How PAF Should Counter the SU-30 MKI

[TANMAY619]

no paf ac has radar or ew system as good as mki. dont tell about the awacs as we also have phalcon awacs which are considered the best. even j 10b would be no match and dont bring in jf 17 as it has sub standard avionics and any rational person knows it. iaf's mkis have 170km range missiles and can get out any ac of paf without being detected. awacs of paf have a detection range of 350km(all the good ones have 400km range) and would be a sitting duck against anti awacs missiles. and remember super 30 is coming.
i think in strike and ground attack mkis are better than whole paf combined

absolutely correct friend. the best defences would be the hq 19

 

[AUz]

no paf ac has radar or ew system as good as mki. dont tell about the awacs as we also have phalcon awacs which are considered the best. even j 10b would be no match and dont bring in jf 17 as it has sub standard avionics and any rational person knows it. iaf's mkis have 170km range missiles and can get out any ac of paf without being detected. awacs of paf have a detection range of 350km(all the good ones have 400km range) and would be a sitting duck against anti awacs missiles. and remember super 30 is coming.
i think in strike and ground attack mkis are better than whole paf combined

absolutely correct friend. the best defences would be the hq 19

Welcome to the forum.

You need alotttttttttttttttttttttttttt of knowledge regarding defence issues and aerial warfare. You are on the right place , nevertheless..

 

[KRAIT]

no paf ac has radar or ew system as good as mki. dont tell about the awacs as we also have phalcon awacs which are considered the best. even j 10b would be no match and dont bring in jf 17 as it has sub standard avionics and any rational person knows it. iaf's mkis have 170km range missiles and can get out any ac of paf without being detected. awacs of paf have a detection range of 350km(all the good ones have 400km range) and would be a sitting duck against anti awacs missiles. and remember super 30 is coming.
i think in strike and ground attack mkis are better than whole paf combined

absolutely correct friend. the best defences would be the hq 19

O boy, read all the posts specially by the professional ones on this forum, if you don't believe other countries' posters, read "Sancho" 's post about this scenario. He is an Indian.

Not questioning your knowledge but there is more that meets the eyes.

 

[dearone4u_22]

Welcome to the forum.

You need alotttttttttttttttttttttttttt of knowledge regarding defence issues and aerial warfare. You are on the right place , nevertheless..

Nope actually he is in the wrong place...when was the last time two aircraft..or two naval ship or for that matter Any warfare Strategy discussed on this forum

 

[danger007]

O boy, read all the posts specially by the professional ones on this forum, if you don't believe other countries' posters, read "Sancho" 's post about this scenario. He is an Indian.

Not questioning your knowledge but there is more that meets the eyes.

may be tanmay is female.........

 

[mylovepakistan]

no paf ac has radar or ew system as good as mki. dont tell about the awacs as we also have phalcon awacs which are considered the best. even j 10b would be no match and dont bring in jf 17 as it has sub standard avionics and any rational person knows it. iaf's mkis have 170km range missiles and can get out any ac of paf without being detected. awacs of paf have a detection range of 350km(all the good ones have 400km range) and would be a sitting duck against anti awacs missiles. and remember super 30 is coming.
i think in strike and ground attack mkis are better than whole paf combined

absolutely correct friend. the best defences would be the hq 19

hi,since you are very new to this forum,
we can expect such aweful assumptions from an indian fan boy...

true,no airborne radar in PAF is comparable to MKI's PESA radar,
but wait,have you really gone through the very 1st page of this thread? i dont think so,

MKI has good radar but it has a huge RCS value too,even a JF 17 or block 52 can spot MKI earlier,

"jf 17 as it has sub standard avionics and any rational person knows it"


o boy come out of the world of fantacies and specialy the world of wikipedia,
go through jf 17 info pool thread...best of luck

"iaf's mkis have 170km range missiles and can get out any ac of paf without being detected"

that is one of the most obnoxious statement coming from you,
which missile would you bring PAF jets down with at range of 170 km ???

when MKI's radar cant detect them at 170 km ....
oh you might be thinkking of AWACS killer missiles....LOL!!

