FIGHTER AIRCRAFTS OF IAF - A SUPERPOWER IN THE MAKING

[SURYA-1]

Neither was my statement "All Inclusive", obviously ToT for a microwave oven is different from that of a Nuclear Submarine (if there ever such a thing).

You are not getting me, as this is defense forum by contracts I obviously meant defense contact. What I mean to highlight is time has changed a lot and now deals are not done as they were previously done by Indians .We have done so much foreign deals that we have become very experienced at it and hence won't repeat the mistakes of the past.You will soon verify it.Deal clauses for Mirage-2000 and Rafel will be very different.

 

[Hyperion]

Oh god... if I can get this exact point across to the others.......

This stuff that you start describing by the word 'just' is the biggest momma of hidden techs across the world... Being the biggest airplane market of the world, if chinese don't have it, we surely aren't born with a golden horn that the world will just hand in their biggest tech secret - Jet engines. US, UK and France have the WWII history that gave them that knowledge and it separates them from the rest of the worlds... and therefore, that technology is not available... at NO cost! irrespective of how much we wish for it...

Yes.. yes... they will be VERY different, yet, not different enough.

You are not getting me, as this is defense forum by contracts I obviously meant defense contact. What I mean to highlight is time has changed a lot and now deals are not done as they were previously done by Indians .We have done so much foreign deals that we have become very experienced at it and hence won't repeat the mistakes of the past.You will soon verify it.Deal clauses for Mirage-2000 and Rafel will be very different.

 

[OrionHunter]

Super powers do not import platforms... super powers don't rely on anyone else for "critical" parts of their platforms..... are at bleeding edge of technological research..... they don't follow the rules, they make them..... have the ability to eliminate continents.... should I go on????

I beg to differ on this one! The American F-35 has 20 sub contractors from all over the world for providing critical assemblies. The Space Shuttle had a dozen vendors outside the US of A. Heck, even the Mars rovers, Spirit and Opportunity had their robotic arms (IDD) and spectrometers made by Johannes Gutenberg University in Mainz, Germany, and the Max Planck Institute for Chemistry in Mainz, Germany, Magnets for collecting magnetic dust particles, were developed by Jens Martin Knudsen's group at the Niels Bohr Institute, Copenhagen.

Then there's the F-15 SE. The South Korean firm LIG Nex1 has been providing the critical F-15's Head-Up Display, new multi-function displays and flight control computer!! Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) is producing the wings and forward fuselages of the F-15 SE and is involved in the development and manufacture of the Conformal Weapons Bay (CWB) to be used on the F-15.

Even the ultra top secret F-22 that has not been allowed for export, contains many sub-systems that are designed and manufactured abroad!

You want me to go on? Never mind! I guess you get the point!

 

[chinapakistan]

Hey the Chinese 4 and 4.5 Gen are really 3.5 Gen only. Obviously China wont say this on its own. Don't over estimate their ability.

No, except India, all other the country's stuff is just paper.

 

[illusion8]

what an air force did they ever shot down a drone killing pakistani citizens ...well if not whats the use of its so called devine BVR's lolzzz in fact IAF did showed its mettle when the need arised and 5thats what airforces are

Drones chod - that's too high tech for them, they couldn't take down a couple of heli's or stop them when they came into their territory spent 40 minutes and then surprise even went back without detection - where was the mighty PAF when the Salala incident happened and was ongoing for more than an hour , Afghanistan will have a better air force soon.

But yeah - superpower obsession is too much - top 4 or 5 guaranteed.

 

[Hyperion]

Mate, hmmmmmmmm...... hm.............. that wasn't the point I was making. What I was trying to say was that they do not import "critical technologies". Nor give them away. AT ANY COST.

I beg to differ on this one! The American F-35 has 20 sub contractors from all over the world for providing critical assemblies. The Space Shuttle had a dozen vendors outside the US of A. Heck, even the Mars rover Spirit and Opportunity had their robotic arms (IDD) and spectrometers made by Johannes Gutenberg University in Mainz, Germany, and the Max Planck Institute for Chemistry in Mainz, Germany, Magnets for collecting magnetic dust particles, were developed by Jens Martin Knudsen's group at the Niels Bohr Institute, Copenhagen.

Then there's the F-15 SE. The South Korean firm LIG Nex1 has been providing the critical F-15's Head-Up Display, new multi-function displays and flight control computer!! Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) is producing the wings and forward fuselages of the F-15 SE and is involved in the development and manufacture of the Conformal Weapons Bay (CWB) to be used on the F-15.

Even the ultra top secret F-22 that has not been allowed for export, contains many sub-systems that are designed and manufactured abroad!

