Fiscal Budget 2019-20

[zulu]

Sir ji aab yahan kiya batain kabhi email py pochyee gaa poori black economy ka bataty hain aap ko And thats my point an simple small business owner like me knows so much why not the authorities ?plug all gaps they using in system.Called it black economy more than undocumented details not better to share here

Sir, the question is: are these shops paying GST to the supplier? If not, then the supplier/wholesaler/manufacturer should be charged GST instead.

As per my understanding, GST rule previously was that it's collected from the retailer. And now it will be collected from manufacturer.

 

[Arsalan]

I hope there is no agitation since the country can ill-afford the disruption and economic losses.
That would be a mistake.

Talked to few associations! The point is NOT that they are planning protests etc, the issue is, they are not even planning to put forward the real issue/problem. On the surface, their demands and slogans sound like "please dont tax us" which will be ridiculous. There is much more to it and a very sensible point can be made that the gov side will also listen to and will understand. Lets see how they decide to proceed finally, all i could do was to point them this loop hole and tell them how thy might damage the whole cause talking about such weak issues.


Oh and by agitation i do not mean massive strikes and protests risking public/private property. It will mainly be some protests, press conferences, rally here and there.

 

[VCheng]

Talked to few associations! The point is NOT that they are planning protests etc, the issue is, they are not even planning to put forward the real issue/problem. On the surface, their demands and slogans sound like "please dont tax us" which will be ridiculous. There is much more to it and a very sensible point can be made that the gov side will also listen to and will understand. Lets see how they decide to proceed finally, all i could do was to point them this loop hole and tell them how thy might damage the whole cause talking about such weak issues.


Oh and by agitation i do not mean massive strikes and protests risking public/private property. It will mainly be some protests, press conferences, rally here and there.

As long as the protests do not include shutting down production. Then we all lose huge amounts of economic activity.

 

[Sugarcane]

Sir, the question is: are these shops paying GST to the supplier? If not, then the supplier/wholesaler/manufacturer should be charged GST instead.

As per my understanding, GST rule previously was that it's collected from the retailer. And now it will be collected from manufacturer.

Sales tax is collected from sales tax registered entities (be it Manufacturer, Distributor or retailer) - they submit Input-Output sales tax data every 15 days. Problem is manufacturer sell for example at Rs. 100 + 17 (17 ST) to distributors or retailers. If retailer/distributor is tax registered and sell the same item at base price Rs. 120 + 17% ST than he will deposit additional 3.4 (20.40 - 17) additional tax he collected to government, but if he is not tax registered than he will charge and get this additional tax from end consumer but will keep in his pocket instead of depositing. So, people are paying full GST but government is not getting it.

 

[ziaulislam]

yes the refunds have been much better under this current gov. still need to improve. Please understand that it is not possible for small and medium level exporters to have this kind of investment blocked for 5 months (and with a fear that it will be way over 5 months if history of such dealings is taken into account).
"industrialist are not doing its job by lying", sorry, lying about?

Yes the refunds should be via third party. This is what the export industry was demanding at last when it was made certain that the tax are coming for sure. The demand was that the refund is paid by the bank at the time of presentation of shipment documents to the bank as that will ensure, A) that the money is blocked for 2 to 3 months compared to 5 months and that too uncertain, B) there will be little chance of any delay so the uncertainty factor (killer for business) will be dealt with.

However the gov. is saying they will make sure refunds are made in 2 months time. This means 5 months of investment blockade. Now the next step will be to wait and see if the gov. actually manages to pay the refund even in 2 months as they promise.


However, expect some considerable agitation in Faisalabad, Lahore, Sialkot, Karachi, Multan starting this week.


ABSOLUTELY!

I agree refunds should be immediate with 2 weeks of refunds receipt submission probably using a third party bank with revolving fund

Government will be borrowing 2,168 billion as per budget. So, that's simply taking new loan for paying another one - problem will not fix until we achieve balanced (if not surplus) budget. However, if government really fix electricity distribution and transmission system than we surely will be saving a lot, same way fixing FBR can remove budget deficit the revenue even with currently imposed taxes but nothing concrete is done yet on this very important and critical factor.



