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For Saudis, U.S. arms deal is a challenge

HAIDER

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RIYADH, Saudi Arabia, Oct. 26 (UPI) -- U.S. plans to sell Saudi Arabia advanced weapons systems worth $60 billion to counter Iran could turn out to be more of a problem than a panacea.

The Saudis, unlike the Israelis, have always had problems absorbing high-tech Western systems since they began buying state-of-the-art war machines in the 1970s.

Right now, they already have more top-line equipment than they can effectively use, such as an air force with more aircraft than it has front-line pilots or commanders able to deploy them in combat.

Saudi Arabia traditionally bankrolls part of Pakistan's military purchases and in return gets experienced Pakistan pilots to fly its U.S. and British combat jets, as well as seasoned naval personnel to run its two-sea navy.

"Militarily … Riyadh's challenge is not a matter of hardware: Saudi Arabia already fields a broad spectrum of some of the highest-end and most modern military equipment in the region," the U.S. global security consultancy Stratfor commented.

"Instead, its challenge is fielding that hardware. With deliveries years away, the new deal will do little to balance the resurgent Iranian regime in the near-term, and prolongs Saudi Arabia's heavy dependence on U.S. defense support."

It could take a decade for the Americans to deliver the package of Boeing F-15 Eagle fighters, Boeing AH-64D Apache Longbow helicopter gunships and precision-guided munitions to the Saudis.

So it's unlikely the Iranians are quaking in their boots at the prospect of their main rival in the Persian Gulf region being deluged with top-line weaponry.

And, in the end, it is doubtful that it will make Saudi firepower any more potent than it is already unless the Saudis upgrade its military leadership and doctrine and develop professional cadres able to use high-tech weapons competently.

"The immaturity of the Saudi training and doctrine and underlying issues with manpower are pervasive," Stratfor declared. "Such issues can take a generation to even begin to resolve …

"If the new hardware is accompanied with serious reform, then … the Saudis military might become a significant force. Until then, for all its military hardware, Saudi Arabia will remain relatively weak in terms of defense."

Most of its $34 billion defense and security budget is spent on maintaining and upgrading large stocks of air, land and naval equipment purchased since the 1970s.

Most of this work is carried out by an army of expatriate specialists from Western defense manufacturers because the Saudis can't do it themselves. So the influx of more advanced equipment is likely to strain Saudi resources even further.

King Abdallah has over the last year or so taken charge of all defense purchases in an apparent effort to reduce the power of the Defense Ministry as the health of the long-serving minister, his half-brother Crown Prince Sultan, has deteriorated.

The monarch personally conducted much of the negotiations for the U.S. arms package.

For one thing, he has long sought to stamp out rampant corruption in the arms procurement system, in which colossal kickbacks are made to Saudi officials.

But Abdallah may have other considerations in mind. He commands the National Guard, or SANG, a 100,000-strong force drawn from tribes loyal to the monarchy. It's the king's private army, totally separate from the 140,000-strong regular forces controlled by the Defense Ministry.

SANG traditionally has been a light mechanized force. But Abdallah wants to give it more firepower with armor and artillery and has ordered his eldest son Mutaib, the SANG commander, to carry out a major $3 billion reorganization.

The AH-60 Apache gunships and other systems in the U.S. package are clearly earmarked for this force, whose traditional mission has been to protect the royal family. It is also expected to be redeployed to protect strategic oil installations as well.

"Like many Gulf Arab states, the Saudi regime has long feared its own military more than any external threat," Stratfor observed. "The Saudis have relied on the United States to deter and defend against external threats.

"While military interests receive generous allotments of money and modern defense hardware, they have lacked the organization and leadership to employ that equipment effectively.

"In many cases, they have been kept deliberately weak doctrinally and institutionally to prevent them from becoming capable of mounting a coup."
For Saudis, U.S. arms deal is a challenge - UPI.com
 
I know some people will say, its no Pakistan related. But read between the lines, we notice huge impact of PAF role in rolling Royal airforce.
 
Anyone know why exactly the Saudis are arming themselves so heavily? Iran wouldn't be able to do much before the US intervenes, and I doubt Israel has the manpower or will to invade Saudi Arabia.
 
I know some people will say, its no Pakistan related. But read between the lines, we notice huge impact of PAF role in rolling Royal airforce.

The bankrolling and tradition has been reduced a lot.
And in recent times PAF personnel have been relegated more to training the Saudi pilots than flying their front line jets.
Just as in the UAE.. where Emirates airlines and the UAEAF have surpassed their erstwhile mentors and are now independent of them.. the same can be said of the Saudi's.
 
