F-16 Block 15MLU/50/52 Fighter

[EagleEyes]

6.4 million each. Very cheap i say.

 

[fatman17]

[This means PAF presently has 46 F-16's, roughly 4 squadrons.

PAF squadron strength is usually 16-18 a/c per.
so 2.5 sqdns of F-16s.

 

[fatman17]

6.4 million each. Very cheap i say.

this is misleading. i am not sure in what context these figs are being quoted. F-16 MLU will cost at least 25m / a/c.

 

[IceCold]

Another batch of four F-16s joins PAF​

Updated at: 2011 PST, Monday, July 28, 2008
Another batch of four F-16s joins PAF SARGODHA: A simple but impressive ceremony for handing over of four, F-16 aircraft to Pakistan Air Force was held at PAF Base Mushaf, Sargodha. Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal, Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed received the fighting Falcons from Lieutenant General Martin E Dempsey, acting Commander US CENTCOM.

Addressing the ceremony, Tanvir said that the batch of aircraft which arrived today have the same operational capability as of the already possessed F-16 aircraft by the PAF and will significantly augment its combat capability in defending the aerial frontiers of Pakistan.

A contingent of high-ranking officials from Air Forces of Pakistan and United States were also present on the occasion.

 

[fatman17]

The first two F-16s were delivered in December 2005, two more in July 2007, two in February 2008 and four in June 2008, and the latest delivery of four on 28th July-08.

 

[BATMAN]

vbJgmsZsF3g[/media] - Four more F-16s join Pakistan Air Force - July 28, 2008

6.4 million each. Very cheap i say.

I highly doubt this figure just because news does not mention its source and I highly doubt that reporter is a defence analyst.
Although we have bought decomissioned fighters from USAF and price is expected to be less and it can be any thing based on avionics and radar but again those were ordered or contracted in 80's and delivered today.

In my opinion US should pay rent instead for using our F-16.

 

[araz]

this is misleading. i am not sure in what context these figs are being quoted. F-16 MLU will cost at least 25m / a/c.

Ithink these are old Block 15OCUs for PAF that were embargoed. They have been refurbished but not MLUed. They will require MLU
Ho-e this explains the situation.As per HKhan of PAkdef.info these are all Bs
Regards
Araz

 

[fatman17]

Ithink these are old Block 15OCUs for PAF that were embargoed. They have been refurbished but not MLUed. They will require MLU
Ho-e this explains the situation.As per HKhan of PAkdef.info these are all Bs
Regards
Araz

this is correct as it tallies with the DSCA - EDA Bulletin board. this also raises a interesting question.

of the original 40 F-16s procured in the mid-80s, 28 were As and 12 Bs. i have no idea how many As and Bs out of the 8 a/c that have been lost due to attrition. lets assume 4 each.

that leaves 24 F-16As and 8 F-16Bs. now with this delivery of 14 a/c, 9 are Bs and 5 are As. giving us:

29 F-16As and 15 F-16Bs. an inordinate amount of two-seat trainers. this only proves to me that the PAF intends to get additional EDA F-16s from the US and therefore ensuring that it has enough pilots converted to this type well in advance of their arrival.

 

[araz]

this is correct as it tallies with the DSCA - EDA Bulletin board. this also raises a interesting question.

of the original 40 F-16s procured in the mid-80s, 28 were As and 12 Bs. i have no idea how many As and Bs out of the 8 a/c that have been lost due to attrition. lets assume 4 each.

that leaves 24 F-16As and 8 F-16Bs. now with this delivery of 14 a/c, 9 are Bs and 5 are As. giving us:

29 F-16As and 15 F-16Bs. an inordinate amount of two-seat trainers. this only proves to me that the PAF intends to get additional EDA F-16s from the US and therefore ensuring that it has enough pilots converted to this type well in advance of their arrival.

fatman
That is a good thought. It certainly points to PAF desire to have more F16s in the fleet.I think in all honesty it is a hedged bet. They will see how the environment is post 2011. If it is conducive they will go for more otherwise, PAF will move on to J10/Thunder.
Now what we need to think of is how will the numbers match up in relation to aircrafts, ie JF17 and J10.
Given a scenario where Uncle Sam supplies us with another 20-30 EDAs and another 18-30 order is utilized by PAf for 52+es,what will we cut down,ie J10 or Thunder? I dont think the total Number of planes will increase as the capabilities of the fleet would go up remarkably. So how do the numbers match up then?

