Govt. Focuses on Deep Sea Port

[eastwatch]

I would like to ask what credentials does this man have to speak ill of a feasibility report conducted by a Japanese company by recognized and accredited professionals, the links to which I have already posted and they find it feasible. What credentials does this man have to speak the way he is speaking?

Why should we listen to an anonymous man's opinion, who has no known experience in the field, instead of a feasibility report done by a recognized company staffed by professional experts in the field?

Do not ask me about my credentials, but ask your own one. Are you yourself an expert in this field? Now, read a part of feasibility study report that said the following:

"The DRAFT report said the port would revolutionise Bangladesh's trade through sea routes with the South Asian region. And it would help transport of goods to India's seven south-eastern states, Kolkata port and Haldia port, Nepal, Myanmar as well as to Kunmin province of China."
Meanwhile, the report would be placed for an open discussion in the capital tomorrow. ource: http://www.defence.pk/forums/bangladesh-defence/24876-deep-sea-port-making-way-go.html#ixzz2Lg82pdop"

So, my assumption from the beginning is 1) China will not or cannot use this port for its Kunmin Province, because it has no border with BD, and Burma will not allow a transit, 2) Some idiots not only in this forum, but, also in Bangladesh, will keep on sabotageing any prospect of transiting Indian goods for its NE, 3) As a result of this, India will also reciprocate by not allowing transit for goodsbound for Nepal and Bhutan.

Now tell me, how this port will do business without no market in China, Indian NE, Indian east coast, Nepal, Bhutan as well as Burma? Do you think, BD trade alone will suffice to pay dividends for the large investment that the construction and operation will require? These were my questions, was not it? But, one guy replied that just because of Indian objection this port is not being built. But, you supported his illogical and hypocrat views only because he belongs to your own religion-based political outdated ideology. You have a tendency to create a group of your own to bash others who have another viewpoint. This is not good in a discussion forum.

I think, since BNP has revised its stance when BKZ said in India that BNP would allow Indian participation in that port. However, I believe, a political discussion is needed in the country among all the political parties, inside and outside the Parliament, to resolve the issue of giving transit to Indian NE via this port. I believe, ithis port is not viable without Indian use of it.

 

[kalu_miah]

Do not ask me about my credentials, but ask your own one. Are you yourself an expert in this field? Now, read a part of feasibility study report that said the following:

"The DRAFT report said the port would revolutionise Bangladesh's trade through sea routes with the South Asian region. And it would help transport of goods to India's seven south-eastern states, Kolkata port and Haldia port, Nepal, Myanmar as well as to Kunmin province of China."
Meanwhile, the report would be placed for an open discussion in the capital tomorrow. ource: http://www.defence.pk/forums/bangladesh-defence/24876-deep-sea-port-making-way-go.html#ixzz2Lg82pdop"

So, my assumption from the beginning is 1) China will not or cannot use this port for its Kunmin Province, because it has no border with BD, and Burma will not allow a transit, 2) Some idiots not only in this forum, but, also in Bangladesh, will keep on sabotageing any prospect of transiting Indian goods for its NE, 3) As a result of this, India will also reciprocate by not allowing transit for goodsbound for Nepal and Bhutan.

Now tell me, how this port will do business without no market in China, Indian NE, Indian east coast, Nepal, Bhutan as well as Burma? Do you think, BD trade alone will suffice to pay dividends for the large investment that the construction and operation will require? These were my questions, was not it? But, one guy replied that just because of Indian objection this port is not being built. But, you supported his illogical and hypocrat views only because he belongs to your own religion-based political outdated ideology. You have a tendency to create a group of your own to bash others who have another viewpoint. This is not good in a discussion forum.

I think, since BNP has revised its stance when BKZ said in India that BNP would allow Indian participation in that port. I believe, a political discussion is needed in the country among all the political parties, inside and outside the Parliament, to resolve the issue of giving transit to Indian NE via this port. I believe, ithis port is not viable without Indian use of it. However,

I am not claiming to be an expert and questioning this feasibility report, so there is no question on asking for my credentials on this subject. On the other hand, it is you who is claiming to be an expert more than the guys who prepared this report. So please present your credentials, along with details of the report which you are questioning.

