history channel is your source?
Ironical you come up with Sanskrit texts to justify the origin of Tamil which by the way has no mention in any of those texts. What happened to the Tamil texts or language which has supposed to be 7000BC origin?history channel is not my source, my sources are your Hindu scriptures (puranas and ithihasas) i.e Srimad Bhagavatam and Matysa Purana. Off which Srimad Bhagavatam is held at high esteem by Hindus
If you reject these Hindu sources as bullshit than you need to do the same with your belief system
Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 9, TEXTS 2–3
yo ’sau satyavrato nāma
rājarṣir draviḍeśvaraḥ
jñānaṁ yo ’tīta-kalpānte
lebhe puruṣa-sevayā
Satyavrata, the saintly king of Draviḍadeśa who received spiritual knowledge at the end of the last millennium by the grace of the Supreme, later became Vaivasvata Manu, the son of Vivasvān, in the next manvantara [period of Manu]. I have received this knowledge from you. I also understand that such kings as Ikṣvāku were his sons, as you have already explained.
https://prabhupadabooks.com/sb/9/1/2-3?d=1
Satyavrata, the king of pre-ancient Dravida and a devotee of Vishnu, who later was known as Manu was washing his hands in a river when a little fish swam into his hands and pleaded with him to save its life. He put it in a jar, which it soon outgrew. He then moved it to a tank, a river and then finally the ocean but to no avail. The fish then revealed himself to be Vishnu and told him that a deluge would occur within seven days that would destroy all life. The fish told Manu that at the end of Kali yug, the mare who lived at the bottom of the ocean would open her mouth to release a poisonous fire...the fire will burn the whole universe, gods, constellations and everything. The seven clouds of doomsday would then flood the earth until everything was a single ocean. Therefore, the fish instructed Satyavrata to take "all medicinal herbs, all the varieties of seeds, and accompanied by the seven saints”[4] along with the serpent Vasuki and other animals and board a boat that the gods had built
https://www.biodiversityofindia.org...ar_of_Vishnu_-_How_a_fish_saved_the_first_man
Ever wondered why the fish is Pandyan dynasty's (a dynasty that has it origin in Kumari Kandam ) royal emblem ?
Pandyan Royal Emblem
Pandyan Royal Emblem
Heard of Goddess Meenakshi (Tamil - Meenatchi) Temple in Madurai the 3rd and last Pandyan capital of the sangam era (Tamil Meen - fish , Tamil atchi - Rules ) and wondered why she is Pandyan's patron deity
the submerging of Tamils Kumari Kandam continent gets mentioned in Hindu scriptures, you have the choice either accept or reject your religious sources.
Why Ikshvaku's (Rams fore father) ancestrial idol given by the "sun"god is in Sri Rangam Tamilnadu and not in Ayodhya , India ? Connect the dots
Of course source is the issue, because no Tamil source that has Ramayana which is as old as Sanskrit ones, there are no Tamil names, Rama in Sanskrit means one who is lovely and beautiful, Dasharatha means one who can drive chariot in 10 directions. There is no Tamil Ethnicity. As well as Tamil nationalism is not ethno-nationalism, but linguistic nationalism. But Dravidians are an ethnicity that's extends throughout south India.
Tamils dont care who ram is, he is not their god, ram is the god of Hindus. Its the Aryan Brahmanist sanskrit texts, that have mentioned ram's ancestors as Tamils.
Arent these smriti sources valid and considered authoritative in Hinduism. If you reject the smriti , then you need to reject Hinduism. This you can do in your own capacity but no bonafide Hindu leader/scholars will reject the sruti/smriti texts
Tamil religious sources (e.g Dravida Vedas) are only authoritative to Tamil religion, not to Hinduism. Dont confuse the 2 different religious systems.
