Gantz Tells Saudi Paper: Jerusalem is Big Enough for a Palestinian Capital

[PeaceGen]

So, Who has monopoly over violence in Palestine/Israel?
If Israelis want peace, they can enforce peace(of course based on your reply to the above), how? By recognizing even unilaterally a state for Palestinians and their right to a capital in Jerusalem, since Palestinians ARE NOT even a party to current talks and bonhomie.
And, I thought you were perhaps more informed than you have just demonstrated... Palestinians have no rights to the infrastructure, water or land... Israelis can literally choose at their leisure on where they'd build their next settlement and divert resources in that direction besides taking down ancient farms and controlling water supply. In Gaza any property, tunnel or infrastructure developed over years can be turned into rubble.
About control of firearms, same doesn't apply to settlers who terrorize and murder with impunity and your resolution expects Palestinians to resign themselves to servitude and implore their masters for mercy, decency and humanity, gandhi redux!

This would be my last, Goodluck!

The Palestinians have been fighting the "invaders" since they arrived. Instead of being good neighbors right from the start, they chose to try to make war on the Israelis. The same happened to the American Indians, back in the days of the great migrations from Europe into North-America. It took *them* about 150 years or so to make it into US politics.
I challenge the Palestinians (and the Israelis) to do better, to seek cooperation with Israelis from hence forth, and to form a regional unity of 2 countries (Israel, Palestine) that can actually provide peace, stability (absence of daily fear over conflicts), and prosperity to their populations!

But as i said before, the Israelis have proven themselves victorious time after time. Then it *does* make sense for the Palestinians to show signs of surrender, *on the military level*, at least. They can be assertive about their rights in other ways too. I've indicated a few of those ways in an earlier post already.

This will be *my* last.. Let's agree to disagree, for now.

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

The Palestinians have been fighting the "invaders" since they arrived. Instead of being good neighbors right from the start, they chose to try to make war on the Israelis.

But as i said before, the Israelis have proven themselves victorious time after time. Then it *does* make sense for the Palestinians to show signs of surrender, *on the military level*, at least. They can be assertive about their rights in other ways too. I've indicated a few of those ways in an earlier post already.

This will be *my* last.. Let's agree to disagree, for now.

So my bad, this does warrant a response, especially since it is based on deceit, propaganda and typical of Israeli talking points. Remember before Israelis launched their state, they(zionists) were moving in Palestinian land buying properties from unsuspecting, unscrupulous and reckless populations that put money above their better judgment and calls for almost half a century to usurp their land for a state as a mandate from heaven as a conspiracy. Guess what, hindsight is 20/20 and better judgment failed!
So, Palestinians were more than better neighbors, they were sleeping neighbors accepting as they thought refugees fleeing pogroms and Antisemitism in Europe and Russia.

To your last part, alas Palestinians cannot match neither the impunity nor weaponry in their defence. You have demonstrated once more that you're anything but a unconcerned onlooker merely interested in peace... but I do now understand your reasoning, in case of a home invasion you would be a docile and servile drone and show gratitude to your new master and surrender all rights to your and your parents, grandparents property...

Nice jaunt, now continue on your merry way!

 

[PeaceGen]

So my bad, this does warrant a response, especially since it is based on deceit, propaganda and typical of Israeli talking points. Remember before Israelis launched their state, they(zionists) were moving in Palestinian land buying properties from unsuspecting, unscrupulous and reckless populations that put money above their better judgment and calls for almost half a century to usurp their land for a state as a mandate from heaven as a conspiracy. Guess what, hindsight is 20/20 and better judgment failed!
So, Palestinians were more than better neighbors, they were sleeping neighbors accepting as they thought refugees fleeing pogroms and Antisemitism in Europe and Russia.

To your last part, alas Palestinians cannot match neither the impunity nor weaponry in their defence. You have demonstrated once more that you're anything but a unconcerned onlooker merely interested in peace... but I do now understand your reasoning, in case of a home invasion you would be a docile and servile drone and show gratitude to your new master and surrender all rights to your and your parents, grandparents property...

Nice jaunt, now continue on your merry way!

yes, actually.

in case of a home invasion too, it is better to give the invader what he wants, if you're unable to defeat him.
it's better to stay alive and healthy.

and Jews and Israelis generally speaking respect the rights of Arabs and Muslims. (especially those who recognize to hold the state of Israel in existence and prosperity, which is only natural).

it is people like *you* who keep saying that the Palestinians are right to fight the "invaders" with that futile violence. Not even the concerted effort during the 6 day war could defeat the Israelis and their western backers.
Shame on you and all those who think like you do. You stand in the way of peace and prosperity for Israeli *and* Palestinians alike!

