How CNN distorted the truth. You can tell from this famous "tank man" video

[beijingwalker]

Or else how do you think China can turn its head from a Farming and Agricultures based society in early-mid 1980 to Industry Powerhouse in just 10 years time in the 1990s? By Miracle?
.

It's because businessmen want to make more money by taking advantage of China low labor cost and largely untapped market, if US didn't do it, other rich countries would do it all the same, it's a common business practice, US got developed by the same old by adopting money and technology from Europe.

during the whole world history, only one type of ideology is known to support Student Movement, and that is communism,

Who told you so?

 

[KungFuLee]

US transfered 60 military helicopters MD 500 to Saddam Hussain. You see how easy it is to prove you were wrong.

Any proof? Otherwise you may as well say US transfer 60 Apache to Iraq.

North Korea also uses MD-500, did that mean US sell them to North Korea?

So Gorbachev claimed it and it must be right?

Did I say he is right? I said he "Disagree" with you, but if I have to pick between your opinion and Gorbachev's opinion, I would pick him, not you.

Yes US regime played big part in dismemberment of the Soviet Union. Since the end of World War II US supported pro nazi Banderovites from the Ukraine. And immediately after the fall of the Soviet Union US worked to destabilise Russia eg. by supporting terrorists attacking Russia.

If you have to say this, then we can say Soviet Union dissolve after WW2 when they face off with the American.

The actual cause of dissolution of Soviet Union was discuss in great length in Gorbachev memoir, If I have to pick one to believe, I will choose his over yours anyday.

You are free to think that way. And what it has to do with US efforts to hijack protests in China? I already proved that US was involved. Another prof of US involvement is that some of protesters fled to US.

Ignoring my question is not "proof" of anything, maybe proof of your argument is not strong enough..
And again, the knowledge you process in the far east is alarmingly lacking. You have no idea how and what China is during the 1980s and 1990s, I get it, most people jump on the Chinese train because China is powerful now, so they tend to be ignorant to China weaker past.

I proved that your claim that US didn't sell weapons to Saddam was false.

Yeah, because you said so.

Where exactly I was wrong ? Prove it if you can, like I proved you were wrong.


It is you who have thick skin.

Again, by ignoring my question, it show you know nothing.

Okay, I will admit I am thick skin if you will answer me

1.) Where in the CIA history did they support Student Movement.
2.) How China get the capital and technology to build up their industrial base during late 1980s and early 1990s.
3.) How did USSR fall if what listed in Gorbachev memoir
4.) Where is the evidence of US transfer MD500 to Iraq.

Come answer all of them then we can talk. Or I will peg you as an ignorant guy who try to boost knowledge you do not have,

 

[Piotr]

It's because businessmen want to make more money by taking advantage of China low labor cost and largely untapped market, if US didn't do it, other rich countries would do it all the same, it's a common business practice, US got developed by the same old by adopting money and technology from Europe.

US in not the only country that invested in Mainland China. Many countries/ regions invested in Mainland China: Japan, Singapure, South Korea, Germany etc. Only idiot could suggest that Mainland China achived economic growth only thanks to US investments. It's funny how some trolls thinks that US is a God.

 

[KungFuLee]

It's because businessmen want to make more money by taking advantage of China low labor cost and largely untapped market, if US didn't do it, other rich countries would do it all the same, it's a common business practice, US got developed by the same old by adopting money and technology from Europe.

So it was your understanding the American and European who inject money and technology to make the base of Manufacturing in China? That is what I said.

My question is, if Tiananmen Square happens before that, would US/EU still invest in China? Or you think US/EU investing China and not expecting anything political to return?

Who told you so?

History. Read up October Revolution

And also. This

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/13261/china-american-campuses
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06...y-under-threat-from-chinese-influence/8583832

 

[beijingwalker]

1.) Where in the CIA history did they support Student Movement.

CIA supports all kinds of subversive activities against hostile nations, including students anti government movement, that's why in Tiananmen the students set up a poorman's version of statue of liberty and the students leaders almost all fled to US after they were cracked down.

 

[American Pakistani]

Disagree. Most media are not so shameless as US media.

You haven't seen indian media then.

 

[beijingwalker]

My question is, if Tiananmen Square happens before that, would US/EU still invest in China? Or you think US/EU investing China and not expecting anything political to return?

They always do, cause money is alway their priority, China's economic take off was largely after the successful crackdown over Tiananmen riot. The result justified the course.

History. Read up October Revolution

And also. This

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/13261/china-american-campuses
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06...y-under-threat-from-chinese-influence/8583832

Do those unverifiable sources prove that communism is the only ideology that supports students movement? how?

 

[Piotr]

Any proof? Otherwise you may as well say US transfer 60 Apache to Iraq.

https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/169-history/36416.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Iraq_during_the_Iran–Iraq_War#cite_note-spidersweb-1

You see, I proved you were wrong.