However, I have been in export business, so I cited that experience to highlight how important it is for the export business of Bangladesh, which earns the major portion of Bangladesh foreign currency, apart from the manpower export based remittances, which is the other main source of foreign currency. From that experience as an exporter and manufacturer, I know how important it is to reduce shipment time, during import of raw materials and export of finished goods. All BGMEA and BKMEA members, who provide the bulk of manufacturing employment in Bangladesh would agree with my stand.

The feasibility report says clearly that it is feasible and the port should be built, that is all I know. I could not find a copy of that feasibility report yet on the web, and I do not know what assumptions they have used in their report, specifically if they have counted and depended on traffic from India, China or Burma, or whether the feasibility is based purely on Bangladesh traffic. If you have these questions, you should try to find a copy of this report and read it and share it with us. Without a copy of this feasibility report, without looking at the details of what it says, we cannot take claims of someone sitting in Japan and making anonymous posts in a forum with any seriousness. So instead of questioning this report, go and find more details and then come back with whatever reservations you may have with actually what the report says. Before that, without knowing anything about what the report actually says, the validity of the feasibility report stands, and questions from a nobody like you or I are just that, hot air.

 

[kalu_miah]

Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh

Deep seaport: Chinese funding proposal a roadblock?

Published : Sunday, 24 February 2013

Whatever is in the mind of the government, it should make it clear and take appropriate steps to speed up construction instead of footdragging on it. Syful Islam.

Original article published in Dec. 2011
Deep seaport: Chinese funding proposal a roadblock?, Port News, Shipping News, Hellenic Shipping News Worldwide, Online Daily Newspaper on Hellenic and International Shipping

