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Earthquake Funds---F16 Money---Where Did They Go

Consider the random u-turn the PAF made between April 2018 and November 2018 on LIFT aircraft ... it went from saying, "we don't need one, LIFT is overrated" to basically asking vendors to throw in an afterburning turbofan into their designs...

Hi,

Thank you for the comments---. That was rather a surprising information---.

How could be the air force general command be so out of touch of the flight needs of the service---?
 
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I am hoping for a u-turn in fighter acquisition as well: from 'JF-17 is our future till FGF' to 'We have signed for double engine aircraft'.
Har Daagh U-trun Ke Peeche Ek Kahani Hoti Hai ....

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@MastanKhan Shaib if you don't mind and tolerate this attempt of mine as someone younger than you is trying to palliate this thread than I will like to tag this couplet of Dag Dehlvi to you
Mar gaye ham Daag Dehlvi.jpg
 
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I am hoping for a u-turn in fighter acquisition as well: from 'JF-17 is our future till FGF' to 'We have signed for double engine aircraft'.
Careful, you might get a u-turn about how 'our 18 F-16 Block-52 are enough to stop hybrid grey warfare, and hybrid grey warfare is the only threat.'
 
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If you are ready to provide the share, you will not fail trials like Saab and Diehl. :devil: Usual story of PAF.
Hahaha hard fact which we have to swallow bro:p:

Consider the random u-turn the PAF made between April 2018 and November 2018 on LIFT aircraft ... it went from saying, "we don't need one, LIFT is overrated" to basically asking vendors to throw in an afterburning turbofan into their designs...
CAS and top brass changed so does the policies
 
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Har Daagh U-trun Ke Peeche Ek Kahani Hoti Hai ....

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@MastanKhan Shaib if you don't mind and tolerate this attempt of mine as someone younger than you is trying to palliate this thread than I will like to tag this couplet of Dag Dehlvi to you


Hi,

Thank you---that cracked me up---. It is funny---:enjoy::enjoy::enjoy:
 
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As @Oscar has tried to explain the M2K wasxpersued in the early 90s and the deal was scuppered by Mr10% and when the man reached her office without adding the 10 million dollars per plane which this haramzadaMr10% had demanded the file was thrown out of the window by Benazir and the AC told not to return till the changes had been made. A few weeks later Laghati sdismissed the Benazir Government and PAF went back to France with the request. It was told that the deal had lapsed as PAF had taken far too long.
PAF tried to do right by Pakistan but was not allowed to do so.
A
Thank you sir, A great benefit of this discussion is that truth is coming to surface and many members ( including me) are learning it. I wish Zardari the worst... the piece of shit.

Har Daagh U-trun Ke Peeche Ek Kahani Hoti Hai ....

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
@MastanKhan Shaib if you don't mind and tolerate this attempt of mine as someone younger than you is trying to palliate this thread than I will like to tag this couplet of Dag Dehlvi to you
Bhai, yeh shaar biwi ko sunanay wala ha ke nai?
 
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I think the Pressler amendments hit Pakistan immediately after the collapse of USSR..right so it makes around 1989-90 so PAF should have sought the alternative from Dassault then as it has been operating Mirage-III and V. Definitely restarting the assembly line in 2001 for just a squadron was not profitable enough for them to go through the troubles.. so someone messed up somewhere.. or PAF should have gone for Rafales ..it is expensive but you get a lot more capable A/C than M2K.


I said so because their role is of support and most of the times, they caught lacking and unprepared for the challenge. If not subordinate, at least there should be a strong mechanism that if COAS requires airforce to respond, it has do so under the constitution and air chief should not just deny without a solid evidence and explanation.

Hi,

I was in the US at that time---. Many a 'friends of pakistan' were telling the Paf that the sanctions are coming---.

The sanctions were in the air during Reagan's time---. The coming of sanctions was nothing new---. The Congressman Steven Solariz was trying very hard allong with Pressler to sanction pakistan.

The sanctions just did not happen suddenly---they were over a period of four years in the making---.

See---the arrogance of the Paf got the best of them---. They wanted to STRUT around in ther F16's---. They thought that they had become the " superman " by getting the F16's---. But the americans---the sons of bit-ches that they are---they slammed the Paf down intot he ground and then pumelled them some more by keeping their money as well.

Paf generals fooled themselves and fooled pakistan into believing that the US would not be dumb enough to do that---not understanding that indeed the US is dumb enough to do that---.

You should never challenge the level of stupidity that the US can stoop to at times---.

You have to ask one question---when the sanctions hit----why did Paf not sue the US govt---why did they not stop making payments on the F16's---.

The reason being---Pak paid 450 million for the aircrafts---the actual price of the deal was 300 million dollars and 150 million kickback to Benazir Bhutto / Asif Zardari---.
 
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As @Oscar has tried to explain the M2K wasxpersued in the early 90s and the deal was scuppered by Mr10% and when the man reached her office without adding the 10 million dollars per plane which this haramzadaMr10% had demanded the file was thrown out of the window by Benazir and the AC told not to return till the changes had been made. A few weeks later Laghati sdismissed the Benazir Government and PAF went back to France with the request. It was told that the deal had lapsed as PAF had taken far too long.
PAF tried to do right by Pakistan but was not allowed to do so.
A

That was also the most stupid thing to do was to stop the deal for 10 million per aircraft---.