Srimad Bhagavatam - Canto 9 , source : https://prabhupadabooks.com/sb/9/1/2-3?d=1
yo ’sau satyavrato nāma
rājarṣir draviḍeśvaraḥ
jñānaṁ yo ’tīta-kalpānte
lebhe puruṣa-sevayā
Satyavrata, the saintly king of Draviḍadeśa who received spiritual knowledge at the end of the last millennium by the grace of the Supreme, later became Vaivasvata Manu, the son of Vivasvān, in the next manvantara [period of Manu]. I have received this knowledge from you. I also understand that such kings as Ikṣvāku were his sons, as you have already explained.
According to Matysa Purana the story is :
According to the Matsya Purana, the king of pre-ancient Dravida and a devotee of Vishnu, Satyavrata who later was known as Manu was washing his hands in a river when a little fish swam into his hands and pleaded with him to save its life
https://detechter.com/the-noahs-ark-story-similar-to-matsya-purana-of-vishnu/
What language ram spoke is not the matter of contention. Sanskri text were written much later (probably written between 500 and 200 B.C).
ram is insignificant to Tamils, theres no significant religious works or temples on/for ram in Tamilnadu. Exception being Tamilnadu born ram's Thiagaraja's Telugu ram kritis (hymns) and kamban's Tamil translation of valmiki ramayan.
The major Tamil religious hymns/works are in praise of Tamil gods Siva, Murugan and Vishnu. However, ram is Hindutva (Hindi-Hindu-Hindustan) god of Hindu nationalism
Language vs Race, many 3rd gen NRI kids dont speak Indian langauges, apply the same logic to ram i.e if you have solid evidence that a 7000 yr character spoke the 3000 yrs old imported langauge -
Are rejecting the smiti evidence of ram Tamil (dravidian) root ?
Valmiki Ramayana ( chronology of ram lineage )
ivasvaan kashyapaaj jajne manur vaivastavaH smR^itaH |
sa tu prajaapatiH puurvam ikShvaakuH tu manoH sutaH || 2-110-6
"From Kashyapa, Vivasvan(sun-god) was born. Manu was the son of Vivasvan. Manu for his part, was formerly the lord of creation. Ikshvaku was Manu' s son."
yasya iyam prathamam dattaa samR^iddhaa manunaa mahii |
tam ikShvaakum ayodhyaayaam raajaanam viddhi puurvakam || 2-110-7
"The entire fertile earth was given by Manu to Ikshvaku and know that Ikshvaku was thus the first king of Ayodhya!"
shankhaNasya tu putro abhuut shuuraH shriimaan sudarshanaH |
sudarshanasya agni varNa agni varShasya shiighragaH || 2-110-30
shiighragasya maruH putro maroH putraH prashushrukaH |
prashushrukasya putro abhuud ambariiSho mahaa dyutiH || 2-110-31
ambariiShasya putro abhuun nahuShaH satya vikramaH |
nahuShasya ca naabhaagaH putraH parama dhaarmikaH || 2-110-32
ajaH ca suvrataH caiva naabhaagasya sutaau ubhau |
ajasya caiva dharma aatmaa raajaa dasharathaH sutaH || 2-110-33
The fortunate Sudarshana was the son of Shankhana. Sudarshana's son was Agnivarna; and of Agnivarna was born Shighraga. Shighraga begot Maru and Maru's son was Prashushruva from Prashushruva was born Ambarisha of that great radiance. To Ambarisha was born a son named Nahusha who was full of valour. Nahusha's son was Nabhaga of outstanding virtue. Aja and Suvrata were the two sons of Nabhaga and it was Aja who begot the virtuous King Dasartha."
sa raaghavaaNaam kula dharmam aatmanaH |
sanaatanam na adya vihaatum arhasi |
prabhuuta ratnaam anushaadhi mediniim |
prabhuuta raaShTraam pitR^ivan mahaa yashaaH || 2-110-36
36. mahaayashaH= O, the celebrated one!; sanaatanam= this is the eternal; kuladharmam= tradition of your race; raghuvaaNaam= those born in Raghu dynasty; aatmanaH= yours; saH= as such; naarhasi= and ought not; vihantum= to be violated by you; adya= now; anushaadhi= rule over; mediniim= the earth; prabhuuta ratnaam= abundant with precious metals; prabhuuta raaSTraam= and a vast kingdom; pitR^ivat= as did your father.
