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India basks in a nuclear afterglow

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Originally posted by SATAN+Mar 20 2006, 05:21 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SATAN &#064; Mar 20 2006, 05:21 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Iran can always use the argument, if a country like india can get Nukes, then surely Iran has a right to produce nukes for self defense. Iran signed the NPT and the CTBT....india has not &#33;&#33;&#33;
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:lol: Signing NPT and CTBT effectively puts a cap on your nuclear ambitions&#33; How could you even state that as an argument or justification?


<!--QuoteBegin-SATAN
@Mar 20 2006, 05:21 AM
Plus, Iran faces a Nuclear Threat from Israel. Also now with US forces in Iraq, Afghanistan and the Persian gulf...Iran is surrounded.
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Well IIRC Israel wasn&#39;t the one that was threatening to wipe Iran off the map.Its the other way round. And the US already has enough problems to take care of in Iraq, why would they add Iran to those list of problems?
 
Surely Iran has a right to produce nukes for self defense.
Iran signed the NPT and the CTBT

Boss, Iran has no rights to produce nukes BECAUSE they signed the NPT.
 
Originally posted by Sid@Mar 17 2006, 11:51 PM
And that would be the last nail in NPT&#39;s coffin&#33; It has already been undermined by this &#39;special&#39; arrangement between US and India. Now, the US loses even the moral right to criticize China for sharing nuclear tech with Pakistan, for example. Now anyone can use US&#39; logic to share nuclear tech and so NPT becomes useless.
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moral right, there is nothing as such in int&#39;l politics.
Chians relationship ios clandestine,US relationship is over the table and its after US got India to open up its civilian reactor for inspection.

The nail on the NPT&#39;s coffin was nailed the day India,Pkaistan and Israel opted out of it.Its discriminatory in nature and we dotn have to accept anything which is in that way.
 
Originally posted by Sid+Mar 18 2006, 09:00 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sid &#064; Mar 18 2006, 09:00 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Ofcourse the US is not teaching India to make a bomb or anything, it is more complicated than that. More fuel in the form of civilian help could easily be hoodwinked and directed towards military uses; as was done in the case of CIRUS.[/b]


Cirius era is over,at that time none of Indias reactors was under IAEA inspections,but now they will be and hence we wont be able to divert any fuels to our militray reactors.
Now if u say,still we will be able to,then i shall take it as a compliment.

<!--QuoteBegin-Sid
@Mar 18 2006, 09:00 PM
Prashant: So if all nations start only &#39;technically&#39; behaving like a treaty says, I guess there&#39;s no need to ratify them. That is just playing with words. You are either part of NPT or you are not. This is one of the main reasons Australia has so far refused to export uranium to India (which it does to China because China is an NPT member). I hope Canada also rejects any n-cooperation until India ratifies NPT. It has already had a bad experience with the CIRUS reactor.
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Exactly the point, we are not a part of NPT and so we havent violated any rules,as of Australias decison they are a soverign nation and shall take decision which suits them.But we are getting more fuel from Russia.
 
Sure Iran signed the NPT, it was a different world then. It can always argue that the NPT needs to be changed , since the US is changing its laws to accomodate india. And it can also cite the Pre-Emptive strike doctrine created by our Donny Rummsfeld. :thumbsup:

Lastly , iran can leave the NPT and explode a nuke and say that is feels threatend by india and Israel. Its the age of Nuclear Hypocracy, why hold back?
 
Originally posted by SATAN@Mar 19 2006, 09:56 AM
Well, what i meant by india being a (Nuclear Terrorist) was not that its a terrorist state by exploding nukes and holding the world hostage.......But simply that it destroyed the NPT by exploding a Bomb in 1974...and then again in 1998, thus distrupting the world nuclear order on both occasions.