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Hmm... I don't know how you made that deduction... So until I figure it out where you're coming from and what you understood of what I mentioned above there is a disconnect and no further extrapolation.

Explain it in laymen terms. I'm a bit slow you see.




The Palestinians deserve EVERYTHING that's coming to them for loving and embracing those who call for the death and destruction of the Pakistani nation and people. To hell with the ALL.....................:


View attachment 698461

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

yes, actually.

in case of a home invasion too, it is better to give the invader what he wants, if you're unable to defeat him.
it's better to stay alive and healthy.

and Jews and Israelis generally speaking respect the rights of Arabs and Muslims. (especially those who recognize to hold the state of Israel in existence and prosperity, which is only natural).

it is people like *you* who keep saying that the Palestinians are right to fight the "invaders" with that futile violence. Not even the concerted effort during the 6 day war could defeat the Israelis and their western backers.
Shame on you and all those who think like you do. You stand in the way of peace and prosperity for Israeli *and* Palestinians alike!

Me? Of all people! While peace junkies like you want to shove an agenda down people's throat and want them to swallow it... where spitting it out would be a natural response.
While you enjoy "peace" and yet side with oppression and oppressors, and duke out infantile polemics to those who don't toe the line. As I said above, you're only deluding yourself if you're playing to the gallery and expect impartial benevolence from an unconcerned party.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction, though it may take time.

Qur'an(55:60)
هَلْ جَزَاءُ الْإِحْسَانِ إِلَّا الْإِحْسَانُ
Is there any reward for good other than good?

 

[PeaceGen]

Me? Of all people! While peace junkies like you want to shove an agenda down people's throat and want them to swallow it... where spitting it out would be a natural response.
While you enjoy "peace" and yet side with oppression and oppressors, and duke out infantile polemics to those who don't toe the line. As I said above, you're only deluding yourself if you're playing to the gallery and expect impartial benevolence from an unconcerned party.
Every action has an equal and opposite reaction, though it may take time.

Qur'an(55:60)
هَلْ جَزَاءُ الْإِحْسَانِ إِلَّا الْإِحْسَانُ
Is there any reward for good other than good?

i still believe the Palestinians are better off with a peaceful resistance strategy, than with a violent resistance one. But let's agree to disagree, ok

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

Explain it in laymen terms. I'm a bit slow you see.




The Palestinians deserve EVERYTHING that's coming to them for loving and embracing those who call for the death and destruction of the Pakistani nation and people. To hell with the ALL.....................[emoji317]:


View attachment 698461

Very simple, change the narrative... don't be hung up on the rules... rule makers have it rigged in their favor(be a rule maker, an alternative). Think out the box and play to win.
Finally, Kashmir resolution lies in disintegration of India(plain and simple) and Indians would be better for it(since they'd seize to be a pawn)... one cannot rest Kashmir from a functional state sitting right next door(when it doesn't play by the same rules) that is simultaneously planning your very destruction as a policy and a gravitational pull for national cohesion, at times supplanting one boogeyman with another.

Cannot make it more apparent than this even if I tried.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Very simple, change the narrative... don't be hung up on the rules... rule makers have it rigged in their favor. Think out the box and play to win.
Finally, Kashmir resolution lies in disintegration of India(plain andsimple) and Indians would be better for it(since they'd seize to be a pawn)... one cannot rest Kashmir from a functional state sitting right next door(when it doesn't play by the same rules) that is simultaneously planning your very destruction as a policy and a gravitational pull for national cohesion, at times supplanting one boogeyman with another.

Cannot make it more apparent than this even if I tried.

Very simple, change the narrative... don't be hung up on the rules... rule makers have it rigged in their favor(be a rule maker, an alternative). Think out the box and play to win.
Finally, Kashmir resolution lies in disintegration of India(plain and simple) and Indians would be better for it(since they'd seize to be a pawn)... one cannot rest Kashmir from a functional state sitting right next door(when it doesn't play by the same rules) that is simultaneously planning your very destruction as a policy and a gravitational pull for national cohesion, at times supplanting one boogeyman with another.

Cannot make it more apparent than this even if I tried.

Agreed.

 

[Falcon29]

i'd argue that the Palestinians don't need Hamas to lead them (they need a more moderate party to do that), and that they don't need a defense force of their own.

the rest is up to demonstrations and negotiations, diplomacy over antagonism.

Hamas is a gift from God, we love and support our government(they are moderate by the way). You're living comfortably in the Netherlands protected by the Royal Armed Forces of the Netherlands and more importantly by the biggest military organization in the world(NATO) which is deterring enemies from destabilizing Europe and pillaging its resources. Yet you're telling us we shouldn't have a defense force. This is logic being thrown out the window. Without a defense force , Gaza will become colonized like the West Bank and Israel will accelerate it's last phases of colonizing the West Bank as well.