 

[Major Shaitan Singh]

"Super menuverability"

The term "super-maneuverability" was coined by Dr. Wolfgang Herbst, initiator of the USA's X-31 prototype program, in defining controllability up to 60° to 70° Angle-of-Attack with transients of 120° or more.

The Su-30MKI has no AoA limitations: it can fly at even 180 degree AoA and still recover.<<<unique. This high super-agility allows rapid deployment of weapons in any direction as desired by the crew. The addition of another seat means that the pilot is free to concentrate on flying the aircraft while the second pilot can engage targets.

Mikhail Simonov was stung by press criticism that this machine was appearing at airshows doing tailslides and Cobras without any underwing stores. So it was promptly fitted with a representative warload consisting of (from port wingtip) - AA-11, AA-11, AA-10, Kh-31P, 6 x OFAB-100-120 bombs on a MER fitted to the port lower intake, KAB-500KR on centreline pylon, Kh-29T on lower Stbd intake, Kh-59M, RVV-AE, AA-11, AA-11 and still did its full show routine! A similar performance was witnessed at an airshow where the Landing Gear could not retracted in a Su-37, but Yevgeny Frolov still went on do perform the show routine without any changes!

and of course, the Su30MKI does the famed Cobra maneuver

and u are indeed correct their dogfighting ability cannot be matched by any fighter, including the f22, wich has less manevarablity

 

[mylovepakistan]

"Super menuverability"

The term "super-maneuverability" was coined by Dr. Wolfgang Herbst, initiator of the USA's X-31 prototype program, in defining controllability up to 60Ã&#8218;° to 70Ã&#8218;° Angle-of-Attack with transients of 120Ã&#8218;° or more.

The Su-30MKI has no AoA limitations: it can fly at even 180 degree AoA and still recover.<<<unique. This high super-agility allows rapid deployment of weapons in any direction as desired by the crew. The addition of another seat means that the pilot is free to concentrate on flying the aircraft while the second pilot can engage targets.

Mikhail Simonov was stung by press criticism that this machine was appearing at airshows doing tailslides and Cobras without any underwing stores. So it was promptly fitted with a representative warload consisting of (from port wingtip) - AA-11, AA-11, AA-10, Kh-31P, 6 x OFAB-100-120 bombs on a MER fitted to the port lower intake, KAB-500KR on centreline pylon, Kh-29T on lower Stbd intake, Kh-59M, RVV-AE, AA-11, AA-11 and still did its full show routine! A similar performance was witnessed at an airshow where the Landing Gear could not retracted in a Su-37, but Yevgeny Frolov still went on do perform the show routine without any changes!

and of course, the Su30MKI does the famed Cobra maneuver

and u are indeed correct their dogfighting ability cannot be matched by any fighter, including the f22, wich has less manevarablity

hey are you simply quoting vayu sena tripod here?
go through very 1st page of this thread,

 

[Alchemy]

MKI would continue to dominate the subcontinent skies in the foreseeable future .. unless somehow Pak gets its hand on J-20 , MKI will dominate any aircraft Pak may have in its arsenal and that's a well known fact, for those Pak fanboys who dont like to see the truth as it is , good luck to them !!!

 

[Mav3rick]

Guess what Indians would reply with , after you blow up their entire air fleet on ground [too exaggerated to begin with] ?

We tried that in 1965 but could not accomplish the objectives. But even if that happens (extremely exaggerated as per your own suggestion), I would say that India will have to back off if Pakistan calls for a ceasefire, otherwise India will rely upon her BM's and GLCM's.

 

[Mav3rick]

Well, it was not able to jam the JF-17 radars was it?
F-16 Block 52+ is not the only fighter in PAF inventory.

Do you mean to imply that the KLJ-7 Radar is better then the APG Radar on F-16 Block 52+? And do you mean to say that the anti jamming suites of JF-17's are better then F-16's? Furthermore, I do not think that even the Mirage-2000/9 or MKI's can effectively jam F-16's B-52+ radars.

