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HAL's jets costlier than foreign ones

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HAL’s jets costlier than foreign ones, says defence ministry audit

Su-30MKI – the mainstay fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF) which is manufactured by HAL under licence from Russia – is about Rs 150 crore costlier than the ones made in Russia, according to the document, a copy of which has been reviewed by Hindustan Times.
  • Updated: Oct 19, 2018 07:59 IST
    default_author.png

    Sudhi Ranjan Sen
    Hindustan Times, New Delhi
Fighter jets made by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) – the Bengaluru-based defence public sector unit – cost more than the same jets produced abroad by the original equipment manufacturer (OEM), a recent review of the state-owned company by the ministry of defence (MoD) has found.

The department of defence production is studying the document, said an officer aware of the development who did not want to be identified.

Su-30MKI – the mainstay fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF) which is manufactured by HAL under licence from Russia – is about Rs 150 crore costlier than the ones made in Russia, according to the document, a copy of which has been reviewed by Hindustan Times.

“The aircraft produced at HAL comes at a significantly higher cost when compared to direct purchase from the OEM,” the document added.

A Su-30MKI made in Russia cost Rs 269.77 crore whereas one made by HAL in India costs Rs 417.69 crore, almost “Rs 150 crore” more per aircraft, the review said.

Similarly, there is a huge cost difference between the cost of the Hawk trainer aircraft manufactured by British Aerospace and those made HAL.

After long and torturous negotiations, India bought British made Hawk jets to train pilots in 2004. Of the initial 62 Hawk jets, 24 were to be bought in a fly-away condition and the remaining were to be manufactured under licence by HAL. Each Hawk aircraft manufactured Britain in 2004 cost Rs 78 Crore. Those manufactured at HAL would have cost Rs 88 crore that year. The cost Hawk aircraft produced by HAL continued to increase. In 2010, the cost shot-up to Rs 98 crore and in 2016, Rs 153 crore. The difference in price “is primarily due to lesser efficiency and exorbitant man hour rates,” the review has found.

Interestingly, the purchase of 126 Medium Multi-Role Rafale fighters from French Defence manufacturing giant Dassault that was negotiated by the previous government (108 would have been assembled in India by HAL) was scrapped because of high man hour cost at the Indian state-owned company. HAL would have needed 2.7 times more man-hours than the French company for each aircraft.

HAL disagrees with the interpretation of the report. Responding to queries, a spokesperson said “Cost escalation from 2005 (for the Hawk jet) is normal. We also need to take into account the life-cycle cost of each product against off the shelf purchase from overseas. The indigenous benefits, the ecosystem HAL creates for the larger benefit of the country should be factored in also. Importantly, staggered or small orders deny economies of scale to HAL.” HAL also pointed to supply chain issues adding to cost. “Given that multiple agencies get involved in our manufacturing process, kit cost from OEMs and other delays like raw material and spare part supply issues, which are also endemic to the aerospace industry in India, the increase in cost must be evaluated in the right spirit,” the spokesperson added.

The National Democratic Alliance’s decision to enter a $8.7-billion government-to-government deal with France to buy 36 Rafale warplanes made by Dassault was announced in April 2015, with an agreement signed a little over a year later. This replaced the previous United Progressive Alliance regime’s decision to buy 126 Rafale aircraft, 108 of which were to be made in India by the state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd.

The deal has become controversial with the Opposition, led by the Congress, claiming that the price at which India is buying Rafale aircraft now is Rs 1,670 crore for each, three times the Rs 526 crore, the initial bid by the company when the UPA was trying to buy the aircraft. It has also claimed the previous deal included a technology transfer agreement with HAL.

The NDA has not disclosed details of the price, but the UPA deal, struck in 2012, was not a viable one, former defence minister Manohar Parrikar has previously said, implying that it would have never been closed and that, therefore, any comparison is moot. Indeed, the UPA was not able to close the deal till 2014, largely over discussions related to pricing of items not included in the initial bid.

The NDA has said that the current deal also includes customised weaponry.