Now its a given that india needs energy to fuel its economy and needs to import nuclear fuel and technology from NSG countries. That being said..india also wants to fullfill its dream of becoming a world power by finally mating Hydrogen Bombs on ICBMS. India does not have the technology to make Fusion (Hydrogen) bombs. Therefore with this deal...india gets all the latest technology to produce bigger and better Nukes, gets the tech to make Nuclear Submarines and of course buy civilian nuclear reactors from Russia, France and USA.

The interesting part is, that it gets to keep its weapons facilities and "civilian" program seperate thus according it the status of a De-Facto Nuclear weapons state.... all for the sake of pumping india up as a counter weight to China&#33;
[post=7283]Quoted post[/post]​

have you ever thought why India gets away wioth all these things,while similar decisons by other countires would have been met more severly by the world.

have you ever thought why???
 
Lastly , iran can leave the NPT and explode a nuke and say that is feels threatend by india and Israel. Its the age of Nuclear Hypocracy, why hold back?

Which my friend would reinforce the American assertion that Iran behaves like a rogue state - thanks to those statements emanating from their "eminent" people(You know who&#33;)
 
Originally posted by A.Rahman@Mar 19 2006, 08:35 PM
Why cant US do same for Iran?
[post=7315]Quoted post[/post]​


and then what to wipe out israel.

Dont compare a country run by a pshyco to India.
 
Originally posted by Neo@Mar 19 2006, 09:34 PM
Exactly&#33;
US not only pressurised China but also Canada and France to abandon and embargoe Pakistani nuke programme since 1977as Pakistan refused to sign NPT.

Its yet another fine example of US&#39; double standard foreign policy.
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India has emerged as a leading economy of a 1 Bn market,where US and other countries can find enough market to make then viable.

What US is doing is to make life for US corporates better.Compared to Indiaand opakistan where wud US corporates be more interested in?So with whom wud they like to have better relationship.

And also who knows there might be more AQ khans in the N establishment in pakistan who might act &#39;independantly&#39; to sell N secrets to rogue nations.
 
Originally posted by Prashant@Mar 20 2006, 02:45 AM
and then what to wipe out israel.

Dont compare a country run by a pshyco to India.
[post=7382]Quoted post[/post]​

no offence India also had its share of "physco" people. Does BJP rings a bell?

Irani president says it plain and clear, thats what I like about him, he dosnt plays dirty politics game, and dosnt masks his real intention under a false adgenda. What he think says it straight forward. no second thoughts.

But you cant expect Irani prez to launch a nuke, unless he wnats his country to turn into nuclear testing area.
 
Originally posted by SATAN+Mar 20 2006, 01:11 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SATAN &#064; Mar 20 2006, 01:11 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Sure Iran signed the NPT, it was a different world then. It can always argue that the NPT needs to be changed , since the US is changing its laws to accomodate india. And it can also cite the Pre-Emptive strike doctrine created by our Donny Rummsfeld. :thumbsup:
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That will be a valid arguement.

<!--QuoteBegin-SATAN
@Mar 20 2006, 01:11 PM
Lastly , iran can leave the NPT and explode a nuke and say that is feels threatend by india and Israel. Its the age of Nuclear Hypocracy, why hold back?
[post=7379]Quoted post[/post]​
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And that will spoil everything for Iran. Israel doesnt have anymore territorial ambitions and India doesnt have any issues with Iran(why would India threaten Iran in first place?). So not much of an excuse to explode a nuke.
 
Originally posted by A.Rahman+Mar 20 2006, 01:29 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(A.Rahman &#064; Mar 20 2006, 01:29 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>no offence
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None taken. :)

Originally posted by A.Rahman@Mar 20 2006, 01:29 PM
India also had its share of "physco" people. Does BJP rings a bell?
BJP for all its right wing rhetorics, did a compete U-turn after it tasted the burden of ruling a vast country like India. They had to scale down their Hindutva chants and become more sober. You would&#39;ve noticed the complete change of attitude in Advani when he visited Pakistan a few months back. They were very diplomatic and cautious when it came to "foreign affairs".
On the other hand Ahmedijinad did more damage to his country&#39;s reputation than the damage Americans themselves could&#39;ve dreamed to inflict upon Iran.