Well I do agree, Why the f*ck people will file tax return, get themselves documented where they can be asked questions about their assets, declared income and tax paid when there's no incentive or punishment for not doing so. IK is surely an idiot of highest level if he think that his sermons will make people taxpayers and filers.



Agar tumhari salary barh kar 50,001 ho gai hai tu apni company se kaho aik rupaya increment kum kar dain warna lainay k dainay par jaain gay.

We will know soon..by December if we dont see a large crackdown than surely he is an idiot

Taxation has to improve even at a cost of recession

 

[Verve]

Sales tax is collected from sales tax registered entities (be it Manufacturer, Distributor or retailer) - they submit Input-Output sales tax data every 15 days. Problem is manufacturer sell for example at Rs. 100 + 17 (17 ST) to distributors or retailers. If retailer/distributor is tax registered and sell the same item at base price Rs. 120 + 17% ST than he will deposit additional 3.4 (20.40 - 17) additional tax he collected to government, but if he is not tax registered than he will charge and get this additional tax from end consumer but will keep in his pocket instead of depositing. So, people are paying full GST but government is not getting it.

A very simple GST system can fix that!

1.
Each manufacturer/wholesaler has to submit all sales and GST charged per GST registered buyer/retailer

2.
Each GST registered buyer/retailer has to submit all purchases and GST paid per GST registered seller.

3.
Each GST registered buyer/retailer submit total sales and GST.

4.
Failure to submit GST on time results monthly or quarterly results in a system generated heft fine and a deadline for submission.

5.
New local/district Tax courts should be formed. Those who don't pay the fine and make submission, FBR submits action in court.

6.
Court issues order for fine payment. Debt recovery agency is involved who can take assistance from police to collect payment or shut down the business for not paying the fine.

How long do you think people will not submit GST returns if bailiffs are shutting their shops with court orders?

And those who submit fake GST returns can be easily investigated as long as manufacturers/suppliers are investigated annually.

GST theft should be a lifetime sentence!

@zulu

Sir, is there a GST submission system from FBR?

 

[Kabira]

Government will be borrowing 2,168 billion as per budget. So, that's simply taking new loan for paying another one - problem will not fix until we achieve balanced (if not surplus) budget. However, if government really fix electricity distribution and transmission system than we surely will be saving a lot, same way fixing FBR can remove budget deficit the revenue even with currently imposed taxes but nothing concrete is done yet on this very important and critical factor.



Well I do agree, Why the f*ck people will file tax return, get themselves documented where they can be asked questions about their assets, declared income and tax paid when there's no incentive or punishment for not doing so. IK is surely an idiot of highest level if he think that his sermons will make people taxpayers and filers.



Agar tumhari salary barh kar 50,001 ho gai hai tu apni company se kaho aik rupaya increment kum kar dain warna lainay k dainay par jaain gay.

First budget was always going to be difficult with our economy. Still PTI have 4 years to make things right. We should judge their performance after next government is formed and see if they need IMF again or not.

I think in coming years imports will continue to become more and more expensive. That should make investing in local industries lot more attractive.

 

[Ocelot]

Dualization of Mianwali-Muzaffargarh road.. Rauf Klasra must be doing a break-dance since yesterday.

 

[zulu]

@Verve There is even i heard online system too but never saw anyone using it so cant tell exactly how it works

 

[Verve]

@Verve There is even i heard online system too but never saw anyone using it so cant tell exactly how it works

Couldn't find any reference to such a software ...

But found this and in all honesty most of these rules are terrible. GST registration should be Revenue based as it will be so much easier to track based on purchases from GST registered wholesalers/manufacturers.