You want me to go on? Never mind! I guess you get the point!

 

[Black Stone]

So, can we call ourselves Super duper scooby power?

 

[jackyy]

This stuff that you start describing by the word 'just' is the biggest momma of hidden techs across the world... Being the biggest airplane market of the world, if chinese don't have it, we surely aren't born with a golden horn that the world will just hand in their biggest tech secret - Jet engines. US, UK and France have the WWII history that gave them that knowledge and it separates them from the rest of the worlds... and therefore, that technology is not available... at NO cost! irrespective of how much we wish for it...

FYI,Chinese are getting help from american GE for engine development.Everything have a cost,i will say again.

 

[illusion8]

So, can we call ourselves Super duper scooby power?

You already are a hyper power.

 

[mastaan]

FYI,Chinese are getting help from american GE for engine development.Everything have a cost,i will say again.

Help and JVs and MOUs are all fine for developing commercial tech to build those huge commercial engines... I am talking about the 'real deal'... miniaturized, high thrust, Fighter engine tech that P&W and GE has... Hell they have independent divisions with titanium walls for the world... That tech won't be exported and therefore, I repeat... something have no cost! Even a bankrupt Russia won't sell that to China and you're talking the some of the richest countries in the world...

I ask you a question... Would you let go of Jammu & Kashmir for a price? If your answer is NO, then you will understand that some things just don't have a price... They will always remain 'not for sale'!

 

[jackyy]

Mate, hmmmmmmmm...... hm.............. that wasn't the point I was making. What I was trying to say was that they do not import "critical technologies". Nor give them away. AT ANY COST.

Western economies are almost dead economies or at the verge of it.Thats why western leaders are arriving here every second year.French offered their nuclear bomb testing facility to sweeten the MMRCA deal.It was mentioned on one of thread of MMRCA.
Only french have such facility,may be others have.So now you decide what is necessary? TOT or to keep their economy going on.
May be they ask more $$ but they will.

 

[jackyy]

Help and JVs and MOUs are all fine for developing commercial tech to build those huge commercial engines... I am talking about the 'real deal'... miniaturized, high thrust, Fighter engine tech that P&W and GE has... Hell they have independent divisions with titanium walls for the world... That tech won't be exported and therefore, I repeat... something have no cost! Even a bankrupt Russia won't sell that to China and you're talking the some of the richest countries in the world...

I ask you a question... Would you let go of Jammu & Kashmir for a price? If your answer is NO, then you will understand that some things just don't have a price... They will always remain 'not for sale'!

J&K is something else and FYI,our politicians are even ready to do.They already want to withdraw from siachin or sir creek just for the sake of better relations.Without army pressure,they would have done it already.

Dude,The time when we will consume the tech given by french to us,they would be in the different league with more sophisticated tech or much better than the present tech.Do u think they will release tech on one leap? nopes.

so we will always remain behind them until 20-30 years more.After 10 years we will demand again TOT where we lacked then again some cost..so here goes the cycle thats why india is demanding to have complete know how to prevent this begging again n again.

Although i agree that or dont know that what we are demanding from them or we dont know the details what we are negotiating with them.

 

[sancho]

pls don't troll

You should have avoided such a titel to avoid trolling, this was just an invitation.

 

[GURU DUTT]

Western economies are almost dead economies or at the verge of it.Thats why western leaders are arriving here every second year.French offered their nuclear bomb testing facility to sweeten the MMRCA deal.It was mentioned on one of thread of MMRCA.
Only french have such facility,may be others have.So now you decide what is necessary? TOT or to keep their economy going on.
May be they ask more $$ but they will.

jane do sirji they will not understand the real strenth of economy to them one who keeps giving free wepons and aid to keep ther e economy on foot is a super power other wise they make fun of it like they did when france stopped the request for latest avioniks for there devine JFT

 

[Srinivas]

It all depends on espionage and intel of the client country.
These deals also involve close working of top scientists with each other, So if Indians have good espionage skills no tech is not accessible particularly when France is in economic slow down.

The more muscle power you have the more you can manipulate D assault in giving you the tech. or work together in a JV.

Help and JVs and MOUs are all fine for developing commercial tech to build those huge commercial engines... I am talking about the 'real deal'... miniaturized, high thrust, Fighter engine tech that P&W and GE has... Hell they have independent divisions with titanium walls for the world... That tech won't be exported and therefore, I repeat... something have no cost! Even a bankrupt Russia won't sell that to China and you're talking the some of the richest countries in the world...

I ask you a question... Would you let go of Jammu & Kashmir for a price? If your answer is NO, then you will understand that some things just don't have a price... They will always remain 'not for sale'!