Originally posted by A.Rahman@Mar 20 2006, 01:29 PM
Irani president says it plain and clear, thats what I like about him, he dosnt plays dirty politics game, and dosnt masks his real intention under a false adgenda. What he think says it straight forward. no second thoughts.
Things dont work that way in International diplomacy&#33;. You are only helping your enemy achieve his goals faster by losing your cool.

<!--QuoteBegin-A.Rahman
@Mar 20 2006, 01:29 PM
But you cant expect Irani prez to launch a nuke, unless he wnats his country to turn into nuclear testing area.
[post=7389]Quoted post[/post]​
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And how do you know what he thinks? People judge you by what you say. The Iranian president, more than once, made clear of his intentions to wipe Israel off the map.
 
Originally posted by A.Rahman@Mar 20 2006, 11:59 AM
no offence India also had its share of "physco" people. Does BJP rings a bell?

Irani president says it plain and clear, thats what I like about him, he dosnt plays dirty politics game, and dosnt masks his real intention under a false adgenda. What he think says it straight forward. no second thoughts.

But you cant expect Irani prez to launch a nuke, unless he wnats his country to turn into nuclear testing area.
[post=7389]Quoted post[/post]​

BJP what did BJp do on the intl scenario that was dumb,they dint eveb cross the LOC during kargil war and showed restrain.

Iran president doesnt play political hame,are u sure.have u seen the video in which he says to the group of mullahs that a divine light surrounded him while addressing the UN council in NY.He is moron who doesnthknow how to play the cards a country which is so rich in gas/oil is going thru such tensions which they shud never.
they shud have used it for betteirng the life of iraniasn than spreading hatred vbased on jingoism
 
I just came across an interesting article in www.Dailytimes.com.
Enjoy.
The president of the United States, George Bush, is singing sweet songs for them, Condoleezza Rice took some pain to pen an article in The Washington Post justifying the decision of her country to supply India with advanced nuclear technology that would help reduce "India&#8217;s annual carbon dioxide emission by more than 170 million tons."

The Secretary of State also advocated that selling advanced nuclear technology would mean opening the doors for American jobs. "Thousands of Americans will benefit from the deal," wrote Rice. She also tried to convince American law-makers that, "A thriving, democratic India will be a pillar of Asia&#8217;s progress, shaping its development for decades."

On the other hand, reports have confirmed that India circumvents other countries&#8217; export controls and leaks sensitive technology in procuring materials for its nuclear programmes.

How will the American administration succeed in amending the laws needed to implement the agreement on transfer of sensitive nuclear technology to India in the presence of a damning report released by respected physicist and former UN weapons inspector, Mr David Albright, who also heads the Washington-based Institute for Science and International Security? Mr Albright has said that his organisation had uncovered a "well developed, active and secret Indian programme" that belied all Indian claims of innocence and demanded a close scrutiny of Indian procurement and export practices before the United States and other countries engaged in nuclear cooperation with India.

This report has established that India even today "procures sensitive materials and technology for its secret gas centrifuge uranium enrichment plant and does not reveal to foreign suppliers that the plant is not subject to international monitoring."

Countries dealing with India were aware of the deceit and deception that was the cornerstone of its foreign policy. However, when Indian deception resulted in the death of American soldiers in Afghanistan, a proper response was expected not in showering of rewards as has happened in this case. Ultimately Bush will have to answer to the American people.

The Indian government has taken the Americans for a ride in Afghanistan and has used the art of deception to take refuge behind them while aiding and assisting acts of terrorism.

For its part, the government of Pakistan provided irrefutable evidence to its "American friends" who according to senior officials were simply "stunned" and have reportedly asked for some time to evaluate the evidence before they try to "rein in" the Indians in Afghanistan.

