IMF asks govt to reopen CPEC deals

[313ghazi]

Lmao uk rate is 19p and usa rate is 13
5 cent you chat rubbish

Imf will be told to jog on

According to ofcom the average UK rate is 28.34p per kilowatt hour.

What is the average energy bill in Great Britain? – British Gas

Looking for a guide on average energy bills from British Gas? Learn how your utility bills depend on your lifestyle, home size and how many people you live with.

www.britishgas.co.uk

If Pakistani are buying at 30p, it's pretty expensive considering thier income. Surely it's not that high?

 

[doorstar]

According to ofcom the average UK rate is 28.34p per kilowatt hour.

What is the average energy bill in Great Britain? – British Gas

Looking for a guide on average energy bills from British Gas? Learn how your utility bills depend on your lifestyle, home size and how many people you live with.

www.britishgas.co.uk

If Pakistani are buying at 30p, it's pretty expensive considering thier income. Surely it's not that high?

he misunderstood my post then you follow up the same way.

I said when it was costing UK 6 and 9 pence to produce 1 unit, Pakistan was being charged more than 30 cents by the Chinese producers.

NOT TALKING ABOUT THE RETAIL PRICE TO THE CONSUMERS

 

[313ghazi]

Average Electricity Rate in the U.S. is 10.42 cents per kilowatt-hour.
Electricity Rate in the U.K. is between 6 and 9 pence per kilowatt-hour.

Chinese charge Pakistanis 30 cents on average. which is then subsidzed at tax-payer expense, even then people do not pay and prefer to steal it.

High fuel cost in Jan 2022: Power tariff likely to go up by Rs6.1/unit

ISLAMABAD/LAHORE: The costly imported fuel is pushing the government to pass on its full impact to the power consumers. The Central Power Purchasing Agency , on behalf of the power distribution...

www.thenews.com.pk

According to this article the most expensive electricity we generate is 22rs per unit.

Where did you get the 30 cents figure?

he misunderstood my post then you follow up the same way.

I said when UK was paying between 6 and 9 pence to the producers, Pakistani grid was being charged more than 30 cent by the Chinese producers.

NOT TALKING ABOUT THE RETAIL PRICE TO THE CONSUMERS

Can you please share a source. I'm genuinely curious. 30 cents would be very expensive.

 

[Communism]

he misunderstood my post then you follow up the same way.

I said when it was costing UK 6 and 9 pence to produce 1 unit, Pakistan was being charged more than 30 cents by the Chinese producers.

NOT TALKING ABOUT THE RETAIL PRICE TO THE CONSUMERS

I'm guessing you are talking about the massively subsidized non-levelized non-dispatchable wind power that Europe has built, including in the U.K.

There's a reason why that figure is total bullshit and the end consumer un-subsidized price for European electricity is about 30 cents per KwH, and you need to figure out yourself why non-levelized non-dispatchable power is such a bad idea.

There was a reason why the EU was importing cheap Russian natural gas and it was mostly to levelize the extremely badly thought out renewable generation that the EU (and U.K.) have built.

https://www.nuclearny.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Levelized_Cost_of_Energy_LCOE_-_a_Misleading_Measure_of_Value_for_a_Carbon-free_World.pdf

We Should Not Compare Electricity Sources Using Nameplate Ratings

Renewables only “take root” because governments, market operators, utility regulators and misguided Environmental, Social and Governance (ESG) factors – misguided only in that they do not account f…

wattsupwiththat.com

The Paradox of Declining Renewable Costs and Rising Electricity Prices - Kudos to Those Rich Enough to Invest in Solar and Other Types of Alternative Energy - But CONSUMERS Still Drowning in the Cost of Heating and Cooling Their Homes

groups.google.com

The Real Cost of Wind and Solar • Watts Up With That?

Guest Post by Willis Eschenbach I keep reading how wind and solar are finally cheaper than fossil fuels ... and every time I've read it, my urban legend detector rings like crazy. It rings in part because the market is very efficient at replacing energy sources based on their cost. Here, for...

wattsupwiththat.com

LCOE and its Limitations - Energy For Growth

LCOE = {(overnight capital cost * capital recovery factor + fixed O&M cost)/(8760 * capacity factor)}+(fuel cost * heat rate)+(variable O&M cost)[1] What is the Levelized Cost of Electricity? LCOE is the net present value of the unit-cost of electricity over the lifetime of a system. Pros of...

www.energyforgrowth.org

Fun fact, Germany's Wind Power is so badly planned, that they have to export electricity to the rest of the EU sometimes at negative prices so as to not blow out their power system with how intermittent power works.

 

[ARMalik]

Well well... The cats out of the bag....

Regime change.... I guess beggars can't be choosers...

I wonder how China will react... Pull away from the military support and pull the plug on j-10 j-17 .... Perhaps the next conflict with India Pakistan can fight back with sticks and stones....

Well done Bajwa....



What companies... Can you give numbers and references to official reports. PS. DAWN IS NOT A REFERENCE.

I had said in a previous thread that these will probably be the first and last batch of J-10s from China because China will pull away from these Thieves in Pakistan Establishment and Military.