WaSaLam
Araz

 

[Myth_buster_1]

6.4 million each. Very cheap i say.

according to original plan of 60 MLU, the cost is high as 1.3 billion dollars..
so thats roughly around 22 million dollars each and i think including spares..

 

[fatman17]

fatman
That is a good thought. It certainly points to PAF desire to have more F16s in the fleet.I think in all honesty it is a hedged bet. They will see how the environment is post 2011. If it is conducive they will go for more otherwise, PAF will move on to J10/Thunder.
Now what we need to think of is how will the numbers match up in relation to aircrafts, ie JF17 and J10.
Given a scenario where Uncle Sam supplies us with another 20-30 EDAs and another 18-30 order is utilized by PAf for 52+es,what will we cut down,ie J10 or Thunder? I dont think the total Number of planes will increase as the capabilities of the fleet would go up remarkably. So how do the numbers match up then?

WaSaLam
Araz

my gut feel based on how the PAF operates, the airforce would like to achieve their original objective under the peace gate program which would mean:

110 - F-16A/B/C/Ds.

150 - JF-17s under the 1st contract.

40 - F-20s (no final plan here except the approval by the govt. which
means nothing) or

40 - J-11s (???)

this comes to 300 front-line a/c which in the opinion of the PAF is not sufficient to counter the 42 sqdn IAF.

in comes the 2nd contract for 100 JF-17s.(advanced)

PAF can manage a fleet of 400 a/c (22 sqdns) based on their planned infrastructure and personnel deployment.

the mirages and F-7s will serve in the PAF until the above objectives are achieved. time-line is roughly 2015-16.

this frankly is a best-case scenario. i dont see induction of any other western platform in the PAF due to political / funds issues.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

With the new transition of democracy and hope for soon as possible stability in pakistan i think the original plan for Gripen may still exist. PAF needs a quality edge over indian 126 MRCA! J-11 is not a matured platform yet but PLAAF future 2015-20 Flanker fleet is a newly upgraded fleet with su-33 and su-35 features.. J-11 could play potent role in PAF or PN naval role..

 

[nitesh]

With the new transition of democracy and hope for soon as possible stability in pakistan i think the original plan for Gripen may still exist. PAF needs a quality edge over indian 126 MRCA! J-11 is not a matured platform yet but PLAAF future 2015-20 Flanker fleet is a newly upgraded fleet with su-33 and su-35 features.. J-11 could play potent role in PAF or PN naval role..

I am not getting what you are trying to say, PAF need quality edge over Indian MRCA so how does Gripen fits in? J-11 is not a matured platform but it can play a very potent role, how? PLAAF future flanker fleet is going to be upgraded with SU33 and SU35 features which features you are referring here? Any deal has been signed?

 

[blain2]

this is misleading. i am not sure in what context these figs are being quoted. F-16 MLU will cost at least 25m / a/c.

Sir these aircraft are not MLU'd as of yet. They have only gone through the Falcon-UP (STAR) structural upgrades. So the cost is correct.

This is going exactly as planned. Back in June of 2006, PAF has asked and had gotten approved for sale modification/overhaul of 14 F100-PW-220E engines, 14 Falcon UP/STAR F-16 structural upgrade kits. Two years later, we have exactly the number (14) that has gone through this structural and engine upgrade in the US. The remaining Pakistani F-16s, 32 received the Falcon UP/STAR upgrade in Pakistan at the PAC. This was one of things that the US allowed after the Brown amendment. So all of the F-16 engines and airframes flying with the PAF are in a very good shape and are ready for the MLU work.

For reference, see this:
http://www.dsca.mil/PressReleases/36-b/2006/Pakistan_06-11.pdf

 

[blain2]

29 F-16As and 15 F-16Bs. an inordinate amount of two-seat trainers. this only proves to me that the PAF intends to get additional EDA F-16s from the US and therefore ensuring that it has enough pilots converted to this type well in advance of their arrival.

One more possibility is that PAF is envisioning using the F-16s in deep interdiction/Strike roles as its primary role and leave air defence/superiority to others such as JF-17s as they come on line (does not mean that F-16s wont be used in air-defence roles, however more focus can be given to the interdiction/strike roles). The fact that PAF is set to receive some pretty amazing ECM/EW suites for these aircraft is another indication of the intended strike role of the F-16s in the future for the PAF. Strike missions can be conducted better with a pilot focusing on flying the aircraft in dense air defense and jamming environments while the Weapons Systems Officer in the back seat can focus on delivering ordnance on target and ensuring the survival of the aircraft by using the ECMs. So the addition of 2 seaters can be seen in that light as well.