India eyes Malaysian MIG-29s : Alan Warnes

[Vertiti Scrutator]

Chinese premier Xi Jinpeng came, offered 20 billions in investments too.
Did you see any?

Illusion happy Indians.
Lol

Not sure about every single item on the list; but much of it was turned down by India as China wasn't behaving itself!!

China was supposed to lay the high speed railways (several billions in value) but the deal is going completely to Japan now. China has been screaming from the roof tops that they were denied this deal!

 

[Windjammer]

I don't know who Alan Warnes is (it appears he lives in WarnesyWorld); I would bet that most folks in this world haven't heard his name either. But when a statement comes from the 'Prime Minister of Malaysia' (the guy who'll actually make those decisions) then people take it more seriously. Kapisch?

If any of your Pakistani friends had posted the Malaysian Prime Minister's statement (instead of a statement by some obscure guy), everyone would have taken note of it seriously too!!

Alan Warnes is former editor of reputable military aviation magazine AirForces Monthly, and now is the assistant editor as he travels all over the world to cover Airshows, events and exercises. http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/contact-us/

 

[Vertiti Scrutator]

Alan Warnes is former editor of reputable military aviation magazine AirForces Monthly, and now is the assistant editor as he travels all over the world to cover Airshows, events and exercises. http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/contact-us/

Thanks for that info.

 

[kmc_chacko]

Chinese premier Xi Jinpeng came, offered 20 billions in investments too.
Did you see any?

Illusion happy Indians.
Lol

Chinese offered to build Industrial Corridor and Bullet trains but we rejected it and gave it to someone who gave better offer. Then how can you see those Chinese investments ?

 

[ashok321]

Chinese offered to build Industrial Corridor and Bullet trains but we rejected it and gave it to someone who gave better offer. Then how can you see those Chinese investments ?

Only two items in the vast land of India that came into your mind?

Power plants, Sea ports and host other big ticket items?
India's infra requirement is huge. Just now only they signed 2 billion loan with BRICS on which Chinese signature is required as a procedure.
LOL

Where there is a will, there is a way highway.
China does not want to roll out any investment towards India.
You know it too. But to belittle China and gloat over India is all you like to indulge into - sans any sense.

 

[Vertiti Scrutator]

Only two items in the vast land of India that came into your mind?

Power plants, Sea ports and host other big ticket items?
India's infra requirement is huge. Just now only they signed 2 billion loan with BRICS on which Chinese signature is required as a procedure.
LOL

Where there is a will, there is a way highway.
China does not want to roll out any investment towards India.
You know it too. But to belittle China and gloat over India is all you like to indulge into - sans any sense.

Not sure why you think the way you do, but here's my take:
After having spent trillions over the last few decades on its own infrastructure (which was the reason for its huge GDP growth), China now sees stagnation - nothing much left inside the country to do. It has actually overbuilt!!
China is desperately looking to build (any crap shit) outside the country if it can get paid. That's the reason, you see CPEC in Pakistan, projects in Sri Lanka and several other African countries. It needs an outlet for its goods (not just consumer goods, but infrastructure goods) and employment for millions of low-skilled Chinese workers.
So, China is not really backing off! India offered several projects (and also the huge trade advantage) to China in order to appease it and keep peace. But to tame China's aggressive swagger, India can play hard ball too!

 

[ziaulislam]

No. I was pointing out the illogicality of the proposal

well, looking at the pace of acquisitions, every body will agree that india is losing more aircrafts that gaining, correct
so
either india needs to increase it pace (atleast 50 planes/year are needed to get gap closed till 2027)
india needs to complete 150 LCA & 10 New gen single jet engine to get it numbers right for 42 sq
even this would not be enough to counter china alone
or
buy used/new Mirages and mig29s

he had close relations with malaysians.
He may be right. if right than good quick choice to complete 42 squadran strength.

This news does not make sense. Malaysia had openly planned replacement just few weeks ago. would take place by 2020. while india is planning to get rid of mig 29 by 2024.
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/17...nly_Competitors_In_Malaysian_MRCA_Competition
Dassault Rafale, Eurofighter Typhoon Only Competitors In Malaysian MRCA Competition
Our Bureau
11:40 AM, October 24, 2016
8244 views
1 comments

Eurofighter Typhoon and Dassault Rafale fighters
the Edge markets last week.

Therefore, at the moment, there is no particular budget allocated for the new aircraft, he added.

In a press conference at the Parliament lobby today, Hishammuddin explained that the choice of vendor for this procurement will depend on the affordability of the package offered, and the technical suitability.

Hishammuddin also said the RMAF itself will also make a decision as to which new aircraft it wants.

“The technical side of it...the compatibility of the Rafale or the Typhoon...let the end-users decide. Let the air force decide which model they want. The affordability issue is for the MoF (Ministry of Finance) to decide, and then [there is the issue of] the offset agreement [by the vendor]. What does the industry get from such a major contract?” he said.

