What's new

if ?

Blackwater may well be inside Pakistan, there is plenty of evidence to suggest that. The question we should ask ourselves is, do we know what Blackwater/Xe Corp, Dyncorp and whotever else are doing in Pakistan? Do we know why they are here and in what capacity? In fact, do we know absolutely anything about them other than their names and unverifiable stories?

The simple answer is, no. It's all speculation, media hype and whatnot. I am no fan of foreign "soldiers for hire" inside Pakistan, I would want them to leave immediately, but I know absolutely nothing credible about them or why they are here. So for me to go running on the streets shouting "murder", or start thread screaming "I saw them, I saw them", or say things like "they are evil and support evil" is absolutely ridiculous and extremely ignorant.

Think of it this way, if these forces are set to destroy Pakistan, then either the ISI/Army is hand-in-hand with them or they are completely incapable of confronting them. To me, both these possibilities seem completely absurd, as they would to most intelligent people. Moreover, I have never heard the ISPR or the COAS make any comments regarding any international troops inside Pakistan or Blackwater. Hence, without any credible information, I will hesitate to make any judgements. What we should do is ask the ISPR and the government to tell us what they are doing here, as is our right to know. That should be our main concern.

More dangerous than ignorance is limited knowledge. Even more dangerous is limited knowledge spread by word-of-mouth, propaganda and hype; because then it snowballs on itself. Have none of you ever played the game called Chinese Whisper as a kid?
 
Last edited:
Blackwater may well be inside Pakistan, there is plenty of evidence to suggest that. The question we should ask ourselves is, do we know what Blackwater/Xe Corp, Dyncorp and whotever else are doing in Pakistan? Do we know why they are here and in what capacity? In fact, do we know absolutely anything about them other than their names and unverifiable stories?

The simple answer is, no. It's all speculation, media hype and whatnot. I am no fan of foreign "soldiers for hire" inside Pakistan, I would want them to leave immediately, but I know absolutely nothing credible about them or why they are here. So for me to go running on the streets shouting "murder", or start thread screaming "I saw them, I saw them", or say things like "they are evil and support evil" is absolutely ridiculous and extremely ignorant.

Think of it this way, if these forces are set to destroy Pakistan, then either the ISI/Army is hand-in-hand with them or they are completely incapable of confronting them. To me, both these possibilities seem completely absurd, as they would to most intelligent people. Moreover, I have never heard the ISPR or the COAS make any comments regarding any international troops inside Pakistan or Blackwater. Hence, without any credible information, I will hesitate to make any judgements. What we should do is ask the ISPR and the government to tell us what they are doing here, as is our right to know. That should be our main concern.

More dangerous than ignorance is limited knowledge. Even more dangerous is limited knowledge spread by word-of-mouth, propaganda and hype; because then it snowballs on itself. Have none of you ever played the game called Chinese Whisper as a kid?

Well done , think tanker great rosey picture presented :cheers:

US Embassador is playing same role of Viceroys Lord Mountbatten

To get better idea read history how Britisher took control of Indian sub continent and what they did with Pakistan during partition ,still you trust these b****?:coffee:


US Embassador to Pakistan Anne Patterson Blocks Shireen Mazari News Article (Article attached)
Sunday, September 6, 2009



US Ambassador In Pakistan Forces A Newspaper To Censor A Known US Critic

Finally, the Americans take their revenge. Dr. Mazari single-handedly threw cold water on Washington's plan last year to send a rabidly anti-Pakistani US army general as defense attaché to Islamabad. The Pakistani government quietly accepted the appointment. But Dr. Mazari broke the story and aborted the plan. When the new pro-US elected government seized power, Mr. Zardari's special assistant Husain Haqqani's first order of business was to fire Dr. Mazari from her official post. And now the US ambassador succeeds in blocking her column. Welcome to the Banana Republic of Pakistan where soon US ambassadors will have the right appoint presidents and prime ministers. Some say they already do.