Good!
Chinese are businessmen.
Imf is businessmen.
Chinese IPP’s are sucking our blood with capacity payments.
Imf wants us to renegotiate those deals so we have more money to pay their loans.
Both imf and Chinese don’t care about us more then their interests.
We should learn how to use both of them when we need how we want to, in order to get the most benefit out of both.

So pardon my ignorance but Pakistan wasn't negotiating WRITTEN DEALS it made with China, BUT IMF wants Pakistan to do it. IN WHAT CAPACITY IS IMF ASKING PAKISTAN TO DO THIS??
DOES THIS MEAN THAT CHINA CAN ALSO ASK PAKISTAN TO RENEGOTIATE ITS WRITTEN DEALS WITH IMF AND USA??

 

[ARMalik]

I am amazed that your post is still standing. I have been given these hints for over two years.
All the indications are that Bajwa's intentions are not good. But unfortunately, you cannot call holy cows on some forums.

I had my fair share of bans on this forum for saying such things in the past and for openly criticizing Bajwa and his General. What has now changed is that THE TRUTH IS IN FRONT OF EVERYONE STARRING THEIR EYES, AND MAJORITY OF PEOPLE ARE NOT STUPID ! THEY KNOW EXACTLY WHAT IS GOING ON AND HAVE FINALLY REALIZED THE BITTER TRUTH !

 

[khansaheeb]

I am sure that the Traitor Bajwa will happily OBLIGE. Pakistan - China STRATEGIC RELATIONS ARE DYING BEFORE OUR OWN EYES, THANKS TO THIS TRAITOR.

Not dying but being killed.

Instead of giving relief to their stooges, the Americans are demanding more and more . What a shame for our stupid establishment. Or maybe they already knew and are traitors.

Pakistan is being pushed to the edge and the enemies are wondering why is there not civil war .

 

[Abdul Rehman Majeed]

We all know China doesn't want the west nose in to their business, they don't want to share Cpec deals with IMF etc as its none of IMF and west business.

This will prove once for all the traitors of Pakistan. I dont believe Pakistan will agree but if they do then everyone needs to understand its not about PTI v PDM, its Pakistan v Traitors.

Pakistan renegotiating with China will help Pakistan not IMF or the West.

 

[chinasun]

China and Pakistan respect each other's sovereignty and territorial integrity and are friends forever. These are just small things, trivial.

 

[Enigma SIG]

I don't know why you PTIans blaming them??

Asal game to haramzadey Beghairat Bajwey ne dali hai.

Because Bajwa un ka new Abbu hai!

 

[Deltadart]

Abhi to party shuru houi ha!
Imf, wb, adb and others will come calling on the thugs in power, and their neutered neutral backers to lay down and open wide. Something these people are very used to doing, and this time around, they will oblige willingly as well.
Next stop nukes, followed by total capitulation on all fronts.....
Our future generations will pay for the treachery of the criminal rulers and their backers.

 

[waz]

Looks like the IMF have the balls of the imported trash government.
Wonder what the army leadership does now with the Chinese relationship in the balance.
Yep there is an old saying about making a deal with my the devil.

 

[Catalystic]

IMF “asks??
I think they should’ve “ordered” instead……imported or selected govt it doesn’t matter….

Time for them all to take it up the rear end…..bend over!

 

[ziaulislam]

You are ignoring that this is due to massive underutilization and that the current price paid barely keeps the companies afloat.

You are also forgetting that coal is currently an extremely expensive energy source.

Coal - Price - Chart - Historical Data - News

Coal decreased 6.80 USD/MT or 4.64% since the beginning of 2024, according to trading on a contract for difference (CFD) that tracks the benchmark market for this commodity. Coal - values, historical data, forecasts and news - updated on September of 2024.

tradingeconomics.com

In the U.S. when we are talking about fossil fuel energy sources, it is also very expensive, like the new england area at 20-25 cents per kwh.

The cheapest parts in the U.S. for electricity prices right now are the places with subsidized built renewable as well as moderate pricing for fossil fuel energy sources for places like texas.

You are also listing extremely subsidized U.K. electricity prices.

People need to stop quoting subsidized electricity rates to compare to a non-subsidized ones.

Electric Power Monthly - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

www.eia.gov

I should mention that this is with the U.S. having the cheapest un-subsidized fossil fuel prices in the world, especially for coal and natural gas, which is expensive to transport, and therefore much cheaper in the U.S. than elsewhere.

Even adjusting for all this
PMLM offered 20% RoI instead of average 8-14%

Whats worse it was offered with govt grantee

In other words it was like taking a 20% interest loan

PMLN also built 4 LNG plants taking loan via Punjab power corporation..you dont see alot of people critizing those as we decreased its ROI from 20% to 12%

This isnt CPEC specific
You see power deals from qatar as well

 

[Communism]

Even adjusting for all this
PMLM offered 20% RoI instead of average 8-14%

Whats worse it was offered with govt grantee

In other words it was like taking a 20% interest loan

PMLN also built 4 LNG plants taking loan via Punjab power corporation..you dont see alot of people critizing those as we decreased its ROI from 20% to 12%

This isnt CPEC specific
You see power deals from qatar as well

The very fact that the companies in question are barely breaking even makes it obvious that the terms were very fair.

It seems the companies had the foresight to see that they weren't going to get a viable project at all at any lower rates.

I can see the concern if the companies were making tons of money and rolling in cash, but that simply isn't the case.