France will hand back the payment to Russia in case of non delivery of the Mistrals

[Gabriel92]

@flamer84 I'm sure they won't be delivered to them.

"All assumptions" regarding the delivery of the Mistral will be discussed during his meeting with Putin, says Francois Hollande.
To an exit in the crisis of Russian Mistral? "All assumptions" regarding the delivery of the Mistral will be discussed during his meeting with Putin in Yerevan scheduled for Friday, Hollande said Tuesday at a joint press conference with his Ukrainian counterpart Petro Poroshenko.
"And for the moment I said, Mistral of delivery is not in the context that we know possible." "If the ships do not come, I do not see how they can be paid, it's a simple concept (...) According to the different assumptions, you will pay or hand back the money" he added.

No compensation

France has suspended last year for an indefinite period of delivery of the first of the two buildings Projection and Command (BPC) bought by Russia under a contract of 1.2 billion euros, due to the Moscow's role in the Ukrainian crisis.

On the Russian television, Putin described the refusal to deliver the Mistral "bad sign." "The French are well-educated people, they will make us money. We will not charge fines, extravagant compensation. But the money spent must be repaid," he added.

Mistral : la France remboursera la Russie en cas de non-livraison, Aéronautique - Défense

 

[munchkin]

@flamer84 I'm sure they won't be delivered to them.

"All assumptions" regarding the delivery of the Mistral will be discussed during his meeting with Putin, says Francois Hollande.
To an exit in the crisis of Russian Mistral? "All assumptions" regarding the delivery of the Mistral will be discussed during his meeting with Putin in Yerevan scheduled for Friday, Hollande said Tuesday at a joint press conference with his Ukrainian counterpart Petro Poroshenko.
"And for the moment I said, Mistral of delivery is not in the context that we know possible." "If the ships do not come, I do not see how they can be paid, it's a simple concept (...) According to the different assumptions, you will pay or hand back the money" he added.

No compensation

France has suspended last year for an indefinite period of delivery of the first of the two buildings Projection and Command (BPC) bought by Russia under a contract of 1.2 billion euros, due to the Moscow's role in the Ukrainian crisis.

On the Russian television, Putin described the refusal to deliver the Mistral "bad sign." "The French are well-educated people, they will make us money. We will not charge fines, extravagant compensation. But the money spent must be repaid," he added.

Mistral : la France remboursera la Russie en cas de non-livraison, Aéronautique - Défense

Good decision. Russia never should have gone for Mistral in the first place. Self sufficiency is the name of the game.

 

[Gabriel92]

Good decision. Russia never should have gone for Mistral in the first place. Self sufficiency is the name of the game.

The "Ivan Gren" and the Admiral Vladimir Vysotskiy don't agree with you.

 

[munchkin]

The "Ivan Gren" and the Admiral Vladimir Vysotskiy don't agree with you.

These ships are not priority. They are not surface combatants. Russia has plenty of ways to transport troops. Priority is on modernizing destroyers and frigates and subs.

The first Ivan Gren commissions this year and the second one has been ordered.

 

[Gabriel92]

These ships are not priority. They are not surface combatants. Russia has plenty of ways to transport troops. Priority is on modernizing destroyers and frigates and subs.

The first Ivan Gren commissions this year and the second one has been ordered.

The Russian navy needs modernisation concerning all kind of ships.
The Mistral isn't just to transport troops and helicopters,but is also a floating headquarter to conduct the operations,if i remember,a Russian general said concerning the Mistral "What we've done in 5 days,we could have done it in 5 hours"
Maybe they have ordered Mistrals for fun.

 

[munchkin]

The Russian navy needs modernisation concerning all kind of ships.
The Mistral isn't just to transport troops and helicopters,but is also a floating headquarter,if i remember,a Russian general said concerning the Mistral "What we've done in 5 days,we could have done it in 5 hours"
Maybe they have ordered Mistrals for fun.

Mistral is not important. It's merely an amphibious assault ship. Russia has cruisers that can serve as flagships.

 

[Hindustani78]

France's Hollande moots cancellation of Mistral deal with Russia | Zee News
Last Updated: Thursday, April 23, 2015 - 00:57


Paris: French President Francois Hollande on Wednesday explicitly evoked the cancellation and reimbursement of a frozen contract to sell Mistral helicopter carriers to Russia two days before meeting with Vladimir Putin.


Paris suspended the delivery of the warships last year after Europe decided to impose sanctions against Russia over the separatist conflict in neighbouring Ukraine.

"On the Mistrals, all options will be addressed," Hollande told journalists after meeting Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Hollande and Putin are due to meet on Friday in Armenia.

