not mean that particular model has its root in Christianity.

A hindu mathematician does not make mathematics hindu any more than newton made gravity christian. Another classic Straw-man from you.

I have given plenty of examples that show the origins of mathematics in Hinduism. The same 'ism' that is also recognised as a religion since the vedas are considered a religious book. Else accept that all of India is Hindu and hinduims is not only a religion and all muslims and xitians in India are also 'hindu'. You cannot have it both ways.

The superiority about religion comes when you start confusing "ism" with religion just as your friend did in the beginning of his argument. The superiority comes when you start calling others communists and traitors when they do not conform with your methodology of understanding religion or culture. We can debate day and night over this but it leads no where, I am afraid.

It is not me claiming the 'ism' is religion its you. The alternative is that all muslims and xtians in India are "Hindus" . Agreed ?

Ok.

Cherry picking.

If music does not follow any mathematical rules then which mathematical property you were talking about? I did not understand this point, so please clarify.

Music is decoded by the human ear which is designed in a specific way. That design can be represented mathematically so naturally our ability to hear sound and decipher music can also be represented mathematically. Which is what designers of music systems, synthesizers and speakers do.

Of course certain predictable rhythms follow a simpler mathematical model. A complex rhythm has no particular model or rule. Fractal mathematics used to predict cloud patters, rains or snow flakes is what is used to understand music. There is nothing simple or elementary about it. It is complex mathematics.

That is the extend of the use of mathematics to understand music.

However the pleasure that is experienced by different people who hear different music cannot be represented mathematically. Which is what an art form like music is all about.

 

[Indrani]

If practitioners of mathematics, law or astrology follows a certain "religion", it does not mean these have their roots in religion. Way of life can influence the mathematical model of music but by any means it proves that mathematics originates from religion. Beethoven's mathematical model too produced some of the best forms of music but that does not mean that particular model has its root in Christianity.

It is not their existence but their "discovery" which has the roots in religion. Beethoven's compositions inspiration was entirely from his cultural background which was European and by extension also Christian, so yes that is why it is called Western Classic as opposed to Indian Classic.

Only reference of Ashoka came when you claimed that mass atrocity of civilians lives and property did not exist before the Islamic invasion before 8th Century. I said it was not an unprecedented phenomenon. There is simply no proof that ordinary citizens were not enslaved or massacre before Islamic invasion. It does not abuse Hinduism. It is a specific way of thinking that not believing without any proof.

There was no precedent of mass atrocity of civilian lives and properties in the Indian history in any of existing Hindu or other dharmic literature about any war, so why would Ashoka be an exception? Your argument is invalid and a dishonest attempt at providing cover for Islam. Yes it is a specific way of thinking and believing the worst possible of Hinduism always but the best about Islam.

About Sachar report, you were arguing with the first twenty pages of report where your points were simply accepted by me. Child and infant mortality rate is lower among Muslims and it is explained well in the report. It was your ignorance that you refused to pay attention to the rest 400 pages.

The very start of Sachar report starts with a distortion of discounting a vast portion of Hindus as non-Hindus and not worthy of any consideration. As if being a SC/ST is deserving of being at the bottom of every social indices. It gets off with comparing the deficiencies of Muslims with the top percentile of the Hindu populace and even there there the difference is not all that huge. There was nothing in the rest 400 pages of the report which is why you could not argue with any points from there. Finally you came down to questioning the survey and researching methodology of CDSC. You sir were the subscriber and endorser of a very corrupt system.

The superiority about religion comes when you start confusing "ism" with religion just as your friend did in the beginning of his argument. The superiority comes when you start calling others communists and traitors when they do not conform with your methodology of understanding religion or culture. We can debate day and night over this but it leads no where, I am afraid.

No the superiority comes when I identify a liar. The superiority comes when I identify a weasel trying to squirm his way out of being caught for the lies he has been propagating over the years. From blaming Hindus for partition of India to calling ancient Hindus barbarians to claiming Muslims are the most marginalized community in India. That is where my sense of superiority comes from. Finally, you were left with calling "patriots" a dirty word. Shows me right when I call you a traitor. After all who will consider patriotism a dirty word but a traitor.

 

[scorpionx]

Music is decoded by the human ear which is designed in a specific way. That design can be represented mathematically so naturally our ability to hear sound and decipher music can also be represented mathematically. Which is what designers of music systems, synthesizers and speakers do.
Of course certain predictable rhythms follow a simpler mathematical model. A complex rhythm has no particular model or rule. Fractal mathematics used to predict cloud patters, rains or snow flakes is what is used to understand music. There is nothing simple or elementary about it. It is complex mathematics.
That is the extend of the use of mathematics to understand music.
However the pleasure that is experienced by different people who hear different music cannot be represented mathematically. Which is what an art form like music is all about.

This is exactly what I said. Only difference is our interpretations. We were not talking about complex rhythms but simple chandas which follows a set of models. This mathematical model has nothing to do with "religion" per se, neither they derive their inspirations from religion. Anyway, this argument has reached its end and I have to leave. So enjoy and GN.

Finally, you were left with calling "patriots" a dirty word. Shows me right when I call you a traitor. After all who will consider patriotism a dirty word but a traitor.

Comprehension issues again. It was said about patriot's forum who displayed the picture of a person they directly or indirectly abused and murdered years back. Indrani, please don't argue just for the sake of arguments. Its boring. Anyway am out.

 

[possumlot]

This is exactly what I said. Only difference is our interpretations. We were not talking about complex rhythms but simple chandas which follows a set of models. This mathematical model has nothing to do with "religion" per se, neither they derive their inspirations from religion. Anyway, this argument has reached its end and I have to leave. So enjoy and GN.

Who is to say the chandas came first or the Gayatri mantra's came first ? The only thing we know is that mathematical progression was used to design chandas and that its mathematical properties were known, defined and explained.

 

[Indrani]

Comprehension issues again. It was said about patriot's forum who displayed the picture of a person they directly or indirectly abused and murdered years back. Indrani, please don't argue just for the sake of arguments. Its boring. Anyway am out.

Oh yeah, why they sent you a memo that they murdered Gandhi? Or you got to view their DNA report claiming them to be direct descendants of Godse? I do not argue for arguments sake but for the sake of exposing liars and commies. Bye bye.