Dossier is credible, but give Pakistan some time: Mulford

[Contrarian]

Dossier is credible, but give Pakistan some time: Mulford

New Delhi: The U.S. has contended that the dossier given by India to Pakistan on the Mumbai attacks was “credible” but suggested that New Delhi should allow time to Islamabad to act on it.

U.S. ambassador to India David C. Mulford said the dossier contains extensive inputs from the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI).

“From what I have seen it is a very credible material. The FBI is cooperating in Mumbai...It is information which tells and gives a very accurate account of what has happened,” he told Karan Thapar’s programme ‘Devil’s Advocate.’

“As far as I see, it (FBI material) was used extensively because the material was the same.”

Underlining the credible aspect of the dossier, he said, “As far as the FBI is concerned, they do not deal with non-credible material. It is a truly professional organisation supported by absolutely hi-tech techniques.”

“A serious problem”

Mr. Mulford said, “There were handlers who were in touch with these people on the ground. It is a serious problem. This act of terrorism came from Pakistan.”

With reference to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s view that “official agencies” of Pakistan could have been involved in the terror strikes, the ambassador said, “I think one needs to be very careful about making those kinds of allegations unless you have very concrete evidence to that degree of specificity.”

He said his country cannot get into “that kind of specificity unless there is some justification for it.”

Mr. Mulford said there were a lot of things that tell that “this is a very serious situation. You don’t need to know that degree of specificity…to pursue the matter.”

Emphasising that Pakistan has a “serious problem on its hand,” he said, “you don’t need some kind of a definitive state to know that you have a definite problem on hand.”

On Pakistan’s virtual rejection of the credibility of evidence within 24 hours after getting it, he said, “Well, I don’t think you can cut some quick reaction on the statement of one particular individual. I think it takes some time. You have, after all, a situation where there is a civilian government, a very strong military, a very strong intelligence agency and a media and other players.

“And I think you have to take a view that it is going to take a little time to percolate to see what really is the outcome.”
Denial mode

He said, “Somebody in denial [mode] doesn’t necessarily remain in denial and isn’t always on a specific point in denial even if they are projecting a sense of denial.”

Mr. Mulford said, “It is complex and you would be mistaken to seize on a statement that is particularly irritating to you...”

He said the U.S. view was that the Pakistani government has “responded cooperatively with us.” — PTI
The Hindu : Front Page : Dossier is credible, but give Pakistan some time: Mulford

 

[Vinod2070]

Mr. Mulford said, “There were handlers who were in touch with these people on the ground. It is a serious problem. This act of terrorism came from Pakistan.”

The acknowledgment by Pakistan of that along with assurances coming from them that they will take it to it's logical conclusion is what is needed.

Not being in denial and waiting for some unspecified "evidence" to be presented. "Evidence" that is never enough for them though it may be to some of the world'd best investigative agencies!

The recent reports that Pakistan has stalled every single one of the leads presented through the joint anti-terror mechanism are also no cause for optimism.

 

[IceCold]

It maybe his personal views but like i have said it before, there isnt much India can do otherwise, Indian defence analysts also believe that the time for a military action is over. Also with Pakistan's acceptance of Kasab, it has proven that Pakistan is looking into the matter with all sincerity and that its own agencies are working and whatever facts will be revealed will be brought up front. So to say that Pakistan is in a state of denial is nothing but BS because we are not and we have proven it time and time again first the banning of JUD and now with the acceptance of Kasab.
Also the indian authorties have yet to prove the involvement of the Pakistani state(GOP/agencies ISI) with the terrorists. So far they havent.

 

[Vinod2070]

It maybe his personal views but like i have said it before, there isnt much India can do otherwise, Indian defence analysts also believe that the time for a military action is over. Also with Pakistan's acceptance of Kasab, it has proven that Pakistan is looking into the matter with all sincerity and that its own agencies are working and whatever facts will be revealed will be brought up front. So to say that Pakistan is in a state of denial is nothing but BS because we are not and we have proven it time and time again first the banning of JUD and now with the acceptance of Kasab.
Also the indian authorties have yet to prove the involvement of the Pakistani state(GOP/agencies ISI) with the terrorists. So far they havent.

Kasab has been acknowledge to be a Pakistani after a long hiatus but is that nearly enough! What are the next steps?

I see the Pakistani PM and establishment only trying to spin the issue.

Why so much noise about Mumbai: Gilani
TIMES NEWS NETWORK

New Delhi: A day after he made, as some call it, the mysterious statement that ISI’s response to the Indian dossier had been conveyed to India, Pakistan PM Yousaf Raza Gilani on Saturday shot his mouth off again saying that there was no need for the world to make “so much noise’’ about the Mumbai attacks. Gilani’s statement about ISI’s feedback being given to India was denied again by New Delhi on Saturday.

Drawing a parallel with the Israeli strikes in Gaza, Gilani accused the world community of double standards saying that it was more concerned about the Mumbai attacks than the killings in Palestine. “We have to see that the world does not have double standards. See how many innocent women and children have been killed in Palestine. Why is nobody talking about that? Why is the world silent on that?’’ said Gilani in Karachi.