When our children get sick---how many f us have paid outrageous price for much needed medicine that is in short supply---.

The kicj back was not 10 million dollars persay---by was the price of 4 aircraft---.

If the Paf had the brains to think that way and re-assessed---would 32 aircraft do the job of if are not able to get 36 aircraft---.

I am definite that 32 would do the job---even 30 would do the job---.

I would have gldaly with a smile on my face would have taken 30 M2K's and given 6 M2K's as Bakhsheesh---just to have something to defend my country---.

And those M2K's were far more advanced than those of the indians---.

A " too honest " person should never make these deals---. I would rather have a nationalistic shyster making a deal---than a honest man who does not understand the consequences---.

Honesty is an excellent trait---but when it stops you from buying something that would defend your nation---and is the best available product on the market---more advanced than the enemy's product---then it is pure foolishness not to make the deal---.

A buyer has to have VISION of what is at stake---.

PAKISTAN WAS WRONGED BY THAT PERSON WHO STOPPED THAT DEAL---.

nations fortunes are not built on differentiating black from white---. There are so many murky areas that one has to waddle thru---.
 
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Hi,

I was in the US at that time---. Many a 'friends of pakistan' were telling the Paf that the sanctions are coming---.

The sanctions were in the air during Reagan's time---. The coming of sanctions was nothing new---. The Congressman Steven Solariz was trying very hard allong with Pressler to sanction pakistan.

The sanctions just did not happen suddenly---they were over a period of four years in the making---.

See---the arrogance of the Paf got the best of them---. They wanted to STRUT around in ther F16's---. They thought that they had become the " superman " by getting the F16's---. But the americans---the sons of bit-ches that they are---they slammed the Paf down intot he ground and then pumelled them some more by keeping their money as well.

Paf generals fooled themselves and fooled pakistan into believing that the US would not be dumb enough to do that---not understanding that indeed the US is dumb enough to do that---.

You should never challenge the level of stupidity that the US can stoop to at times---.

You have to ask one question---when the sanctions hit----why did Paf not sue the US govt---why did they not stop making payments on the F16's---.

The reason being---Pak paid 450 million for the aircrafts---the actual price of the deal was 300 million dollars and 150 million kickback to Benazir Bhutto / Asif Zardari---.
Sanctions were going to come in regardless. Just like the Viggen program that Sweden halted for PAF. Same with the A-7 Corsair II and the SEPECAT Jaguar. F-16 was the best available option under the sanctions. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you....just some info. Oh and they made a blunder for not asking for the Sparrow. Had they had the Sparrow missile, easily over 25+ air to air kills from PAF's Viper squadrons (including the training squadron).
 
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Har Daagh U-trun Ke Peeche Ek Kahani Hoti Hai ....

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
@MastanKhan Shaib if you don't mind and tolerate this attempt of mine as someone younger than you is trying to palliate this thread than I will like to tag this couplet of Dag Dehlvi to you
A slight distortion of Mir's shair sits nicely to describe the OP
Unko Natiq na kaho Mir kay saheb is nay.
Dard o gham kitnay kiye jamaa to deewan kiya.
A

Thank you sir, A great benefit of this discussion is that truth is coming to surface and many members ( including me) are learning it. I wish Zardari the worst... the piece of shit.


Bhai, yeh shaar biwi ko sunanay wala ha ke nai?
Bhai agar yeh shair beewi ko sunao to humaisha yehi kaho. Kay meri Jaan yeh shair aap kay ouper kitn sach baithta hai. Begum ko khush rakho aur aram say jeeo.
:cheesy::bounce::taz:

I am hoping for a u-turn in fighter acquisition as well: from 'JF-17 is our future till FGF' to 'We have signed for double engine aircraft'.
Is this a wish or a reality in the making. A twin engine need has been discussed since early to mid 2000s. It would be ideal to have 2-3 squadrons one for Navy and 2 for AF.
 
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Sanctions were going to come in regardless. Just like the Viggen program that Sweden halted for PAF. Same with the A-7 Corsair II and the SEPECAT Jaguar. F-16 was the best available option under the sanctions. Not agreeing or disagreeing with you....just some info. Oh and they made a blunder for not asking for the Sparrow. Had they had the Sparrow missile, easily over 25+ air to air kills from PAF's Viper squadrons (including the training squadron).

Interested in the story about Viggen and Jaguar. Can you share some more about those? Never knew the PAF had tried for those. Untill now my biggest regret was the PAF not being able to secure the Su-27 deal with the russians in the early 90s
 
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Interested in the story about Viggen and Jaguar. Can you share some more about those? Never knew the PAF had tried for those. Untill now my biggest regret was the PAF not being able to secure the Su-27 deal with the russians in the early 90s
That's a story for another time. Su-27 deal was lax due to the pro-Indian government lobby that had the export agency convinced to prevent the deal from going through.
 
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