 

[Falcon29]

I believe my plan to see the Palestinians focus on construction of civilian infrastructure, farming, and water production (from seawater, on sunlight), and move their territories to the East, should be given thorough and reasonable consideration, before it is rejected.

You realize development occurs in all fields. You can develop civilian infrastructure and military infrastructure as well, as well as government infrastructure. Are you familiar with the concept of a state? A state needs a military and a government to secure and run it. How do you think America exists and Europe? You know you guys have governments, right? These governments put aside funds for both the general budget and defense budget.

And Palestinians are no different, we have a state budget that is designed to fund infrastructure, development, projects, and government. As well as a separate budget for defense. We have good Universities and lots of talented people but they can't get any funding to put that talent into work because of the Israeli occupation in the West Bank and the Israeli siege in Gaza.

You also cannot do infrastructure work for desalination plants in Gaza because of the Israeli military siege, and how they will refuse to allow us to do any work or refuse imports of fuel necessary to get such a plant working. They also steal our water resources in the West Bank:

To control water resources in these two areas, these resources have, since June 1967, been placed under the responsibility of the Department for Water Allocation and Certification of Israeli Water Commission.6/


By drilling artesian wells within the pre-June 1967 borders, Israel has been pumping and siphoning off underground waters of the West Bank. Before 1967, Israel had been pumping away of the West Bank's total water supply some 500 million cubic metres annually by means of artesian wells drilled in Israel. This constituted approximately one-third of Israel's annual water consumption before 1967 and it constituted five-sixths of the West Bank waters.7/ This explains the considerable importance the Israeli Government attaches to control of the aquifer along the western slopes of the West Bank.8/


Any faster pumping would lower the water table below sea level, making the water highly saline and unsuitable for human use.


Since June 1967, Israel has pursued an intensive settlement policy in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip; within this policy many Jewish settlements, mainly agricultural, have been established.


Israel's political attitude towards the political future of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip, its rejection of the establishment of a Palestinian state on them and its insistence on retaining them appear to be partially attributable to the water factor in these Palestinian territories. Water resources in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip play an important role in shaping Israel's conception of the autonomy for these territories. It would seem to be difficult for Israel to accept a political settlement in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip that would result in its relinquishing of its control over water resources in these territories.

Israel's Policy on the West Bank Water Resources - CEIRPP/DPR study (1980) - DPR publication - Question of Palestine

ISRAEL'S POLICY ON THE WEST BANK WATER RESOURCES Prepared for, and under the guidance of the Committee on the Exercise of the Inalienable Rights of the Palestinian People UNITED NATIONS New York, 1980 TABLE OF CONTENTS Foreword Quantities of Water Israel's Policy on the West Bank Waters...

www.un.org

@PeaceGen

Here's some pictures from Hamas's governance of Gaza, mind you under a military and financial siege:

 

[Falcon29]

@PeaceGen

Some of our Universities in Gaza:

 

[Falcon29]

@PeaceGen

Photos of our cities in the West Bank:

 

[mqur1963]

MEDINA IS EMPTY IT IS START OF 3RD WW IT IS COMING SOON

 

[PeaceGen]

@Falcon29 thank you for the beautiful pictures of Palestine, i guess.

however, i must protest your support of Hamas as a legitimate *defense* force.

https://www.google.com/search?q=hamas+aggression&oq=hamas+aggression+&aqs=chrome..69i57.9359j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

https://www.google.com/search?ei=eWPhX9zOF43bkgWXqLjQBg&q=hamas+violence+against+israel&oq=hamas+violence+against+israel&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzoECAAQRzoICAAQyQMQkQI6BQgAEJECOgIIADoFCAAQyQM6BAgAEAo6BggAEBYQHjoCCC46CAghEBYQHRAeOgUIIRCgAToECCEQFToHCCEQChCgAVCByAlY7IEKYNSECmgEcAN4AIABXogBng2SAQIyOZgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXrIAQjAAQE&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwic7-vAzuDtAhWNraQKHRcUDmoQ4dUDCA0&uact=5

Does Hamas recognize Israel?
The 2017 charter accepted for the first time the idea of a Palestinian state within the borders that existed before 1967 and rejects recognition of Israel which it terms as the "Zionist enemy". It advocates such a state as transitional but also advocates "liberation of all of Palestine".

Hamas Covenant - Wikipedia

i believe a defense force can not be legitimate if it desires the destruction of their neighbor.

and i'm not saying the Israelis are perfect. but all of their so-called oppression, all of their so-called stiffling of the Palestinian economy and governance, is in my view a direct result of the long standing Arab/Muslim desire to see Israel disappear into the sea..