This article was supposed to appear today in The News International but did not due to reported pressure from the US Embassy in Islamabad.

Dr. Shireen Mazari has had the honor of being one of the targets of the US Embassy in Islamabad particularly since 2008 when in her columns she broke the news of US Army’s General Hood coming to Pakistan and the 11 conditions that the Pakistani government was quietly planning to accept granting unfettered access in Pakistan for US personnel with no legal restraints.

By Shireen M. Mazari
Wednesday, 2 September 2009.
Current Affairs

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan—While US diplomats target their critics in Pakistan with a new ferocity, the US media and politicians target the Pakistan’s nuclear and military capability.

Taking the latter first, Dr. Khan had barely gained his “freedom” when that murderous former Vice President Dick Cheney, in a pre-taped interview to Fox News (30 August), declared that the Obama Administration should use the CIA to find out what Dr. Khan was up to! Cheney also expressed pride in the Bush Administration’s aggressive use of drones in FATA!

So should we assume that the increased presence of Blackwater and other unidentified US personnel in Islamabad may also have Dr. Khan as a possible target?

Nor was it just Cheney firing off on one of America’s obsessions – Dr. Khan – while quite unconcerned about the massive proliferation that the US continues to Israel (this is all now part of the published and available data in case the US embassy accuses this scribe of falsehood again).

More irritating than disturbing, has been the story in The New York Times (NYT), citing unnamed senior administration and congressional officials (of course when we cite similar sources, US officialdom is not amused), accusing Pakistan of modifying the Harpoon missiles given to the Pakistan navy to enable to hit land-based targets.

Had the NYT bothered to do some basic research they would have realized that Pakistan has no need to modify the old Harpoon missiles when they already have far better land-based missile systems already battle-tested and in their arsenal. As it is, the Harpoon does not have the range that would be required to hit land-based targets.

The question that arises then is why plant this story now – apart from the continuing US effort to undermine the Pakistan’s military capability and keep the military institution under pressure (or so they assume)?

One reason may have to do with putting pressure on the Pakistan Navy to give its go-ahead to the US request, forwarded by Pakistan’s Ministry of Defense to the Naval Chief, to allow them to build a landing strip near Gwadar (their own miniport facility) where US marines can land “some stuff” ostensibly as part of their anti-narcotic activities. So far there has been no response from the Pakistani side. Why they can’t do that at the existing facilities in the area is the question some Pakistanis are asking?

Interestingly, in relation to the Pakistan Navy and the Harpoon issue, there are also unconfirmed but reliable reports that the Special Services Group Navy (SSGN) is constructing operational facilities in Gharo, Sindh (close to the Indus delta, south of Thatta) which are purpose-built to serve as a base for an army unit – comprising halls, residential units and storage facilities. Some years back the Navy had decided to shift the SSGN headquarter (PNS Iqbal) from the dockyard to a coastal area, but Gharo was not the likely sight at the time. Because there has been a sudden increase in assistance to the SSGN from the US, questions are being raised whether this shifting of the SSGN to Gharo is actually a ruse to allow US Marine “trainers” to arrive there in large numbers on the pretext of training the SSGN commandos in newly-acquired weapons and tactics? So, the old carrot and stick approach – assistance and then the ridiculous Harpoon story – continues to be at work. What is disturbing here is that perhaps this whole Gharo “deal” is being done at a micro tactical level with the overall military high command not totally in the know. Certainly, it merits a closer examination by the military leadership and more transparency.

Clearly, the Americans do not understand the ordinary Pakistani. Their interaction with the ruling elites has led them to assume that this elite, with its tendency towards subservience and a constant gaze towards Washington (with a few exceptions) is reflective of the Pakistani nation at large. But, to their dismay, they are finding out otherwise even as they infiltrate into the bureaucratic and academic set ups in Pakistan. Again, subtlety having never been a strong American trait, they are responding to negative responses of ordinary Pakistanis in the usual ham-fisted manner in an effort to silence the critics. This writer has had the honor of being one of their targets especially since 2008 when stories regarding General Hood and the 11 conditions relating to unfettered access in Pakistan for US personnel with no legal restraints broke on the front pages of The News.