"O, the celebrated one! This is the eternal tradition of your race, those born in Raghu dynasty and ought not to be violated by you. Rule over the earth, this vast kingdom abudant with precious metals, as did your father."
http://www.valmikiramayan.net/ayodhya/sarga110/ayodhya_110_frame.htm
Reconcile Valmiki's ramayan with Srimad Bhagavatam
Srimad Bhagavatam - Canto 9 , source : https://prabhupadabooks.com/sb/9/1/2-3?d=1
yo ’sau satyavrato nāma
rājarṣir draviḍeśvaraḥ
jñānaṁ yo ’tīta-kalpānte
lebhe puruṣa-sevayā
Satyavrata, the saintly king of Draviḍadeśa who received spiritual knowledge at the end of the last millennium by the grace of the Supreme, later became Vaivasvata Manu, the son of Vivasvān, in the next manvantara [period of Manu]. I have received this knowledge from you. I also understand that such kings as Ikṣvāku were his sons, as you have already explained.
See diagram below, ram solar dynasty traces its lineage to Manu, Dasaratha is in 63 position followed by ram.
As per Aryan Sanksrit texts (Srimad Bhagavatam and Matsysa purans), he was a Tamil king saved from the great deluge by Vishnu's fish incarnation. This tallies with Tamil sangam sources on Kumari Kandam submergence.
Bhagavad Gita Chapter 4 text 1
sri-bhagavan uvaca
imam vivasvate yogam
proktavan aham avyayam
vivasvan manave praha
manur iksvakave 'bravit
TRANSLATION
The Blessed Lord said: I instructed this imperishable science of yoga to the sun-god, Vivasvan, and Vivasvan instructed it to Manu, the father of mankind, and Manu in turn instructed it to Iksvaku.
Hindu religion (imperishable science of yoga) owes its existence to Tamils via Manu, the father of mankind. Its secondary whether the language of their text is sanksrit or they didnt speak Tamil, the primary source of Hindu religion is Tamil.
ram worshiping the sun dynasty's patron god - Ranganatha (or Vishnu) who is is Tamilnadu (ever wondered why ?)
No texts says Manu is Tamil. Dravidians are not just Tamils.
No, you can't ask a question to my question. Answer where I can find any Tamil texts that's older than 500 BC. Or even Oral traditions that at least gives a time stamp on it's age. Sanskrit have pretty long list of it.
The name Ravana is means one who roars, he used to recite vedas loudly. His family lines are from a Prajapathi who are direct descendends of Lord Brahma. His father was Vaishravana, meaning one who can listen passively and yet retain it. His grand father was Pulasya, hmmm not Tamil Sounding names.
That's not a logical argument. Also, Mahatir is not a Muslim or Arabic name it's the Sanskrit influence in Malay language.
Every region has its won history", but Tamils history, culture and religion is much older the others. Reference Sanskrit sources - Srimad Bhagavatam, Matsya Purana , Garuda Purana etc, repeat the same history - Tamil king Manu, was the first progenitor of humanity and the first man to receive spiritual knowledge. Go figure which should have came first , Manu's Dravidian Tamil or Aryan Sanskrit
sample -Srimad Bhagavatam - Canto 9 https://prabhupadabooks.com/sb/9/1/2-3?d=1
yo ’sau satyavrato nāma
rājarṣir draviḍeśvaraḥ
Satyavrata, the saintly king of Draviḍadeśa who received spiritual knowledge at the end of the last millennium by the grace of the Supreme, later became Vaivasvata Manu, the son of Vivasvān, in the next manvantara [period of Manu]. I have received this knowledge from you. I also understand that such kings as Ikṣvāku were his sons, as you have already explained.
I hope you know the episode of Hindu god Vishnu's Fish incarnation - Matsya Avatar !