The construction of proposed deep seaport at Sonadia in Cox's Bazar district in the near future seems to have dim prospect as the present government is less interested to receive assistance from China for the project. The offer from state-run China Merchants Holdings International Company Ltd (CMHI) is reportedly being ignored as the officials at the ministry of shipping are not getting green signal from the highest authority of the government. The shipping ministry officials say unless the political bosses take up the issue seriously and respond to the Chinese offer immediately, Bangladesh in the future may experience tough problem in the future to secure fund to construct the planned port. The other development partners are observing how Bangladesh is handling the assistance offer and practically how serious the government is to go forward with the project, the officials said. In 2006, Japanese firm Pacific Consultant International (PCI) first conducted a feasibility study for the proposed seaport. The seaport at the first stage will have five international-standard jetties with the capacity to handle a total of 704.01 million tonnes of containers a year. The cost was then estimated at Tk 600 billion. The government has opted for building a deep-sea port at Sonadia as Chittagong seaport faces worsening congestion. Besides, Bangladesh has plan to make Sonadia a major regional shipping hub, catering to the demands of north-eastern India, Myanmar, Nepal, Bhutan and the southern Chinese province of Yunnan. Bangladesh sought Chinese funding for construction of the deep seaport during Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina's visit to China last year. The Chinese authorities responded positively at that time, but the issue has not seen much progress so far. Chinese ambassador to Bangladesh Zhang Xianyi in September this year said that his country was ready to help Bangladesh set up the deep seaport. The Chinese company sent draft of a memorandum of understanding (MoU) in June this year as part of the decision taken at a meeting with the officials of the Ministry of Shipping (MoS) on May 30 in Dhaka. In the draft of the MoU, the company sought one year time to carry out geographical, administrative and diplomatic assessment of the proposed deep seaport. During the period they will examine both financial and business models of the proposed port to assess its viability. The CMHI officials informed the shipping ministry officials that if the assessment result was found positive, they would sit for negotiations on the possible funding arrangement for the port. However, the CMHI is yet to receive any response from Bangladesh government regarding their proposal. After waiting for a reply for almost six months the Chinese company has wanted to know about Bangladesh's position regarding construction of the deep seaport with Beijing's assistance. In September this year the cabinet committee on economic affairs has sent back for further scrutiny a shipping ministry proposal regarding construction of the deep-sea port under public-private partnership (PPP) initiative. Officials of the shipping ministry said construction of the seaport with Chinese or local funding was a part of the public-private partnership (PPP) bid. Since the cabinet did not response positively regarding construction of the port under the PPP arrangement, taking Chinese help for the project has become uncertain. It was learnt that even the setting up of a deep seaport authority, which is a pre requisite for implementation of the project, still faces various complications. The move to setting up the deep seaport authority has received go ahead of the ministry of finance after waiting there several months. After that months have passed but the process is moving very slowly. Good news is there since two key ministries have offered their no-objection to signing of the MoU with the Chinese state-owned company regarding construction of the deep-sea port. Months back, the shipping ministry had sought opinion of the ministries' and departments concerned about the draft MoU sent by the CMHI whether to move forward in line with the terms and conditions of the MoU.The Economic Relations Division (ERD) of the Ministry of Finance gave the no-objection to the draft MoU without any change of the terms and conditions, while the Ministry of Law insisted on a minor change. Business people saythe construction of a deep seaport is very much necessary for Bangladesh as increased commercial activities and possible use of the Chittagong port by the neighbouring counties as transit point has squeezed the cargo handling capacity of the port. The Chittagong port has now a capacity to handle an aggregate volume of 1.6 million TEUs (twenty feet equivalent units). Against the capacity, it handles now 1.3 million tonnes, leaving a surplus capacity of 0.3 million tonnes a year. On the other hand, the Mongla port has the capacity of handling 50,000 TEUs of containers a year, but only 20,000 TEUs of sea-borne cargoes are now handled by it. Experts said the increasing trend of the country's expanding volume of sea-borne cargo will hardly leave any surplus capacity for using the existing port facilities by others as a transit point within the next three years' time. India wants to use the Chittagong port to carry cargoes to its 'seven sister states' of Arunachal Pradesh, Assam, Manipur, Meghalaya, Mizoram, Nagaland and Tripura. It also wants to use the port for exporting goods from theses states. Nepal and Bhutan are also interested to use the Chittagong and Mongla ports to transit their external trade activities. South Asian nations like Pakistan have deep seaport named Gwadar Port situated at Gwadar in Balochistan province. India has two deep seaports--Dhamra Port and Jawaharlal Nehru Port Trust in Mumbai, and it has three proposed deep seaport named -Krishnapatnam, Vizhinjam International Seaport in Kerala and port of Dahej in Gujarat. Sri Lanka has two deep seaports- Colombo port and newly built Hambantota port and Myanmar has two deep seaports Thilawa port, 25 km south of Yangon and Dawei Port in southern Myanmar. India has another proposed deep seaport named Vizhinjam International Seaport in Kerala, Burma has another deep seaport named Kyaukphyu. Information available show the deep sea port in Dawei of southern Myanmar has the potential to become the gateway to Indo-China and world's biggest industrial estate. The US$8.0 billion project comprising deep-water harbor facilities, an oil refinery and an industrial estate, which the Thai engineering giant will overlook for the next ten years. Officials concerned at the ministry of shipping believe that the number of deep seaports constructed by the South Asian nations as well as the ports under plans has also made the fate of the proposed Sonadia port bleak. They think that since a good number of deep seaports have so far been constructed and some are under planning, none of the other nations will use the deep seaport. So, the port may not be economically viable after construction. Apart from the views they also think that Bangladesh has fallen into the political pressure of neighbouring India and China. This nation hardly can take any decision independently without considering the other's policy. They said if Bangladesh takes Chinese help for the proposed deep seaport, it may antagonise India. So, the government is in a quandary how to go forward with the mega venture. Experts believe that whatever is in the mind of the government, it should make it clear and take appropriate steps about the construction of the deep sea port instead of getting it protracted. It will be beneficial for the people and the country.

Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh

This was already posted on another thread.

 

[idune]

Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh

Deep seaport: Chinese funding proposal a roadblock?

Published : Sunday, 24 February 2013

Whatever is in the mind of the government, it should make it clear and take appropriate steps to speed up construction instead of footdragging on it. Syful Islam.

Original article published in Dec. 2011
Deep seaport: Chinese funding proposal a roadblock?, Port News, Shipping News, Hellenic Shipping News Worldwide, Online Daily Newspaper on Hellenic and International Shipping

Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh

This was already posted on another thread.

I hope by now you realize eastwatch game here is to justify indo-Awami Leage act of stalling the project. His "more study" is just lame excuse that even Awami league regime could not justify. All his excuses had been answered before. He did not have any counter argument on trade and economic justificaton on Bangladesh own needs, lack of capability of Myanmay port etc.

 

[INDIC]

I found the following:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/bangladesh-defence/24876-deep-sea-port-making-way-go.html
http://www.mos.gov.bd/images/TERMS OF REFERENCE.pdf

Proposed Sonadia deep-sea port may be a major vehicle of economic development for Bangladesh, shipping minister | Asian Tribune


China offers to build, fund it

Indian Ocean - South-East Asian Marine Turtle Memorandum of Understanding


Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh
Financial Express :: Financial Newspaper of Bangladesh

Also I found the following (source verified):

Chinese Military Strategy.

In military strategic terms, Sonadia can help China to monitor the sea-lanes from the Persian Gulf as about sixty percent of Chinese energy requirements come from the Persian Gulf and transit along this sea-lane. Such a port could also be of military use to the Bangladesh Navy. Strategically, a deep-sea port could also help China to enter South Asia.

To Deny Strategic Space to India.

China has always resented the growing Indian naval activity in the region. In early 1993, Zhao Nanqi, director of the General Staff Logistics Department of the Chinese Navy, issued a top-secret memorandum that explained in great detail the People Liberation Army (PLA) strategic plans to consolidate control over the South China Sea and the Indian Ocean under the new doctrine of "highsea defence." Zhao stated that In "We can no longer accept the Indian Ocean as only an ocean of the Indians." A naval base of a friendly country in the dominating place of Bay of Bengal would serve china and will help her in lessening the Indian hegemonic designs in the region.

Those sea lanes passes near to our Andaman and Nicobar Islands and Sonadia is useless for militarily for China. It seems author want to make Bangladesh as proxy of China.

 

[eastwatch]

I hope by now you realize eastwatch game here is to justify indo-Awami Leage act of stalling the project. His "more study" is just lame excuse that even Awami league regime could not justify. All his excuses had been answered before. He did not have any counter argument on trade and economic justificaton on Bangladesh own needs, lack of capability of Myanmay port etc.

So, you have very aptly discovered my leaning towards India and AL. But, think of a Mudir Dokan business. You are the owner of that shop but you have rented it out to someone else with a condition that he can open the shop only for three days. Tell me, how he can earn a profit by paying a rent for one full month, but can do business for only thirteen days? Do you really think, since China is not in, therefore, without at least Indian NE and east coast to serve, can BD operate the new port? Can you refute my claim with logic, instead of exposing my deception?

I believe, the govt should prepare a new Economic Feasibility Report based on the real time geo-politics of the region. The previous one was prepared by Pacific Consutants of Japan with infusion of imaginary information forwarded by none other than the GoB. It says about China and Indian NE and east coast. But, under the changed circumstances the GoB should prepare a revised Economic Feasibility Report 2013 and feed the current information in it that reflect the real situation of today. No EFR is a Bible, it can be and should be revised to reflect the real time situation.

@kalu_miah, note one thing. No mother vessel will anchor at Sonadia without a large quantity of goods to load or unload. However, BD traders like you can charter such a large ship for exporting goods. Am I wrong to say large ships are expensive to run and they need large quantity of goods to carry? So, unless this port serves Indian NE and east coast, I believe, there is no way it will become a profitable port. If it is for losing money every year, then why to build it in the first place?