The deal has also become controversial on account of the fact that one of the offset deals signed by Dassault is with the Reliance Group of Anil Ambani. The Congress claims the earlier deal was scrapped and a new one signed just to provide Ambani this opportunity for an offset deal. Both the government and Reliance have repeatedly denied this.
 
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Production should be privatized. HAL, with it’s inefficient employees, it’s not a shocking news.
 
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Production should be privatized. HAL, with it’s inefficient employees, it’s not a shocking news.
I think it has more to do with jobs, more employees working than required numbers. Hal want maximum people to learn about making such air superiority fighters. A learning curve , which will help India in future. Perfect investment on people, engineers and for everybody involved in this project.
 
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I think it has more to do with jobs, more employees working than required numbers. Hal want maximum people to learn about making such air superiority fighters. A learning curve , which will help India in future. Perfect investment on people, engineers and for everybody involved in this project.

Then they should only confine to R&D, and let private companies take over the production.
 
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HAL’s jets costlier than foreign ones, says defence ministry audit

Su-30MKI – the mainstay fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF) which is manufactured by HAL under licence from Russia – is about Rs 150 crore costlier than the ones made in Russia, according to the document, a copy of which has been reviewed by Hindustan Times.
  • Updated: Oct 19, 2018 07:59 IST
    default_author.png

    Sudhi Ranjan Sen
    Hindustan Times, New Delhi
Fighter jets made by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) – the Bengaluru-based defence public sector unit – cost more than the same jets produced abroad by the original equipment manufacturer (OEM), a recent review of the state-owned company by the ministry of defence (MoD) has found.

The department of defence production is studying the document, said an officer aware of the development who did not want to be identified.

Su-30MKI – the mainstay fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF) which is manufactured by HAL under licence from Russia – is about Rs 150 crore costlier than the ones made in Russia, according to the document, a copy of which has been reviewed by Hindustan Times.

“The aircraft produced at HAL comes at a significantly higher cost when compared to direct purchase from the OEM,” the document added.

A Su-30MKI made in Russia cost Rs 269.77 crore whereas one made by HAL in India costs Rs 417.69 crore, almost “Rs 150 crore” more per aircraft, the review said.

Similarly, there is a huge cost difference between the cost of the Hawk trainer aircraft manufactured by British Aerospace and those made HAL.

After long and torturous negotiations, India bought British made Hawk jets to train pilots in 2004. Of the initial 62 Hawk jets, 24 were to be bought in a fly-away condition and the remaining were to be manufactured under licence by HAL. Each Hawk aircraft manufactured Britain in 2004 cost Rs 78 Crore. Those manufactured at HAL would have cost Rs 88 crore that year. The cost Hawk aircraft produced by HAL continued to increase. In 2010, the cost shot-up to Rs 98 crore and in 2016, Rs 153 crore. The difference in price “is primarily due to lesser efficiency and exorbitant man hour rates,” the review has found.

Interestingly, the purchase of 126 Medium Multi-Role Rafale fighters from French Defence manufacturing giant Dassault that was negotiated by the previous government (108 would have been assembled in India by HAL) was scrapped because of high man hour cost at the Indian state-owned company. HAL would have needed 2.7 times more man-hours than the French company for each aircraft.

HAL disagrees with the interpretation of the report. Responding to queries, a spokesperson said “Cost escalation from 2005 (for the Hawk jet) is normal. We also need to take into account the life-cycle cost of each product against off the shelf purchase from overseas. The indigenous benefits, the ecosystem HAL creates for the larger benefit of the country should be factored in also. Importantly, staggered or small orders deny economies of scale to HAL.” HAL also pointed to supply chain issues adding to cost. “Given that multiple agencies get involved in our manufacturing process, kit cost from OEMs and other delays like raw material and spare part supply issues, which are also endemic to the aerospace industry in India, the increase in cost must be evaluated in the right spirit,” the spokesperson added.

The National Democratic Alliance’s decision to enter a $8.7-billion government-to-government deal with France to buy 36 Rafale warplanes made by Dassault was announced in April 2015, with an agreement signed a little over a year later. This replaced the previous United Progressive Alliance regime’s decision to buy 126 Rafale aircraft, 108 of which were to be made in India by the state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd.