But even earlier, when Mr. Riaz Khokhar was Foreign Secretary, the US embassy had sought to have me either silenced in terms of my column or removed from the Institute of Strategic Studies – or else the embassy would assume that I was reflecting (heavens forbid) the official views of the Government of Pakistan. That is why some readers may recall for a while at the bottom of my column there was a one-liner stating that the views expressed were my own. Full credit to Mr. Khokhar for standing his ground, but I knew it was simply a matter of time when I would be liberated from all official strangleholds.

Now, once again, the US Ambassador, has turned her guns on this scribe as well as some electronic media hosts – all of whom have been exposing the increasing muscle flexing by the growing number of non-diplomatic Americans now in Pakistan – especially the notorious Blackwater – now re-christened Xe Worldwide. Just for the record, whatever has appeared in these columns regarding this group and the dubious Creative Associates International Inc (CAII) has been gleaned from Western media sources including the Deutsche Presse-Agentur (DPA), but then verified from reliable local sources. It is interesting to see how the more the US penetrates Pakistani officialdom, the more the saner elements within this officialdom show their anger and frustration and reveal to ordinary Pakistanis the wholesale handing over of the country to Washington.

Especially with the Blackwater issue refusing to die down in the media despite a strange silence in Parliament and in spite of threats of multiple types from the yet-to-be-expanded US embassy in Islamabad; new revelations are made on a daily basis about US shenanigans in Pakistan. Here in Pakistan it has got to the stage where one is not sure who is an “official” American and who is not. After all, the guard who abused Pakistan and an SHO in the diplomatic enclave was a member of the US government; but who were the three Americans who beat up a Pakistani citizen, Mohsin Bokhari, in Islamabad’s Aabpara last week? After using violence against this citizen they did eventually apologize, but the police refused to register a case because they felt that if the case registered by the SHO of the diplomatic enclave had no impact in terms of justice – thanks to the pusillanimity of the present Ministry of Foreign Affairs setup – it would simply be a waste of their energy in the month of fasting to register yet another case of violence by Americans against a Pakistani citizen.
 
Please save us from crap propaganda...
Every one knows Zardari and Gilani use private militia for their security and those are trained personals of xe.
this explains why americans had so much leverage in Pakistan and why they keep escaping apprehension for their obvious crimes.
 
i can say may be yes its 50-50 chances but any way good job stealth dost.we have to be check our left right whats going on.speacly these days.
 
Please save us from crap propaganda...
Every one knows Zardari and Gilani use private militia for their security and those are trained personals of xe.
this explains why americans had so much leverage in Pakistan and why they keep escaping apprehension for their obvious crimes.
Sorry, but no. Security to the President of Pakistan, Prime Minister of Pakistan, senior foreign diplomats, and other Very Important Persons is provided by the Special Service Group of the Pakistan Army. So no, the Xe is not here for the private protection of the Pres or the PM.

Secondly, all I said was that there is no proof either for or against the Xe. All I know is, if they were truly here to destroy Pakistan, then they would have been taken care of by the Army and the ISI. That's what they're there for, national defence from external and internal threats. If you believe that Xe is evil, then you either believe that the PA/ISI is utterly incompetent, or, that it is involved in the destabilization of Pakistan. To me, both are ludicrous ideas.

Xe-corp is a so called "private security firm", as opposed to the CIA, who are an international intelligence agency. We should be more worried about a strong presence of a foreign intelligence agency than private body-guards. For all I know, Xe could be here for the protection of American embassy workers or as subcontractors to the CIA and other intelligence organizations. If this is the case, and the CIA and Xe corp are both out to destroy Pakistan, then what is the ISI doing working closely with the CIA and providing them with intelligence?