Again, by ignoring my question, it show you know nothing.

Okay, I will admit I am thick skin if you will answer me

1.) Where in the CIA history did they support Student Movement.

Thank you for admiting you are thick skinned.

Where did I said that CIA supported some "Student Movement" ?

2.) How China get the capital and technology to build up their industrial base during late 1980s and early 1990s.

Some were indigenous, some from abroad (Japan, Russia, Germany, Singapore, etc.)

3.) How did USSR fall if what listed in Gorbachev memoir

USSR fall in part because of actions of US regime (support for terrorists like Bin Laden in Afganistan, support for nazi Banderovites, sanctions against USSR etc.

4.) Where is the evidence of US transfer MD500 to Iraq.

See above.

 

[KungFuLee]

They always do, cause money is alway their priority, China's take off was large after successful crackdown over Tiananmen riot. The result justified the course.

Well, if it is what you say, businessman always invest without regard the political atmosphere, then US will invest in China long before 1980, but that is not the case now isn't it?

I am not debating whether or not China is justify to use force in Tiananmen Square, if you read my comment before, I said that is your choice, and people are expected to dealt with that way when they riot, so no point crying over the heavy hand tactics.

Do those unverifiable sources prove that communism is the only ideology that supports students movement? how?

unverifiable? That is the human history, There are only a few ideology in the world, and you can read all the rise and fall within their course of history. I did extensive research on every type of political ideology, now name me one ideology outside communism that started with grassroot movement?

 

[beijingwalker]

Well, if it is what you say, businessman always invest without regard the political atmosphere, then US will invest in China long before 1980, but that is not the case now isn't it?

China didn't let them in, that's why Nixon was hell bent to visit China and make a deal. After Mao, China and US became engaging in normal relations. So as long as China opens, US would be the first to jump in, all for money, no one can resist a billion population market.

unverifiable? That is the human history, There are only a few ideology in the world, and you can read all the rise and fall within their course of history. I did extensive research on every type of political ideology, now name me one ideology outside communism that started with grassroot movement?

Who told you the cummunism is the only ideology that supports students movements? I still didn't see any contents that back up your this claim.

 

[KungFuLee]

https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/169-history/36416.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Iraq_during_the_Iran–Iraq_War#cite_note-spidersweb-1

You see, I proved you were wrong.

lol a "proof" from a Forum? What next? Are you going to quote this forum as proof?

I can proof North Korea is using MD-500 and US wasn't even selling them. Iran using Boeing 737 as VIP military transport, does that mean US sell Iran Military Hardware as well?

Thank you for admiting you are thick skinned.

Where did I said that CIA supported some "Student Movement" ?

All 4 questions, do you have reading problem?
You did not even answer one, you just show me some quote on a forum

Some were indigenous, some from abroad (Japan, Russia, Germany, Singapore, etc.)

Even the Chinese Poster above agree that It was the US and EU who rearm China during that period. You still not going to concede to that point? Wow...….

Again, would Japan, Germany and Singapore agree with build China up if US was not in Favourable term with China?

USSR fall in part because of actions of US regime (support for terrorists like Bin Laden in Afganistan, support for nazi Banderovites, sanctions against USSR etc.
4.) Where is the evidence of US transfer MD500 to Iraq.
See above.

US has been doing stuff to Soviet Union since 1949, do you see Soviet Union fall in the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s or 1980s? No. What you are saying is that since US is working to sabotage the Soviet Union, thus US must know how and when will Soviet Union fall, that argument is absurd at best, idiotic at worse. You can only apply pressure to a regime but you cannot know when will it fall.

Also, if Gorbachev's opinion is anything to go by, USSR fall is largely without US involvement. It was year after year detraction and financial strain that leads to USSR failing. Not because of US action with USSR.

Take Afghanistan as an example, nobody force Soviet Union to invade Afghanistan, not at least the American. It would be their own fault to underestimate the resilience of Mujahedeen.

China didn't let them in, that's why Nixon was hell bent to visit China and make a deal. After Mao, China and US became engaging in normal relations. So as long as China opens, US would be the first to jump in, all for money, no one can resist a billion population market.

You still did not answer my question, and it is a easy Yes and No Question.

Would US and EU still invest in China had Tiananmen Square happened 10 years before?

China always have a big population, if businessman goes where the money goes and disregard Political Atmosphere, they would have invest in China long before 1980.

So please just answer my question, yes or no.

Who told you the cummunism is the only ideology that supports students movements? I still didn't see any contents that back up your this claim.

Again, name me one ideology outside Communism that start with Grassroot movement? Then you will get the answer.

 

[beijingwalker]

US has been doing stuff to Soviet Union since 1949, do you see Soviet Union fall in the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s or 1980s? No. What you are saying is that since US is working to sabotage the Soviet Union, thus US must know how and when will Soviet Union fall, that argument is absurd at best, idiotic at worse. You can only apply pressure to a regime but you cannot know when will it fall.
.