"At the moment, as I have said, the Mistral delivery is not possible in the current context," Hollande added.

"If the ships aren`t delivered, I don`t see how they can be paid for, it`s a pretty simple principle ... Under various scenarios, you have payment or reimbursement."

Last week, Putin said Moscow would not impose penalties against France over a failure to fulfil the 1.2 billion euro ($1.29 billion) contract but said all costs incurred by Russia should be reimbursed by Paris.

France has come under pressure from Western allies such as the United States and Poland not to go ahead with the deliveries, which risks putting the contract in legal limbo.

Polish Defence Minister Tomasz Siemoniak said in January he was "counting on" France cancelling the Russian Mistral contract outright.

Officials from both sides have denied a direct link between the Mistrals and Poland`s decision on Tuesday to name the Caracal EC725 of Airbus Helicopters its preferred choice in a $3 billion utility helicopter tender, dropping U.S. and Italian competitors.

Kremlin foreign policy adviser Yuri Ushakov told reporters at a briefing in Moscow on Wednesday: "The Mistrals matter could be touched on at the meeting in Yerevan (Armenia) though there are many other questions to discuss, above all Ukraine."

Separately, a French diplomatic source familiar with the negotiations said the Mistral deal was "in the hands of lawyers" looking for a way out acceptable for both parties.

($1 = 0.9325 euros)

 

[vK_man]

Good .Now France's reputation is ruined. Now India should bargain even harder with the French on Rafale deal. French arms industry will be desperate if indian order is cancelled.

 

[Gabriel92]

Good .Now France's reputation is ruined. Now India should bargain even harder with the French on Rafale deal. French arms industry will be desperate if indian order is cancelled.

Our reputation is so ruined,that our exports have risen by 17.3%... (At 8 billions€)
And this year begins very well : Egyptian deal (~5 billions€),The Polish deal (~2.5 billions € ),and probably the Indian order (~3-4 billions€ ).
India won't,they really need modern fighters,so no.
Lol,i remember some months ago Russians saying no one will trust us bla bla bla.

 

[vK_man]

Our reputation is so ruined,that our exports have risen by 17.3%... (At 8 billions€)
And this year begins very well : Egyptian deal (~5 billions€),The Polish deal (~2.5 billions € ),and probably the Indian order (~3-4 billions€ ).
India won't,they really need modern fighters,so no.
Lol,i remember some months ago Russians saying no one will trust us bla bla bla.

wrong again.

Mistral deal scandal made us reduce our commitment from 126 fighters worth 20 billion$ to 34 fighters for 3.8 billion$.

Yes from 126 fighters originally before mistral scandal to 63 fighters and then 34 only. From 22 to 15 to 3.8 billion$. . And without the indian deal dassault will be bankrupt .
-----------------------------------
France risks losing a contract to supply 126 fighter jets to India due to its refusal to deliver Mistral-class ships to Russia, a leading French analyst told the Delovoi Peterburg website. French officials said this week that they will not deliver the first Mistral-class amphibious warship that Russia had ordered as part of a $1.7 billion agreement for weapons sale.

The biggest repercussion would be a loss of reputation for France as a reliable supplier, Arnaud Dubien, a Russia research associate at the Institut de relations Internationales et Strategiques said. “Officials from the French Ministry of Defence, in private conversations acknowledge that if they fail to deliver the Mistral to Russia, then France will lose its contract to supply 126 fighter jets to India,” Dubien said.

Dubien believes that the decision of French President Francois Hollande, to suspend the delivery of the Mistral, is not final, and was taken under tremendous pressure from the United States and Germany. He added that a final decision would be taken by November on the delivery of the warships, and a lot would depend on how the situation in Ukraine panned out.

A source in the Indian Defence Ministry said that India was “watching the developments closely.” The source added it was too early to say if this would factor into the government’s decision to sign a contract. “When such a large amount of money is paid and then a supplier uses geopolitics to delay or suspend deliveries, it does raise eyebrows,” the source, who was not authorised to talk to the media, said. The Indian Ministry of Defence could not be immediately reached for official comment.

India is continuing its final negotiations for acquiring 126 French Rafale fighters in a deal that would cost around $22 billion. France’s Dassault Aviation won a bid to supply India with Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircrafts and a final contract is being dubbed as the “mother of all deals,” by many sections of the Indian media. Russia, Britain, the U.S. and Sweden have all made attempts to re-enter the race to sell their aircrafts.

Indian Air Chief Marshal Arup Raha told the Hindustan Times that a deal for the Rafale is “going to happen soon.” Industry watchers in Delhi however say that there will be growing pressure to reconsider France given the volte-face the country made this week when it came to the supply of the Mistral ships to Russia.

