IAF Gnat Not First To Surrender. !

[VCheng]

just look at one and you'll see why

look at its wingspan

in fact they were easily destabilized if any pilot error was made, very unforgiving aircrafts

It is a nearly a missile with a pilot on board:


Air & Space Museum-6612 by vcheng552000, on Flickr




Air & Space Museum-6613 by vcheng552000, on Flickr

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

that's what some people (pilots included) basically labelled it

 

[SQ8]

Possible.

But circumstances as narrated by Mr Tufail indicate genuine disorientation, for reasons known only to him. Why else would he break a fight only to fly straight into enemy air space? Further was he even aware of the fact that he was in fact being chased by F-104? Again, Mr Tufail's narrative leaves the possibility open, that he was completely unaware of the whole situation.

As with the Iraqi AF, they were facing USAF. To consider PAF to be as intimidating as USAF is a stretch, and frankly, amusing.

depends on how you apply it, There were elements of the IAf who openly admitted into getting into a dogfight.. simply because they were badly led.. the same way there were those who half rolled away at the sight of a gnat in the PAF.

It might have been disorientation.. but the whole idea of mistaking a disused unpaved surface at Pasrur for a complex like pathankot is funny.

Although the recent C-17 landing at the Tiny airfield instead of the airbase may be a repeat of the circumstances that led Sikand to land at the incorrect base.

 

[Windjammer]

Possible.

But circumstances as narrated by Mr Tufail indicate genuine disorientation, for reasons known only to him. Why else would he break a fight only to fly straight into enemy air space? Further was he even aware of the fact that he was in fact being chased by F-104? Again, Mr Tufail's narrative leaves the possibility open, that he was completely unaware of the whole situation.

As with the Iraqi AF, they were facing USAF. To consider PAF to be as intimidating as USAF is a stretch, and frankly, amusing.

By passing all rest, let me ask you, did you even read the whole of KT's article, for he clearly points out that it was Sikand who gave the panic stricken call to his formation of the F-104s presence in his Punjabi style.

“Pajh oye … 104 eeee,” Sikand shouted out to Pathania in inimitable Punjabi (the English translation, “Run … it’s a 104” just cannot grasp the hint of mad rush in the expression)[3]. The ‘104’ did not stay in the fight for long as the idea was to charge in at supersonic speed and try a pot shot or, simply overwhelm the adversaries with sheer awe[4]. Mirza did his act a couple of times before leaving the scene; it had a salutary effect, as the dogfight broke off and the Gnats started egressing. Sikand, who had initiated the panic call, broke off too, but in an opposite direction, thus losing contact with his wingman as well as the rest of the formation.

 

[toxic_pus]

depends on how you apply it, There were elements of the IAf who openly admitted into getting into a dogfight.. simply because they were badly led.. the same way there were those who half rolled away at the sight of a gnat in the PAF.

Fair enough.

It might have been disorientation.. but the whole idea of mistaking a disused unpaved surface at Pasrur for a complex like pathankot is funny.

It is indeed funny. And bizarre. But did Mr Sikhand make any comment to such effect? My memory is failing me. Mr Tufail seems to have left out that 'funny' detail of Mr Sikhand's claim.

'During interrogation Sikand claimed that [...] the airstrip that he saw was a godsend..'​

It appears that Mr Sikhand was aware that he was landing on an 'airstrip', and that too, by chance.

Although the recent C-17 landing at the Tiny airfield instead of the airbase may be a repeat of the circumstances that led Sikand to land at the incorrect base.

Probably

 

[toxic_pus]

By passing all rest, let me ask you, did you even read the whole of KT's article, for he clearly points out that it was Sikand who gave the panic stricken call to his formation of the F-104s presence in his Punjabi style.

True.

But the events took turn while the Indian pilots were on their way home and were already in Indian airspace. Why would Mr Sikhand, after having left Pakistani airspace, turn his fighter around to 're-enter' Pakistani air space?

'One Gnat, however, was seen to be behaving strangely; having gone back, it turned about and re-entered Pakistani airspace.'​

After Mr Mirza's F-104 had made its appearance, the Gnats broke off and started heading home. At this point something went wrong in Mr Sikhand's cockpit and he lost contact with his wingman. Strangely, he turned his Gnat around and flew straight into Pakistani airspace. At some point, shortly afterward, he must have realised that he was in Pakistani airspace. He noticed an 'airstrip' and landed on it. A clear case of disorientation, which was perhaps compounded by one or more system failures.

The point I am trying to make is that Mr Sikhand was not forced to 'surrender' or land, as is the popular belief among PAF enthusiasts. In fact, Mr Hakimullah's F-104, who is credited for enforcing the 'surrender', had no role in it.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

True.

But the events took turn while the Indian pilots were on their way home and were already in Indian airspace. Why would Mr Sikhand, after having left Pakistani airspace, turn his fighter around to 're-enter' Pakistani air space?

'One Gnat, however, was seen to be behaving strangely; having gone back, it turned about and re-entered Pakistani airspace.'​

After Mr Mirza's F-104 had made its appearance, the Gnats broke off and started heading home. At this point something went wrong in Mr Sikhand's cockpit and he lost contact with his wingman. Strangely, he turned his Gnat around and flew straight into Pakistani airspace. At some point, shortly afterward, he must have realised that he was in Pakistani airspace. He noticed an 'airstrip' and landed on it. A clear case of disorientation, which was perhaps compounded by one or more system failures.

The point I am trying to make is that Mr Sikhand was not forced to 'surrender' or land, as is the popular belief among PAF enthusiasts. In fact, Mr Hakimullah's F-104, who is credited for enforcing the 'surrender', had no role in it.

^ Alas, worthless efforts to prove something that no one in the world will ever believe.
You simply can't change the past, world knows today that a IAF Gnat defected in Pakistan and its on public display at Karachi, come and feast your eyes .
Deal with it !

 

[Areesh]

True.

But the events took turn while the Indian pilots were on their way home and were already in Indian airspace. Why would Mr Sikhand, after having left Pakistani airspace, turn his fighter around to 're-enter' Pakistani air space?

To avoid pursuit of F-104 and getting shot down at the end. Simple. PAF doesn't agree with the story that his systems failed.

 

[Thorough Pro]

Where is this war trophy now? how come this fact is not so well known as compared to Gnat surrender?

btw Thanks for sharing this historical fact and Kudos to our great Shaheens.

The surrendering of IAF Gnat at the beginning of the 1965 war has been well documented, but few people know that this was not the first Indian aircraft forced to land inside Pakistan. Earlier in the same year during operation Dessert Hawk, an IAF Dassault Ouragan was intercepted and forced to land near Jangshahi.

 

[chaklala2]

Question: where is the captured IAF Ouragon displayed? I just went to the Karachi museum and it is not there

 

[muhammadali233]

Question: where is the captured IAF Ouragon displayed? I just went to the Karachi museum and it is not there

Peshawar

 

[chaklala2]

Peshawar

Any pics?

Any pics?

Guys - is there really a PAF museum in Peshawar? I could not find anything about it online and the only links I get is that of PAF museum Karachi? Has any one of you been to this Peshawar museum? Does anyone have a recent photograph of this IAF Ouragon?