Government may shelve Indian Air Force’s $2 billion Avro replacement project

[Echo_419]

I've been saying it for a while now- the defence budget is sufficent in monetary terms but as a direct reuslt of mismanagment the military's modernisation efforts are in a complete shambles. Look at all defence deals pending today- CH-47F, AH-64E, A330 MRTT, M-777, Rafale, S-70B etc for one reason or another all of these deals are YEARS behind schedule and payments should have been made on all of them a long time back, instead the MoD has been RETURNING billions of USD every year to the Fin Min! This is criminal!!!

I will have to agree with you despite being a very strong supporter of the Current govt & the Ruling party they have got a mandate to bring change & they are not moving as fast as they should be

 

[Abingdonboy]

Which brings us to question

How will we manage to sign all these deals simultaneously??
Its not a troll question.

The costs are minimal as they are spread out over 10-15 years so all the above deals could be signed for an upfront cost of only around $2-3 billion (excluding the Rafale).

P75I...the submarine project, is scrapped?

No not scrapped but the tender has been put out.

 

[sancho]

P75I...the submarine project, is scrapped?

The new MoD scrapped the original P75I tender and re-issued it, to divert more licence production deals to privat Indian companies, just as they did it with the LUH tender, which is also scrapped and re-issued.

i may be wrong here but it looks like DM is trying out too many things too quickly. I mean no one would object to Domestic production program, but he must understand and prioritize certain requirements that cannot be delayed any further and take a call even if it does not comply with Make in India theme. Let deals start moving in, technology input and maturing of domestic industry will automatically happen.

Parrikar indeed has an evidently different way of seeing things and he is still in the learning phase of his job, which he admits too and to an extend that's quiet refreshing, but he obviously will make mistakes too.
We have to differ however, the responsible minister for scrapping and re-issuing the LUH and P75I tenders, was part time DM Arun Jaitley, who imo did more than a poor job and disappointed all those who hoped that having Defence and Finance Ministry under him, will be a big push for Indian forces and defence modernisation. Sadly the opposite happend.

 

[Bang Galore]

part time DM Arun Jaitley, who imo did more than a poor job and disappointed all those who hoped that having Defence and Finance Ministry under him, will be a big push for Indian forces and defence modernisation. Sadly the opposite happend.

No money in the coffers during 2014-15. Had the real situation been make known, we would have had a ratings downgrade. The UPA government made an absolute mess of the finances. This government has pretty much cut everywhere, spending on social sector has been heftily cut. Why would you expect defence to be any different? The oil price drop has been a bonanza that saved the government's bacon. Things are looking quite a bit better now and with funding on all the UPA grandiose plans being cut left, right & centre, the finances for big defence buys will slowly start becoming available. Can expect a few in 2015-16 but more in the later part of the year if the economy continues firming up & probably much better in 2016-17.

 

[Armstrong]

@levina - Auntie aap tax kiyun nahin deetiiin deekheiii abbb achaa bhalaa project shelve ho raha hai !

 

[Levina]

@levina - Auntie aap tax kiyun nahin deetiiin deekheiii abbb achaa bhalaa project shelve ho raha hai !

I'm glad that avra replacement project was shelved.
We've C130J which're as good as work horses, and govt has plans to buy more of these. And it makes complete sense to maintain one fleet of planes as it becomes easier to maintain for spares etc.
And my not paying tax has nothing to do with it. Govt questioned IAF and made 'em accountable. Thats what matters!

 

[Capt.Popeye]

What do you do in a single vendor situation? Especially if you have created it by barring HAL. How do you determine the best price? There is quite clearly the worry of the CAG.

There is a far more basic question involved here. Do the Avros really in fact have to be replaced, after they are retired?

 

[Armstrong]

I'm glad that avra replacement project was shelved.
We've C130J which're as good as work horses, and govt has plans to buy more of these. And it makes complete sense to maintain one fleet of planes as it becomes easier to maintain for spares etc.
And my not paying tax has nothing to do with it. Govt questioned IAF and made 'em accountable. Thats what matters!

Itna serious reply !

 

[Levina]

Itna serious reply !

Never expect me to support trolling in this section.
btw did my previous post whoosh over your head??

 

[Armstrong]

Never expect me to support trolling in this section.
btw did my previous post whoosh over your head??

I didn't pay much attention to what you wrote !

 

[Levina]

I didn't pay much attention to what you wrote !

you did not understand it.

 

[Abingdonboy]

I'm glad that avra replacement project was shelved.
We've C130J which're as good as work horses, and govt has plans to buy more of these. And it makes complete sense to maintain one fleet of planes as it becomes easier to maintain for spares etc.
And my not paying tax has nothing to do with it. Govt questioned IAF and made 'em accountable. Thats what matters!

12 four-engined C-130J-30s meant for Special Operations are neither intended to pick up the slack from the 50-odd fleet of Avros once they are retired nor are they able to.

There is a far more basic question involved here. Do the Avros really in fact have to be replaced, after they are retired?

Well of course, the Avro fleet is hardly laying idle right now. The roles they are employed in today will need to be picked up by some a/c in the IAF otherwise there will be a capability gap.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

12 four-engined C-130J-30s meant for Special Operations are neither intended to pick up the slack from the 50-odd fleet of Avros once they are retired nor are they able to.


Well of course, the Avro fleet is hardly laying idle right now. The roles they are employed in today will need to be picked up by some a/c in the IAF otherwise there will be a capability gap.

While it may seem nice to have a precise replacement for the Avros; it may even feel like a luxury..... considering that resources have to be judiciously employed. The IAF is not going to get all that they want to get. Then again; with the C-130 Herk fleet certain to be augmented in time (but in phases), all that the Avros can do will be done by the mix of An-32 UPGs and Herks. Not to overlook that the Avro is not really even a specialist aircraft fulfilling a very specialist role. BTW, I'm not even counting in the various projected transport aircraft projects completely. I think that the Avro replacement idea may not remain standing. The last RM bought into the proposal more because of his usual 'knee-jerk and ad-hoc MO' The present one will (and will have to) tighten many belts. Laissez-faire time is running out.

 

[Genesis]

Since C-130 was mentioned, isn't India and Russia working on a joint medium transport, can't you guys just buy more of that. I mean why develop it, if all you are going to do is buy some and not support the domestic brand, it's not free to develop it.

 

[Echo_419]

Since C-130 was mentioned, isn't India and Russia working on a joint medium transport, can't you guys just buy more of that. I mean why develop it, if all you are going to do is buy some and not support the domestic brand, it's not free to develop it.

We could but the aircarft we are developing with Russia is simply to advanced for the role Avros are performing.The Avro aircraft are the low end part of the transportation fleet & MTA will make up the high end so it makes little sense to use such advanced aircraft for simple low end tasks also to costly