Hishammuddin said that while the MiG-29s are ageing, it is important for RMAF to upgrade and maintain its current fleet in order to remain operational until 2020.

india cant/ is struggling replace its mig 21 by 2024 and you are talking about mig 29

there is difference between wishful thinking and practicality
whats new coming till 2024?
36 rafale
15 LCA/ year from 2018-19= 60-80
=~ 100-120

but india will be looking at retiring all mig 27 and mig 21 that are well pass its due date(~ 150+)

new gen single fighters will take years (it took 14 year+ counting for Rafale)
even if its off the shelf solution it would take atleast 3-4 years to get the first one, if it is make in india , it will take atleast 10 years to get the first jet

 

[StraightShooter]

well, looking at the pace of acquisitions, every body will agree that india is losing more aircrafts that gaining, correct
so
either india needs to increase it pace (atleast 50 planes/year are needed to get gap closed till 2027)
india needs to complete 150 LCA & 10 New gen single jet engine to get it numbers right for 42 sq
even this would not be enough to counter china alone
or
buy used/new Mirages and mig29s


india cant/ is struggling replace its mig 21 by 2024 and you are talking about mig 29

there is difference between wishful thinking and practicality
whats new coming till 2024?
36 rafale
15 LCA/ year from 2018-19= 60-80
=~ 100-120

but india will be looking at retiring all mig 27 and mig 21 that are well pass its due date(~ 150+)

new gen single fighters will take years (it took 14 year+ counting for Rafale)
even if its off the shelf solution it would take atleast 3-4 years to get the first one, if it is make in india , it will take atleast 10 years to get the first jet

Producing such high number of LCAs is impossible. For one it has not even attained FOC.

FGFA is on its dead bed and is going the way of MTA project

AMCA is a paper plane

The only option for India is to acquire used MIG-29s and used Mirage-2000s as IAF pilots are already trained on both of these platforms.

 

[ziaulislam]

Producing such high number of LCAs is impossible. For one it has not even attained FOC.

FGFA is on its dead bed and is going the way of MTA project

AMCA is a paper plane

The only option for India is to acquire used MIG-29s and used Mirage-2000s as IAF pilots are already trained on both of these platforms.

these were best case figures, in my opinion it wouldn't be possible to get 15/year no. before 2022, it takes a couple of years to get the numbers increased, look at thunder or f-35, moving to serial production isnt apiece of cake

the only option india had was to get 120 rafale and they screwed that up for what ever reason, now i thinnk they should increase their MKIs and get some stop gaps mig29s/mig35s and focus on LCA

instead they are again shuffling through now a single jet competition

this mind set shows that india is not interested to protect its interest against china, its just looking at pakistan

 

[StraightShooter]

these were best case figures, in my opinion it wouldn't be possible to get 15/year no. before 2022, it takes a couple of years to get the numbers increased, look at thunder or f-35, moving to serial production isnt apiece of cake

the only option india had was to get 120 rafale and they screwed that up for what ever reason, now i thinnk they should increase their MKIs and get some stop gaps mig29s/mig35s and focus on LCA

instead they are again shuffling through now a single jet competition

this mind set shows that india is not interested to protect its interest against china, its just looking at pakistan

RAFALEs are not cheap and 126 RAFALEs is never going to happen. Even for 36 it took years.

The fact is India cannot counter China.

Chinese indigenous defense Industry has grown exponentially and is churning out defense equipment like toys.

India can no longer buy and counter Chinese as China would always have numbers on their side.

 

[ziaulislam]

RAFALEs are not cheap and 126 RAFALEs is never going to happen. Even for 36 it took years.

The fact is India cannot counter China.

Chinese indigenous defense Industry has grown exponentially and is churning out defense equipment like toys.

India can no longer buy and counter Chinese as China would always have numbers on their side.

so than why run a tender for 136, are you saying they didnt know about the price, and trolled IAF!!!?

 

[StraightShooter]

so than why run a tender for 136, are you saying they didnt know about the price, and trolled IAF!!!?

The down selecting of RAFALE and EURO Fighter was based on technical evaluation.

RAFALE was lower of the two but it did not mean it was affordable.

India was initially planning the deal to be less than 10 Billion but it turned out be more than double the expected price.

 

[Roybot]

Can always use these Malaysian migs for spare parts, there are only 12 of them, shouldn't cost much.

 

[ziaulislam]

The down selecting of RAFALE and EURO Fighter was based on technical evaluation.

RAFALE was lower of the two but it did not mean it was affordable.

India was initially planning the deal to be less than 10 Billion but it turned out be more than double the expected price.

so basically it like me running around for 10 years to look a beautiful car select a lamborghini and fining out that It cost higher than my pay
In all tenders, cost is the first thing that dictates which systems will be selected

 

[StraightShooter]

so basically it like me running around for 10 years to look a beautiful car select a lamborghini and fining out that It cost higher than my pay
In all tenders, cost is the first thing that dictates which systems will be selected