Mistral row: France risks losing Rafale contract in India | Defenceradar News


And now only 36 fighters lol.

NEW DELHI: India will now negotiate direct purchase of 36 Rafale jets from France through a government-to-government deal worth around $4 billion, without any "Make in India" or technology transfer component, to meet IAF's urgent "critical operational necessity" for new fighters
Direct purchase of 36 fighters will alter original Rafale deal - The Times of India

 

[Gabriel92]

wrong again.

Mistral deal scandal made us reduce our commitment from 126 fighters worth 20 billion$ to 34 fighters for 3.8 billion$.

Yes from 126 fighters originally before mistral scandal to 63 fighters and then 34 only. From 22 to 15 to 3.8 billion$.

The order hasn't been reduced because of the Mistral "scandal",you are wrong.
Then,show a source to back your claims.

And without the indian deal dassault will be bankrupt .

Dassault survived many years without your order,and if you don't order the rafale,Dassault will not be bankrupt....
Egypt and Qatar have signed deals for Rafale,and probably soon UAE so... (and don't forget the 5th tranche for the French air force,so no.)

 

[vK_man]

Officials from the French Ministry of Defence, in private conversations acknowledge that if they fail to deliver the Mistral to Russia, then France will lose its contract to supply 126 fighter jets to India,” Dubien said.

Yep. France lost 126 fighter order. Reduced to 36 fighters. Only because French surrender too fast.

 

[Desertfalcon]

Right. The reduction in the Rafale order had zero to do with Russia's Mistral deal.

"The deal was stalled from disagreements over the fighter production in India. Dassault refused to take responsibility for the 108 HAL-manufactured Rafales, as it had reservations about the ability of HAL to accommodate the complex manufacturing and technology transfers of the aircraft. Instead, Dassault said it would have to negotiate two separate production contracts by both companies. The Indian Defence Ministry instead wanted Dassault to be solely responsible for the sale and delivery of all 126 aircraft"

Dassault Rafale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Gabriel92]

Officials from the French Ministry of Defence, in private conversations acknowledge that if they fail to deliver the Mistral to Russia, then France will lose its contract to supply 126 fighter jets to India,” Dubien said.

Yep. France lost 126 fighter order. Reduced to 36 fighters. Only because French surrender too fast.

That was denied by Indian officials.

@Desertfalcon

NEW DELHI, November 27 (Sputnik) — India is not planning to cancel the deal on purchasing French Rafale jets despite earlier media reports that it would do so if France refuses to deliver Mistral helicopter carriers to Russia, a high-ranking source in Indian Defense Ministry told Sputnik Thursday.

India Denies Reports That it Will Cancel French Rafale Jet Deal / Sputnik International

The order has been reduced because the negociations blocked on the ToT and the Rafale built in India if i remember.

Dassault got what they wanted since the begining. They wanted India to buy Rafale built in France without giving ToT.
You aren't the first person to say "surrender" bla bla bla,because you have nothing to say.

 

[vK_man]

Right. The reduction in the Rafale order had zero to do with Russia's Mistral deal.

"The deal was stalled from disagreements over the fighter production in India. Dassault refused to take responsibility for the 108 HAL-manufactured Rafales, as it had reservations about the ability of HAL to accommodate the complex manufacturing and technology transfers of the aircraft. Instead, Dassault said it would have to negotiate two separate production contracts by both companies. The Indian Defence Ministry instead wanted Dassault to be solely responsible for the sale and delivery of all 126 aircraft"

Dassault Rafale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

american telling an indian lol. My brother works in the defence ministry. Almost all deals are based on geopolitics and corruption kickbacks .The reason why India has preferred Russia and France because they don't bend to geopolitical pressure .but the frogs did .and wikipedia lol.

the official story =dassault is too expensive And India will prefer the Su-30 MKI to cover for rafale shortfall.Unofficial one, Indian Defence ministry was unnerved by seeing French bend under pressure.

That was denied by Indian officials.

@Desertfalcon



The order has been reduced because the negociations blocked on the ToT and the Rafale built in India if i remember.

Dassault got what they wanted since the begining. They wanted India to buy Rafale built in France without giving ToT.
You aren't the first person to say "surrender" bla bla bla,because you have nothing to say.

yes from 22 billion$ to 3.8 billion$ . Dassault got fucked indeed. The mistral it had consequences for France.

India Will Buy 36 Rafale Jets in Fly-Away Condition From France, Says PM Modi
India Will Buy 36 Rafale Jets in Fly-Away Condition From France, Says PM Modi

Tsk tsk. Consequences indeed.

Keep surrendering!!!!!