The deal has become controversial with the Opposition, led by the Congress, claiming that the price at which India is buying Rafale aircraft now is Rs 1,670 crore for each, three times the Rs 526 crore, the initial bid by the company when the UPA was trying to buy the aircraft. It has also claimed the previous deal included a technology transfer agreement with HAL.

The NDA has not disclosed details of the price, but the UPA deal, struck in 2012, was not a viable one, former defence minister Manohar Parrikar has previously said, implying that it would have never been closed and that, therefore, any comparison is moot. Indeed, the UPA was not able to close the deal till 2014, largely over discussions related to pricing of items not included in the initial bid.

The NDA has said that the current deal also includes customised weaponry.

The deal has also become controversial on account of the fact that one of the offset deals signed by Dassault is with the Reliance Group of Anil Ambani. The Congress claims the earlier deal was scrapped and a new one signed just to provide Ambani this opportunity for an offset deal. Both the government and Reliance have repeatedly denied this.

Production should be privatized. HAL, with it’s inefficient employees, it’s not a shocking news.
I think that has more to do with supply and demand,HAL has only one customer to supply,may be increase in customer pool would bring down price.
 
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I think that has more to do with supply and demand,HAL has only one customer to supply,may be increase in customer pool would bring down price.

For that we need lobbying, do you have any idea how much money US weapon makers spend on lobbying in US senate and international market?

For that, we need private players to pitch product in India and abroad.
 
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For that we need lobbying, do you have any idea how much money US weapon makers spend on lobbying in US senate and international market?

For that, we need private players to pitch product in India and abroad.
You are right,no matter how much Indian Govt is rich she would always need customer for her products.When it comes to these things desi Govt org are worst,they are not able to pitch their products.
 
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It can be addressed simply. Just stop the concept of Overtime's and OT payments. The employs of Government owned Companies are getting a whooping 70% of shift allowance as OT. This added with the regular salary will fetch anyone a good pay at the end of every month. Then why would someone complete his work on time ??? :hitwall::hitwall::hitwall:

Not just in HAL, GOI should take steps to completely stop the Over Time work system and payments in GOI enterprises. But I guess hardly any trade union including the Ruling BJP trade unions will agree with that. The will immediately start a strike very next day, morons. :(
 
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Production should be privatized. HAL, with it’s inefficient employees, it’s not a shocking news.
It might be cost increase because of avionics or other such component which are being procured from outside Russia?
 
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It might be cost increase because of avionics or other such component which are being procured from outside Russia?

The cost of the equipment are included in the price quote of the aircraft, the price escalation is mostly from the involved man hours. If you look into the Dassault offset clause, the man hours quoted by HAL was more than 3 times than that of Dassault.
 
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It can be addressed simply. Just stop the concept of Overtime's and OT payments. The employs of Government owned Companies are getting a whooping 70% of shift allowance as OT. This added with the regular salary will fetch anyone a good pay at the end of every month. Then why would someone complete his work on time ??? :hitwall::hitwall::hitwall:

Not just in HAL, GOI should take steps to completely stop the Over Time work system and payments in GOI enterprises. But I guess hardly any trade union including the Ruling BJP trade unions will agree with that. The will immediately start a strike very next day, morons. :(

But but but,,,,they r getting invaluable experience of screwdrivering.
Not to mention the ecosystem,,the knowledge,,the base.
Is there anyone else capable?
No private entity can achieve what these dpsus have achievd.
Damn,,solid experience.
They r learning the screwdriver since 70s,,,look how it has helped with tejas n all.
These r the people who will make Suppa tejas n amca n what not.
Future is bright,,,so price is no issue
 
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I think it has more to do with jobs, more employees working than required numbers. Hal want maximum people to learn about making such air superiority fighters. A learning curve , which will help India in future. Perfect investment on people, engineers and for everybody involved in this project.

Lmao, no they're just inefficient, makes sense considering they're the only ones to be the lead integrator.
 
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