So, I ask you guys not to expose me further as a RAW agent, but, request you to come with logic that reflects the reality of today's geo-politics.

 

[idune]

Do you really think, since China is not in, therefore, without at least Indian NE and east coast to serve, can BD operate the new port? Can you refute my claim with logic, instead of exposing my deception?

Where is your proof and rationale that China will not use port?

Indian NE has very liitle volume requirement as I posted about half a million tonnes, that is insignificant and Bangladesh port is not dependent upon.

You are creating false narrative, how can one refute false statement. Show the proof that China would not need to use Bangladeshi port.

And show how no mother vassel would come to Bangladeshi port.

Show Bangladesh $200 billion trade by the time port comes to operation would not be reason enough for deep sea port.

Until then you are talking vapor justifying port for miniscule indian NE use.

 

[kalu_miah]

So, you have very aptly discovered my leaning towards India and AL. But, think of a Mudir Dokan business. You are the owner of that shop but you have rented it out to someone else with a condition that he can open the shop only for three days. Tell me, how he can earn a profit by paying a rent for one full month, but can do business for only thirteen days? Do you really think, since China is not in, therefore, without at least Indian NE and east coast to serve, can BD operate the new port? Can you refute my claim with logic, instead of exposing my deception?

I believe, the govt should prepare a new Economic Feasibility Report based on the real time geo-politics of the region. The previous one was prepared by Pacific Consutants of Japan with infusion of imaginary information forwarded by none other than the GoB. It says about China and Indian NE and east coast. But, under the changed circumstances the GoB should prepare a revised Economic Feasibility Report 2013 and feed the current information in it that reflect the real situation of today. No EFR is a Bible, it can be and should be revised to reflect the real time situation.

@kalu_miah, note one thing. No mother vessel will anchor at Sonadia without a large quantity of goods to load or unload. However, BD traders like you can charter such a large ship for exporting goods. Am I wrong to say large ships are expensive to run and they need large quantity of goods to carry? So, unless this port serves Indian NE and east coast, I believe, there is no way it will become a profitable port. If it is for losing money every year, then why to build it in the first place?

So, I ask you guys not to expose me further as a RAW agent, but, request you to come with logic that reflects the reality of today's geo-politics.

I personally do not want to get into name calling and I would ask idune Bhai also to maintain the spirit of a good rational debate.

Now about Chinese traffic in Sonadia Deep Sea port, there is no confirmation of it that they considered this traffic, as we do not know what is there in the feasibility report. Do you have a copy, does anyone have a copy and can they post in online as a pdf file? May be Bangladesh shipping ministry will do it, I would hope.

Chinese traffic may or may not come to Sonadia, or it may go to the planned Kyukphyu deep sea port. Myanmar is still in civil war and still there is no end in sight, so no plans should depend on this "possible future" Chinese traffic.

About NE states traffic, Indians have invested in Sittwe port and they will use this shallow port for traffic between Indian ports (like Kolkata) and NE. For inter-India traffic they do not need Sonadia. In fact this presence of Sittwe would be a good justification for Bangladesh to forever close the issue of Transit/corridor (which is a veiled attack on our sovereignty) to NE as India would no longer need this and by sea would be a much cheaper and direct route. As for NE exports bound for third country, I see no problem for them to use Sonadia or Kyukphyu, whichever becomes available sooner and whichever is cheaper option for them. Eventually both options will be available to them and they will use the cheaper and faster option.

Now lets look at some stats:
List of world's busiest container ports - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Twenty-foot equivalent unit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The busiest container port is Shanghai with about 32 million TEU, where as number 50 is Nagoya with 2.6 million TEU. Chittagong already crossed 1.5 million TEU in 2011:
Port of Chittagong - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Chittagong does not have a very small volume of traffic by world standards and it is rapidly growing, considering increasing transfer of labor intensive industries, after China became expensive and there is no cheaper labor country in Asia. Busan, a city I stayed in for about 2 years in many different trips, has a traffic of 16 million TEU. This evening I just drove over two US ports close by with 14 million TEU capacity with millions of containers stacked.