Pakistani officials are reported to have provided lists of around 80 per cent of people working in the Afghan defence and intelligence agencies who were formerly members of the Northern Alliance, a group that was funded and trained by the Indian agency RAW. A majority remains on the payroll of India even till today.

The Americans were aware of the number of Indian consulates and media centres that were working in Afghanistan. This was expenditure with sinister designs.

The Governor of Nangarhar Hazrat Ali has strong links with the Indians who have rewarded him by renting his house in Jalalabad for their consulate office at an exorbitant rate of &#036;5000 per month when similar accommodation was easily available for less than &#036;500 a month.

At least five training camps for "terrorists," who attack the Americans inside Afghanistan and make hit and run sorties against Pakistani border forces, are managed by Hazrat Ali. A total of 19 terrorist training centres were operative with Indian assistance in Afghanistan.

India has about 2000 commandos in Afghanistan who train Afghans and other foreign terrorists so that they can create trouble in Waziristan and Balochistan. The Indians admit the presence of 800 commandos.

It has also been reported that in one ambush on Pakistani forces in the Mohmand Agency, the directions to terrorists were being given by the staff officer of the Indian Consul General that were intercepted by Pakistani security personnel and have been played before the Americans who have accepted the authenticity of the tape.

Another factor that has created concern is the dropping of boxes containing Pakistani currency in selected areas through helicopters in both the Waziristan area and border areas of Balochistan.

Some of the boxes that were captured by the security agencies of Pakistan have revealed that India and Afghanistan were engaged in large scale counterfeiting of Pakistani currency and this may soon result in a phased replacement of currency notes in this country.

Even a duplicate coin of Rs5 has been detected that was made in Afghanistan with the technical assistance of Indians.

While the Indians try to bleed the economy and army of Pakistan, a frontline state in the war against terror, it is strange that Indians, who profess to be partners in the effort against terrorism, indulge in terrorist activities at such a large scale that it does not require any special wisdom to see through the game the Indians are playing. The whole world was aware of this; only the Americans were looking the other way.

The Bush administration has also ignored investigative articles published in New York Times and Newsweek that have raised fingers at the dubious and deceptive role of the Indian government in the war against terror.

As far as Mr. Hamid Karzai is concerned, he has forgotten the Pakistani hospitality that was enjoyed by him and continues to be a captive to the Northern Alliance which is dancing to the tune of the Indians.

Mr. Karzai, whose writ does not extend beyond Kabul, must remember that his present policy of appeasing the Indians may suit the American occupying forces in Afghanistan. He must remember that the long-term progress of his country depends on good relations with Pakistan.

In case the level of relations with Pakistan remains what it is today, Afghanistan will be the main sufferer at the end of the day when both the Americans and Indians leave it in a lurch.

The policy of the Americans is bound to fail because the Indians will deceive them as well and never confront China, a goal that has been set by American policy-makers under the present US administration. American foreign policy was already in tatters in Europe, Iraq, Afghanistan and will be soon doomed in India.

Finally, it has to be seen how Pakistan responds to the new emerging scene in this region. But before a tit for tat policy takes shape and a useless arms race begins, the Indian government must come clean and try to save the day otherwise things would once again slide which would not auger well for both India and Pakistan. The damage to Afghanistan will be far greater. Here, the Americans must act, but then were the Americans listening in the first place?
 
Originally posted by Hammer@Mar 19 2006, 07:12 PM
The US has always argued that Iran doesn&#39;t need nuclear power since it has abundant Oil reserves and nuclear power is more expensive than oil power. Hence they are suspicious of Iran&#39;s nuke prog.
But all these arguments would&#39;ve meant nothing, had Iran remained a close ally of US.
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Its just another lame excuse Hammer.
Russia holds world largest proven Gas reserves and third largest oil reserves but they are building more reactors.
Every country should have the right to diversify its resourses, including Iran.
 
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