How many F-16s VS F/A-22 fighter

[Devianz]

Care to elaborate???

F-22 can only carry 6 missiles(4BVR,2WVR) in its internal weapon bay.

8 actually. 6 BVRs in main bay and 2 WVRs in side bay.

 

[somebozo]

Its always the man behind the machine. Recall how chinese dog fighters were able to turn the tide of war in Mig-15 on the eve of possible korean surrender??

 

[Icarus]

Not really a question of how many, more of a question of what if.....
F-16 is a very capable aircraft, so is F-22. Both have an equally probable chance of bringing the other down. There are too many variable factors involved.
Are they in BVR mode ?
Do they have jamming pods ?
Distance ?
Angle of attack ?
Position ?
Pilot experience ?
Fuel ?
Terrain ?
Among other things.

 

[Tiger Awan]

8 actually. 6 BVRs in main bay and 2 WVRs in side bay.

so 8 F-16 will be lost by these missiles and not a single F-16 pilot will be able to defend its AC from a missile

And even if those 8 missiles are fired the F-22 pilot will still be in the air????

Pilot will surely direct his AC towards the base

 

[Devianz]

so 8 F-16 will be lost by these missiles and not a single F-16 pilot will be able to defend its AC from a missile

Read my previous comment before jumping into idiotic conclusions. Where did I say that F-22's missiles will kill with 100% accuracy in BVR?

 

[su-47]

Care to elaborate???

F-22 can only carry 6 missiles(4BVR,2WVR) in its internal weapon bay.

let say 7-8 F-16s are heading towards a Raptor.First Raptor will fire 4 Amraams towards 4 F-16s.Then to destroy others it has to come in close ranges so after coming in close range Let say it has destroyed two more F-16s.Now Raptors Internal bay is empty what it will do???

Remember at close ranges stealth can be unvieled.Stealth doesn't mean that an Aircraft cannot be detected by other aircraft.Its Just the range which varies.Stealth doesn't make a aircraft disappeard like a ghost on Radar.Its just the matter of range,Depends upon how low observable Target is.

So suppose if the remaining 1 or 2 F-16's has detected the Raptor(Empty with Missiles) at close ranges then they can get a lock on Raptor.
And unlike Raptor F-16s can carry much more weaponry than Raptor.

The scenario you have said can be possible if Raptor carries the Amraams on External Stores.But that of course will not make it stealthy & the whole game will change.

No sane pilot will fight like that, where he will completely give himself away. and i am pretty sure they put sane pilots on the f-22.

basically, this is what will happen. the F-22 will pick up the approaching f-16s (and the F-16s dont even know they are about to be roadkill) and ask permission to engage. If he is denied permission, he will scoot and the f-16s would never know what happened.

If he is granted permission, he will fire 4 AMRAAMS and turn and scoot. he knows one F-22 is worth more than the remaining 4 F-16s. The AMRAAMS will guide themselves to the F-16s and blow them to nice little chunks. The other 4 F-16s will either start looking around for an attacker. If they spot the F-22, they still have to maintain lock in order to guide their AMRAAMs to it, since the AMRAAM alone are unlikely to pick up the F-22s RCS. a

Most probably the F-16s will never spot the F-22. they will do the sensible thing and fly back to base to tell the story of how they got owned.

well, if the F-16s are lucky, one or two AMRAAMs might fail to hit, due to ECM and evasive tactics of the F-16 pilot. but still, unless the F-16s get a radr that can detect F-22 at BVR ranges, the question is not how many F-16s are needed to down an F-22, rather how many F-22 sorties are needed to destroy a nation's fleet of F-16s

 

[Safriz]

I dont know,but sometimes i think F-22 is over rated.
Does anybody has a link to an actual combat scenario where F-22 has proved its worth? Most claims are based on what specs have been published by the manufacturers and operators.
F-16 is a n old Dawg,which has proved its capabilities multiple times in actual warfare...F-22 has yet to do this.

 

[SBD-3]

first thing first, all those member who are comparing the capability by number of missiles are mistaken clearly. The Raptor benefits from "you can't be seen, you can't be hit". F-22 has been designed to fight out numbered, Pilots on this plane are trained to fight out numbered. In future weapons a F-22 pilot Lt Col David Nardi described F-22 Vs F-15 (which is better than F-16) as

we go out and typically 1 verses 4,5,6 and its still not a fair fight

Secondly F-16 will not be able to compete the agility of F-22 which has a sustained turn rate of 28 dergress whereas even F-15 has an instantaneous turn of of 21 degrees, with a sustained turn rate of 15 or 16. so no chance in turning fight. The only hope is a kamikaz missile shot in hope that it will be able to hit raptor. Most of us will give an example of F-16 scoring a kill against F-22 but they won't tell you that F-16 was killed before the missile hit Raptor, so F-16s can't run alive from F-22. The F-22 will be in danger against multiple F-16 only if it accidently loses its stealth (e.g. weapons bay jammed). Some of the F-15 pilots report that even when they managed to see the F-22 yet the plane is so stealthy that their systems could not lock the F-22.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