Incase of a war breakout, PAF still has an advantage over IAF. IAF needs to have Squadrons at North and North-East, whereas PAF has smaller area hence more flexible. The JF-17 is a new aircraft and the first dogfight would leave the enemy wandering on how to encounter. The RCS of JF-17 which is lower than the Su-30 is an advantage so is the lower IR signature. The Su-30s would be the first to appear in the JF-17 radar and a BVR has much better chances with higher RCS. Plus, the JF-17 will be less prone to radar jamming than Block 52+.

For the second time you have implied that the JF-17's incorporate a more effective radar (in anti jamming) then the F-16 B-52+. That is not correct.

And though you have assumed that the SU-30MKI will appear on JF-17's radar because of the much bigger RCS, you have failed to credit the MKI with a much more powerful radar that can detect a JF-17 size RCS from a longer range then vice versa. Finally, the effectiveness, post numerous improvements, of the BVRAAM, especially at maximum range, is still highly debatable. A WVRAAM on the other hand, is a different story.

 

[shree835]

In future some more thread is going to come. i.e.

1. How PAF should counter LCA MK2
2. How PAF should counter Rafale.
3. How PAF should counter FGFA.
4. How PAF should counter T50.
5. How PAF should counter AMCA.
5. How PAF should counter Super SU-30MKI.

 

[Mav3rick]

Sir,

You are in error----su 30 won't appear on j17's radar---as a matter of fact the jf 17 will appear on th su30's radar before it happens otherwise---.

Su 30 has a massive radar---I think that you missed out on the posts by our specialist gambit----.

The above scenario is in case long distance interception like over the ocean---on land---all the bases are close by---all air craft will be pretty much visible to each other.

You also have jumped ahead---the jf17 would have to pass thru the barrage of bvr's at first to come within wvr range.

You are correct on the second part---most of these bases are with surface to surface or air to ground weapons.

There is 1 important factor missing from the posts of both you guys.......AWEACS!

Considering that the MKI's will be entering our airspace where our AWEACS will be more effective, it may just balance the equation a bit b/w datalinked JF-17's and MKI's .

In future some more thread is going to come. i.e.

1. How PAF should counter LCA MK2
2. How PAF should counter Rafale.
3. How PAF should counter FGFA.
4. How PAF should counter T50.
5. How PAF should counter AMCA.
5. How PAF should counter Super SU-30MKI.

1 - Yeah, in 30 years.
2 - Hmm.....10 years atleast?
3 - 15 years?

You get where I am going with it, right?

 

[HANI]

In future some more thread is going to come. i.e.

1. How PAF should counter LCA MK2
2. How PAF should counter Rafale.
3. How PAF should counter FGFA.
4. How PAF should counter T50.
5. How PAF should counter AMCA.
5. How PAF should counter Super SU-30MKI.

LCA MK2 ????? come on fan boy at least induct MK1 first ...................

 

[Wet Shirt Contest]

A Jf17 armed with externally mounted weapons is a big Spot on Mki Radar. So detection advantage is Fuss here. Su30Mki mounts a BIG powerful NIIP N011M Bars radar, at least x8 BVR's and a Powerful State of art Elta EL/M-8222 Jammer pod 'll fry incoming missile seeker. Bringing Down a beast like that is not easy kill but Mki is not invincible either.

Even if Jf17 manage to detect a Mki 1st ? there is Not much you can do. Only a noob pilot 'll launch BVR missiles at maximum ranges and gives enough time to opponent to deploy counter measures or take evasive maneuvers.

Su30mki Huge RCS can be use as advantage to fool enemy pilots. a combo of Su30mki and Mig21 / LCA or even Rafale is death warrant for enemies. air battles are Not simple as most of us thinks.

Do tell me How PAF ll manage to bring down 270+ Mki's ? (and Super sukhois) ? i am not even taking other IAF fighters into account.