If Koreans with a population of 40 million, can have this amount of traffic, I think eventually in a few decades, our traffic will be much higher. This is why we need a deep sea port and we need it now, to open up potentials for more FDI, more export industries and more development of Bangladesh.

It is not just Deep Sea port in Sonadia, we also need some critical pieces of infrastructure:

- at least a 4 lane highway between major cities, like Dhaka and Chittagong and to this Sonadia port
- a metro rail to relieve traffic congestion in Dhaka
- nuclear power to meet the demand of energy

Once we have these, the sky is the limit. Chinese, Japanese and Koreans will compete to see who can get in here first and take the opportunity.

Now, AL has a history of sabotaging national interest. If I remember correctly AL did the same thing with submarine cable. Because of AL we missed the first one that went near our coast, even Burma got a landing from it and our first fiber landing was delayed for a decade because of AL stupidity (I am guessing this was due to Indian instruction). May be we can open a thread about this.

I am guessing that India does not like this Sonadia port, and AL seems like it is stalling this project. They refused Chinese funds, now they will refuse funds from UAE.

 

[kalu_miah]

Those sea lanes passes near to our Andaman and Nicobar Islands and Sonadia is useless for militarily for China. It seems author want to make Bangladesh as proxy of China.

The author of these words is an officer of Bangladesh Army.

 

[INDIC]

The author of these words is an officer of Bangladesh Army.

See the location of Bangladesh and China's shipping lane passing through Indonesia and India's Andaman Nicobar Islands

 

[kalu_miah]

See the location of Bangladesh and China's shipping lane passing to Malacca straits.

China will seek friendly ports in Bay of Bengal. They may get one in Bangladesh and they may get one in Burma. That is additional reason for them to support Sonadia deep sea port effort. If you feel threatened by China's presence, there is nothing we can do about it.

We may give our ports to other nations as well, for example ASEAN+2 (a future alliance of Japan, Koreas and ASEAN) to balance against the threat from India. I think that is a more likely scenario in the longer term than a Chinese Naval presence in this neighborhood. You should worry about that possibility more than the presence of Chinese, which may or may not happen.

 

[genmirajborgza786]

Those sea lanes passes near to our Andaman and Nicobar Islands and Sonadia is useless for militarily for China. It seems author want to make Bangladesh as proxy of China.

question is if it is that useless for China, then why on earth did the Chinese offer to fund the project in the first place ? the truth is whether we like or not China is indeed interested in both Chittagong & sonadia port. China needs them & they are valuable to them, look whats happening in Maldives do you think China is not involve there? they are investing a'lot on these ports around the Indian ocean regions recent eg: being Hambantota & Gwadar, heck they invested $198 millions just to build gwadar in the initial phrase & now after acquiring it they plan to invest $10 billion more !

 

[INDIC]

question is if it is that useless for China, then why on earth did the Chinese offer to fund the project in the first place ? the truth is whether we like or not China is indeed interested in both Chittagong & sonadia port. China needs them & they are valuable to them look whats happening in Maldives do you think China is not involve their? they are investing a'lot on these ports around the Indian ocean regions recent eg: being Hambantota & Gwadar, heck they invested $198 millions just to build gwadar in initial phrase & now after acquiring it they plan to invest $10 billion more !

That is meant for presence and influence in Indian ocean region but can Sonadia help China to monitor their shipping lanes.

 

[genmirajborgza786]

That is meant for presence and "influence" in Indian ocean region but can Sonadia help China to monitor their shipping lanes.

i believe the answer to that is in your post only

 

[kalu_miah]

That is meant for presence and influence in Indian ocean region but can Sonadia help China to monitor their shipping lanes.

I see now what you are talking about, yes the shipping lanes are far from Sonadia, so it is not good for monitoring. A port in southern part of Myanmar would be far more appropriate. So that line of reasoning by that author is mistaken, but all the other parts are still valid.