CIA work against many governments and not all of them fall, that's why CIA is still there and working hard.

l
Again, name me one ideology outside Communism that start with Grassroot movement? Then you will get the answer.

Do you know from where Hitler get to power? Speaking of grassroot movement, and how about French revolution?

l

You still did not answer my question, and it is a easy Yes and No Question.

Would US and EU still invest in China had Tiananmen Square happened 10 years before?

Yes, they definitely would, do you know what cause the Opium war? Trade. western powers always covetted Chinese market and tried to open it but China resisted. No one can resist a billion population temptation and that's why US was so eager to nomlize relations with mainland China , even at the cost of their ally Taiwan, for money US can betray anyone.

China always have a big population, if businessman goes where the money goes and disregard Political Atmosphere, they would have invest in China long before 1980.

So please just answer my question, yes or no.
.

Please read again, I 'd already answered, China didn't let them.

 

[KungFuLee]

CIA work against many governments and not all of them fall, that's why CIA is still there and working hard.

But he is saying US can "Predict" when would USSR fall because CIA is working against it.

How?

Do you know from where Hitler get to power? Speaking of grassroot movement, and how about French revolution?

First of all, do you know what is the full name for Nazi party?

National Socialism Party

Isn't the same Socialism that give birth to Communism?

And lol, French Revolution have a lot of elitism involve, with religion take a great part of. French Revolution is no where near "grassroot"

Yes, they definitely would, do you know what cause the Opium war? Trade. western powers always covetted Chinese market and tried to open it but China resisted. No one can resist a billion population temptation and that's why US was so eager to nomlize relations with mainland China , even at the cost of their ally Taiwan, for money US can betray anyone.

The whole point of Opium War is to force China to align to Western Idea and pull China into western influence, which it did because China was craved by the 8 nations. If that is not political motivated, then I dont know what is?

Please read again, I 'd already answered, China didn't let them.

And please read my question again, I did not ask you whether China let them in, I ask you if US/EU would still invest in China if Political Environment is not unfavourable, yes or no.

You still has not answer this question.

 

[beijingwalker]

First of all, do you know what is the full name for Nazi party?

National Socialism Party

Isn't the same Socialism that give birth to Communism?

Socialist parties won many elections in northern European countries but you don't call them communist countries, we all know how Hitler hated communism and he ascended to power by slaughtering communists, so are you telling me he was a coomunist?

B

And lol, French Revolution have a lot of elitism involve, with religion take a great part of. French Revolution is no where near "grassroot"

.

So Frech revolution was not a grassroots revolution, it's a elite revolution. Ok, whatever you say. and which revolution ddin't have any elites involved?

B
The whole point of Opium War is to force China to align to Western Idea and pull China into western influence, which it did because China was craved by the 8 nations. If that is not political motivated, then I dont know what is?

Opium war was for trade and greed, it's wealth and money oriented. Tell me why those western powers wanted to be in China, it's all so obvious, wealth and greed. But then Chinese government outlawed many of their ilegal business practices.

B

And please read my question again, I did not ask you whether China let them in, I ask you if US/EU would still invest in China if Political Environment is not unfavourable, yes or no.

You still has not answer this question.

Please read again, I'd already did, YES, they definitely will.

 

[KungFuLee]

Socialist parties won many elections in northern European countries but you don't call them communist countries, we all know how Hitler hated communism and he ascended to power by slaughtering communists, so are you telling me he was a coomunist?

Socialist Party now and Socialist Party back in 1930 is different, I am not sure if you aware of that.

Hitler draw a lot of idea form Karl Marx, hence it name its party "National Socialist"

In fact, Hitler hated Communism so much, he made a non-aggression pack with Soviet Union. No, he did not make it with Britain, he did not make it with France or United States.

Get your history right, Hitler hate Jew, and before Israel is a state, the most Jewish Population is in Russia. You can actually argue Hitler Hate everyone but blonde German, which he himself is not.

So Frech revolution was not a grassroots revolution, it's a elite revolution. Ok, whatever you say. and which revolution ddin't have any elites involved?

Go back to my first answer.

October revolution.

And do you even know how much Religion influence on French Revolution? And how big Religion is in Europe at that time?

Opium war was for trade and greed, it's wealth and money oriented. Tell me why those western powers wanted to be in China, it's all so obvious, wealth and greed. But then Chinese government outlawed many of their ilegal business practices.

So, you are saying Opium war have no Political motive, then why the 8 nation crave up China then?

I don't know if you aware, but by saying China outlawed many of illegal business practices, which mean the war is started to negate these movement, which make the war political.

Please read again, I'd already did, YES, they definitely will.

Then please tell me why US/EU did not start investing in 1970s when Nixon started normalise Relationship, or in the 60s, when US and China was actually hostile?