See, the problem with those who scream and cry on top of their lungs is that they drown out the voices in the back of their heads that say "Be quiet, you know nothing!". Forgive me for listening to my little voice. I admit that I know nothing, but Allah has blessed me with a brain and the power of deduction. Simply logic dictates that if someone was trying to burn my house, I won't help him, but fight against him.

Now, that said, please go ahead and report me as a CIA/MOSSAD/RAW agent.

Well done , think tanker great rosey picture presented :cheers:

US Embassador is playing same role of Viceroys Lord Mountbatten
Sir, thanks for the interesting article. Can you please answer just one question for me?

Why is the Pakistan Army or ISI helping and not fighting the CIA/Blackwater?
a. Because they can't, they are too weak to fight against the foreign powers and against Zardari.
b. Because they are involved in a grand conspiracy to destroy Pakistan.
c. Both 'a' and 'b'.
 
Last edited:
Sir, thanks for the interesting article. Can you please answer just one question for me?

Why is the Pakistan Army or ISI helping and not fighting the CIA/Blackwater?

Can a man fight with Mad Bull?????? Yes he can but with Bull fighting skills lolzzzz

What should be role of PA and Nation?

PA is not soft target (thanks to Gen Zia) and nation standing behind army, US know this fact very well that Pakistan is not Afghanistan or Iraq.

PA know very well about the power of US so they could not say no to US bluntly because the whole western powers(NATO) and US would turn their guns towards them.

US changing Strategies?

US after eight years of long war realised that they could not win in Afghanistan with use of power and now wanted to negotiate with Talaban.Basically US is trying two parrallel strategies, one is to weaken Pakistan economically and control PA by hook or crook and second is to divide Talaban forces .

Why US is in trouble?

US has now limited time left to resolve the whole game ,they know very well that their key allies(Japan,France ,Canada) are not willing to support US for long term war strategy.

CIA/Black waters?

CIA/Black Waters is lossing their ground in both side of Pakistan Afghan boarders but wanted long term basis in Pakistan, which should not be given at any cost .

US Big Game?

US dont want China presence in Gawader and wanted safe passage from central Asia upto Gawader for gas and oil supply lines.This is their real mision and agenda for long term basis.

Pakistani nation should play important role to kick them out from Pak soil but to do this Nation need Political leadership and Army support but our corrupt political leadership except Imran is highly in favour of US wrong policies just for their political gains but it will not be in long term intrest of Pakistan,Afghanistan and Iran.

This is right time China and Iran and Russia should play their role to fail US greater game plan in Region in which India and Israel are also playing their key roles.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Well there is no question that mercenaries exist in Pakistan. I wont say much, but I know some agencies are working hand-in-hand with these organizations. People tend to look for "white" people when they look for intruders. Guess what? The terrorist that blow themselves up are among you, they are your people. Similarly, Blackwater could hire ex-Pakistani officials to do their work. Military officers have profound political background in Pakistan and they dont require security clearances.

I would not doubt that Blackwater trains SSG or ISI. Many military officers are sent to America for training. Who do you think trains them? Blackwater is an agency consisting of individuals from all areas of combat experience. Yes, they have skill and can be sent without worrying about political turbulence (i.e. if people dont find out)
 
^^ How many officers go to US?
All those few which are selected go for studies.
sure money can buy any thing and Pakistanis are no exception but than it is covert operation not approved by the govt.
On one hand US respect democratic govt. on the other hand force them to lie to the people!
Blackwater (xe) is not infamous in Pakistan for training but for target killings and whole lot of other illegal activities.
 
Yes, they are assassins. But I think the ISI has knowledge of their whereabouts. PC Peshawar? Taliban attack? I don't think so. There are elements within the ISI with the manhood to stand up against real terrorists like Xe. But then there are cowards who assist them as well.

Pakistani officers definitely get military training in USA.
U.S. Unit Secretly in Pakistan Lends Ally Support -
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/23/world/asia/23terror.html
 
Back
Top Bottom