References of Kumari Kandam in Puranas and Ancient Tamil Literature Bhagavata-Purana, 10th Skanda.
In Tamil literary works Aintiram, Silappadhikaram, Manimekhalai and SaivamPaayanam and in Sanskrit literary work Bhagavatha Purana, there are information about Tamil sage Mayan, who wrote one of the Tamil Sangam literary works Aintiram, and was part of Tamil Sangams and lived in Kumari Kandam. This sage also wrote other Tamil literature Pranava Vedham (which is called by Vyasa as the predecessor of four Vedas in Bhagavatha Purana), MayaMatham (Book about Architecture, Sculptures and Vasthu) and SuriyaNool (Book about Astronomy and Astrology), one Tamil grammatical work, etc. According to Aintiram, Kumari Kandam was a land which has huge area and the PalThuli river (PalThuli – Divided grammatical form of Pahruli according to Tamil grammar which means many drops), one of the Kumari Kandam rivers, originated from PeruMalai(means big mountain – represents MeruMalai – Meru Mountain). It also tells that there were 49 lands in Kumari Kandam. Tamil literary work SaivamPaayanam gives information about Kumari Kandam and its territories. It also mentions the existence of PeruMalai (MeruMalai – Meru Mountain) in Kumari Kandam.
The Tamil poetic literature Tamil vidu thoothu describes the Topography of Kumari Kandam. It is also said that the Pahruli river was excavated to irrigate the mountain valley by the Pandiyan King Nediyon. The third Sangam literary work Purananooru talks about Kumari Kandam and the river Pahruli which was there in Kumari Kandam. The Tamil Grammar work Nannool talks about the sunken country Kumari Kandam. The Tamil literature SiruKakkaip Paadiniyaar talks about the Kumari Kandam. There are references for Kumari Kandam present in Kantapuranam, which mentions it as one of the nine continents of old times, or one of the nine divisions of India and the only region not to be inhabited by barbarians. According to the Matsya Purana, Manu was the king of Dravidadesa (South Indian country) in Kumari Kandam. There are references for Kumari Kandam present in Garuda Purana. Also, There are scattered references in Sangam literature, such as Kalittokai 104, to how the sea took the land of the Pandiyan Kings, after which they conquered new lands to replace those they had lost.
References of Kumari Kandam (Lemuria) in Chinese & Greek Literature In some of the ancient Chinese chronicles, there are references to Pahruli river, Peru river and Meru Mountain (with 49 peaks) from where the Kumari River, Peru river and Pahruli river were originated (according to Tamil literature). It is said that Chinese laborers were employed by the Pandiyan King and when they went down the mines they appeared like a huge army of small ants. Therefore, they were called pon thondi erumbukal (Gold mining ants). This is also confirmed by ancient Chinese chronicles. Megasthenes (ca. 350 – 290 BCE), a Greek ethnographer and explorer in the Hellenistic period, authored the work Indika, the account of his travels in India. In this work, he says that Taprobane (old name of Sri Lanka) was separated from the mainland (Indian Peninsula) by a river, which means that during the period of Megasthenes, Sri Lanka could have been connected to Indian Peninsula by a small landmass in between them and was divided by Thamirabarani River (Porunai River).
The current Thamirabarani River in Tamil Nadu flows into the sea suggests that the Thamirabarani River would have reached Sri Lanka through a now-submerged landmass existed between Indian Peninsula and Sri Lanka during the period of Megasthenes. Archaeological Data supporting existence of Kumari Kandam archeological findings at Poompuhar The marine archeological findings at Poompuhar (Tamil Nadu) by marine archeological research conducted by the National Institute of Marine Archeology (Goa) reveals that much of the town of Poompugar (Tamil Nadu) was washed away by progressive erosion and a Tsunami around 300 BC.
http://ultadin.com/2015/10/23/ancient-kumari-kandam-the-lost-continent/
Please share with us the great history of the other regions in India and please dont mock your PM, who has officially announced in UN that Tamil is the oldest Language (refer to post #53), thank you