https://www.fbr.gov.pk/categ/register-sales-tax/51148/50848/ 101156

PERSONS TO BE REGISTERED FOR SALES TAX

1. All importers
2. All wholesalers (including dealers) and distributors
3. Manufacturers not falling in cottage industry. {Cottage industry means a manufacturer whose annual turnover from taxable supplies made in any tax period during the last twelve months ending any tax period does not exceed [ten] million rupees or whose annual utility (electricity, gas and telephone) bills during the last twelve months ending any tax period do not exceed [eight] hundred thousand rupees;}
4. Retailers (Tier-1 retailers means:
   1. A retailer operating as a unit of a national or international chain of stores;
   2. A retailer operating in an air-conditioned shopping mall, plaza or centre, excluding kiosks;
   3. A retailer whose cumulative electricity bill during the immediately preceding twelve consecutive months exceeds Rupees six hundred thousand; and
   4. A wholesaler-cum-retailer, engaged in bulk import and supply of consumer goods on wholesale basis to the retailers as well as on retail basis to the general body of the consumers
5. A person required under any Provincial or Federal Law to be registered for purpose of any duty or tax collected or paid as if it were a levy of sales tax, e.g. service providers like hotels, clubs, caterers, customs agents, ship chandlers, stevedores, courier services etc.
6. Persons making zero-rated supplies, including commercial exporter who intends to obtain sales tax refund against his zero rated supplies.
7. A person who is required to be registered by virtue of aforesaid criteria, but still avoids registration, can be compulsorily registered by the department, after proper enquiry, under sub- rule 1 of Rule 6 of Sales Tax Rules, 2006.

 

[zulu]

@Verve check these what u have in mind ?can call FBR office to get that info
https://www.fbr.gov.pk/?aspxerrorpath=/fileOnline
https://e.fbr.gov.pk/AuthLogin.aspx
https://iris.fbr.gov.pk/public/txplogin.xhtml

 

[Verve]

@Verve check these what u have in mind ?can call FBR office to get that info
https://www.fbr.gov.pk/?aspxerrorpath=/fileOnline
https://e.fbr.gov.pk/AuthLogin.aspx
https://iris.fbr.gov.pk/public/txplogin.xhtml

Sir I saw that but I'm talking about a software that companies can install on their own computers to transmit GST returns.

I don't think it exists. And there should be such a Windows based software. Such software should be made available to all companies deducting taxes on employees as well.

 

[zulu]

Have u anything in mind ?

Sir I saw that but I'm talking about a software that companies can install on their own computers to transmit GST returns.

I don't think it exists. And there should be such a Windows based software. Such software should be made available to all companies deducting taxes on employees as well.

 

[Dubious]

ISLAMABAD: Contrary to the government’s tall claims of austerity, the budget for the next fiscal year has proposed an 18.8 percent increase in the non-development funds of the Prime Minister’s Office.

The government has allocated Rs1.171 billion for the PM Office in the year 2019-20 against the outgoing year’s revised estimate of Rs980 million.

According to a break-up of the allocation, a sum of Rs879 million has been reserved for employees’ expenses, Rs384 million for salaries, Rs207 million for payment to officers, Rs176 million for other staff members, Rs494 million for allowances, Rs400 million for regular allowances, Rs94 million for other allowances excluding transport allowance, 218 million for operating expenses and Rs26 million for employees’ retirement benefits.




A sum of Rs18 million has been allocated for grants, subsidies and write off loans, Rs1.5 million for transfers, Rs5.4 million for physical assets and Rs21 million for repair and maintenance.

Separately, the government has allocated Rs2.095 billion non-development funds for the Supreme Court against the outgoing fiscal year’s revised estimate of Rs 1.964 billion.

According to its break-up, a sum of Rs1.655 billion has been allocated for employees’ expenses, Rs451.734 million for salaries, Rs311.567 million for payment to officers, Rs140.167 million for other staff members, Rs1203.426 million for allowances, Rs930.322 million for regular allowances, Rs272.104 million for other allowances excluding transport allowance, Rs288.270 million for operating expenses, Rs49 million for employees’ retirement benefits, Rs1 million for transfers, Rs44.020 million for physical assets and Rs31.050 million for repair and maintenance.

Source? Kindly ALWAYS provide sources!

 

[Dubious]

The above two statements are contradictory if I am not missing something.


What's the meaning of net revenue? Where difference between tax revenue (5,822bn) and net revenue (3,465bn) will go?

Cant expect much from an article that interested an indian abt a neighboring country they so frequently talk abt bombing

In my opinion, an article not worth discussing!