I know some people will say, its no Pakistan related. But read between the lines, we notice huge impact of PAF role in rolling Royal airforce.

those days are long gone. there is an explicit bar on PAF pilots. the only likelyhood is that they will be flown by US pilots or Saudis.

in a way I am happy with that because PAF should never be a part of any program or doctrine that involves fighting with Iran. dont we have enough hostile neighbours already?

most recently the Saudi F-15s are busy bombing the Yemani tribes killing whole familes. I would have to see any PAF involvement in that.

following is what I am talking about. sorry this is the least graphic I could find. some are extremely disturbing with bodies of infants in rubble and blood.
we are very generous in condemning Israelis and Americans but what our own fellow Muslim do is more shocking.
(I am sorry for bringing this into the debate but there was a chance that some people might have wondered what I was talking about)

YouTube - [Press TV] Saudi Regime Launches New Air Strikes Against Houthi Shias in Yemen
 
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Okay this is good if saudis can get anything from US.. I hope they should demand F15SE(stealth version) for their airforce...:coffee:
 
America is arming saudis just like it armed Iraq, American funded, saddams hussein's Iraq fought 8 years long war with Iran.
then later Iraq invaded Kuwait. Every one knows who played Saddam.

The stage being set to repeat history.
US is eyeing saudi oil now.
 
I know at least half dozen Pakistani present and half dozen retired who have rendered services in Saudi airforce and navies including some of my own relatives.

Only Pakistanis are the foreign national employed at ship and aviation maintenance facilities.

The saudis unlike foolish Iraqis will never go to war with any neighboring state. They have learned the lesson of keep their disputes in house or risk inviting foreign powers.
 
America is arming saudis just like it armed Iraq, American funded, saddams hussein's Iraq fought 8 years long war with Iran.
then later Iraq invaded Kuwait. Every one knows who played Saddam.

The stage being set to repeat history.
US is eyeing saudi oil now.

but USA ain't aiding Saudis...they are purchasing.
RSA isn't a poor country.. situation of Saudi US relations isn't like US n Iraqis. every thing changed after the death of Shah Faisal, he was the only threat to US. Saudi Arabia is more likely an sleeping allay of USA and Arabian military use to sleep in cool AC rooms in duty times.
But this mighty arm purchase is just to pressurize Iran, it could be b/c of USA but main reason could be Iran's possible attack to Arabs just like b4.its more likely a sheya sunni threat.
 
but USA ain't aiding Saudis...they are purchasing.
RSA isn't a poor country.. situation of Saudi US relations isn't like US n Iraqis. every thing changed after the death of Shah Faisal, he was the only threat to US. Saudi Arabia is more likely an sleeping allay of USA and Arabian military use to sleep in cool AC rooms in duty times.
But this mighty arm purchase is just to pressurize Iran, it could be b/c of USA but main reason could be Iran's possible attack to Arabs just like b4.its more likely a sheya sunni threat.

Iraq vs Iran was also a shia sunni threat.
Thats the plan saudi's cant fight sh!t, pitting it against Iran will mean an instant defeat and a very nice opportunity for America to take command of Saudi Armed forces, more bases, more personale, start another desert storm against Iran, once Iran is defeated stay here forever....
Thats exactly what they did to Kuwait, which is effectively an american colony now.
 
The whole orld know that how good our military and PAF is. Hum logon ki budbaghti hai kay humray corrupt leader always let us down. I gurantee you one thing that if we ever got money there is no one in the world can chanllege us
 
Three points I think i must tell:

1) America's huge source of GDP comes from selling weapons to Armies

2) Saudi Army is trained by PA. You can normally see Pakistan Army Captions and Majors and officers of all ranks in PA Uniforms in Riyadh!

3) SRAF (Saudi Royal Air Force) is trained by PAF.
 
1) America's huge source of GDP comes from selling weapons to Armies

Not exactly. The US has a MAJOR arms export business (the largest in the world for decades).
But it's arms exports are usually $6.6-7 billion dollars annually, while the US's aggregate exports are around $1 trillion dollars. In reality, most American defense contractors make their buck selling arms to the US itself (although in an era of budget cuts, global arms spending will likely be the driving force).
 
It could also be becuase US needs money, they are using their good offices to sell defence equipments.

It's pure marketing when companies needs more business they offer more.
 
"Instead, its challenge is fielding that hardware. With deliveries years away, the new deal will do little to balance the resurgent Iranian regime in the near-term, and prolongs Saudi Arabia's heavy dependence on U.S. defense support."



thats how it works....muslims will be destroyed by the muslim themselves....and u.s.a , israel will be laughing sitting at NYC
 
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