1 F-35 is equivlant 10 F16 fighters our planes
1 F-35 is equivlant to 6 F16 AESA enabled F16 with top of line missiles

The F-16 Planes will have to communicate as a group to identify location of F35 in air , and planes flyers will have to engage it in dog fight to get the kill. The visual eye would be handy in identifying at close ranges and also the F16 360 video comes in handy in real combat

1 F16 could also destroy whole fleet of F-35 if its sitting in Aircraft carrier , and not flying with nuclear detonation

It depends on the COMMANDER if the fight will be 1 vs 1 or SUDDEN IMPACT


F-22 > F35


F-16 is realistically a 70's engineering technology and the F-22/F-35 are technologically superior

Its like a Solider with a machine gun , and solider with a pistol

When east indian company came ashore , they brought in cannons , and locals had rifles was it ? we all know how that went in real battle scenario

The pilot's factor comes in to play at close ranges , most of the F-22/F-35 kills are at long - mid range and with Missiles whose ranges are strictly confidential

Unless we develop a missile with our own confidential range ... the fight is likely a one sided affair

Here is a test :
Take a tennis ball in your hand , and then stand in your living room , to 360 circles 10-20 times, and then take your tennis ball and see if you can hit a target you setup some where in room (which of course you asked your friend to move while you were rotating)

You don't know where it was located before, you don't know where it is now , and you don't know if you let go of the tennis ball it will not bounce back in wall in hit you in the face


Also the real speed of F22/F35 is classified so if the planes chose they can out run a
F-16 in out numbered scenario

 

[Patriot]

USAF put 2 F22 vs 6/8/ even as many as 15 F15's and F16's and F22 literally destroyed them.The pilot wont even know what hit him.People are totally underestimating F22 right now but once it goes to war it will devastate the enemy and produce shock and awe aseptic in aerial warfare.

 

[Donatello]

USAF put 2 F22 vs 6/8/ even as many as 15 F15's and F16's and F22 literally destroyed them.The pilot wont even know what hit him.People are totally underestimating F22 right now but once it goes to war it will devastate the enemy and produce shock and awe aseptic in aerial warfare.

There is always hype. But the question depends on how many F-22s are flying and how many AA missiles they are carrying.

If 12, then that's the maximum number they can shoot.

Not 100 as the USAF puts the loss ratio of F-22 vs other combat aircraft. (1F-22 : 100 F-16s)


F-117 was all hyped up.

It took decades old Soviet SAM to bring it down.


F-22 is a beautiful machine, nonetheless the pioneer of 5th gen. But the true performance is yet to be seen.

 

[Patriot]

There is always hype. But the question depends on how many F-22s are flying and how many AA missiles they are carrying.

If 12, then that's the maximum number they can shoot.

Not 100 as the USAF puts the loss ratio of F-22 vs other combat aircraft. (1F-22 : 100 F-16s)


F-117 was all hyped up.

It took decades old Soviet SAM to bring it down.


F-22 is a beautiful machine, nonetheless the pioneer of 5th gen. But the true performance is yet to be seen.

Well it is not duty of F22 to stay in air when it's missile are finished.It can simply bug out and go home?It tells you a lot about F22 when people say it will be shot down when its missiles are used.Besides F22 also have excellent maneuverability (super agility) so even in dogfights it should not have a problem with its gun.F22 can come shot down 5-7 enemy jets then go back to their air base load up again take off.I think people are finding it as a excuse to badmouth F22.Every jet will be a easy kill for enemy if its running out of ammo but on the other hand enemy wont be able to detect F22.F22 pilot can simply supercruise at super sonic speed and leave the combat area quickly without burning the same level of fuel other jet would burn in super sonic speed.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

The man behind the machine is a myth now---any pilot who is authorized to fly an F 22 is a top notch jock by default. He has a proven tarck record to be in that seat.

So---please let us take our discussion to the next level and get out of this man behind the machine game plan---. The machine has a brain now----which thinks for the pilot and has many a built in capabilities that older pilots can only drean in their imaginations.

So---how many F 16's for one F 22-----well let us put it five F 22's----how many aircraft would it take----.

It would possibly break the backbone of all the major airforces to take down five F22's---the resultant loss of F 16 aircraft would be so severe that the air force would not be capable to take on any futrther flight missions.

 

[Jigs]

I don't understand the question ? There isn't a specific number of A to defeat B. Especially when the F-16s can't detect the F-22. It could just lock on to them and fire off all its AIM-120s then just turn around and leave. The F-16s won't even be able to detect that the F-22 locked on to them. If your looking for dogfighting your not going to see it.

 

[Menes]

Theoritically, you need 10 F-15/16s or more to encounter 1 F-22/35.

Practically, even one F-16 can bring down a F-22/35. It happened many times before that Mi-8 helicopter hits an F-4 Phantom II. I even saw a gun camera photo of a MiG-21 locked on F-14 during Bright Star exercise!!