World silent over ‘atrocities’ on Kashmiris, says Pak PM

New Delhi: Accusing the world of double standards in dealing with the Mumbai terror attacks, Pakistan prime minister Yousuf Raza Gilani said that the world had remained silent over the “atrocities’’ committed by India on the people of Jammu and Kashmir. Stating that hundreds of people had been killed in terrorist strikes, including suicide attacks on slain leader Benazir Bhutto’s cavalcade in October 2007 and Marriot Hotel in Islamabad, in the past, Gilani wondered why not enough “noise’’ was made over these incidents.

He said 26/11 was an intelligence failure on India’s part and that it India’s “internal matter’’. This was the second shocker from Gilani in as many days. Gilani’s statement on Friday that Islamabad has handed over its feedback to the dossier linking Mumbai attacks with Pakistan nationals has turned mysterious with India on Saturday saying that no such reply had been received from Pakistan. Gilani had made the statement before reporters in Islamabad on Friday, but this was soon denied by foreign ministry officials.

On Saturday, minister of state for foreign affairs Anand Sharma categorically said that no such feedback had been received from Islamabad. “We have not yet received it. When it reaches us we will comment,’’ said Sharma, adding that India had also not received any request from Pakistan for consular access to the lone terrorist survivor in Mumbai attacks Ajmal Amir Kasab.

What is further intriguing is another statement from Gilani that India had handed over a 52-page dossier to the CIA which had been given to Pakistan and to which ISI had responded. He said that ISI’s response had been conveyed to the CIA and India. A senior official in New Delhi, however, said that India had no knowledge about any dossier being handed over to Pakistan through the CIA.
“Our position is clear that Pakistan should fulfil the promises it has made to India and the international community. It should dismantle the terror infrastructure that exists there,’’ stated Sharma.
Meanwhile, foreign minister Pranab Mukherjee on Saturday again said that all options are open for India even as he ruled out Gazalike strikes saying that the situation here could not be compared with the ongoing conflict in Gaza. “I have not gone and occupied any (of) Pakistan’s land which Israel has done (in Palestine). So, how the situation can be comparable,’’ Mukherjee told a news channel when asked about whether a response similar to that of Israel can be contemplated by India.
Pak officials meet to formulate response to Indian dossier
Top Pakistani officials held a meeting on Saturday to review and frame a response to the information dossier provided by India on the Mumbai terror attacks. Officials of the interior and foreign ministries and some security agencies met at the foreign office to review the Indian dossier and to formulate a response, TV channels said. The dossier comprising confession of Ajmal Amir Kasab, the lone terrorist arrested for the Mumbai attacks, transcripts of phone conversations between the attackers and their Pakistan-based handlers and other technical evidence was handed over to Pakistan on January 5. PTI

Article Window

Isn't that a plain attempt to dodge and smudge the issue here?

Another one:

WILL IT WORK?
Joint terror mechanism failed because of Pak denial mode
The Terror Mechanism Orphaned As Neither Side Is Seriously Executing It
TIMES NEWS NETWORK

New Delhi: The evidence shared by India with Pakistan and other foreign countries makes it amply clear why the joint anti-terrorism mechanism (JATM) between the two countries was doomed to fail from the start: for every Indian claim there is a Pakistani denial.
A sample of responses provided by Pakistan — contained in the dossier prepared by the foreign ministry — show that when asked to pursue a lead or track a person, Islamabad’s reply was that either the link was untraceable or no such person could be found. Most meetings of the joint mechanism set up by Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and former Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf saw variations of this script being played out.
During the special session of JATM in October 2008, a document was handed over based on interrogation of four Lashkar-e-Taiba members and two Al-Badr members and leads to the suicide bombing of the Indian embassy at Kabul on July 7, 2008. The Pakistani response was that investigations so far have not yielded anyone linked to the attack on the embassy being present in Pakistan.
With regard to evidence on statements and operations of Jaish-e-Mohammed, Lashkare-Taiba (LeT) and Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD), the response is that all the militant groups are banned in Pakistan. It is quite clear that there is no sincerity in Pakistan’s effort to work on leads gathered by Indian investigators. The cynicism in the Pakistani response can also be judged by the reference to the “banned” groups, a fiction no one in Pakistan is willing to buy, leave alone India.
The JATM, having proved a resounding failure, has been orphaned with no one willing to own up having authored it. It was certainly a concept that the PM laid some faith in, but the foreign ministry bureaucracy, which initially proposed the JATM, has been in hiding ever since Indian Mujahideen bombings blew the mechanism to smithereens.
India has repeatedly handed over what it considers relevant information based on interrogation of LeT and Jaish members. During an interaction on June 24, 2008, information on the attack on the CRPF camp at Rampur on January 1, 2008, about a plan to kidnap a political personality, and explosion at a cinema hall in Ludhiana on October 14, 2007, was handed over. As was a list of LeT terrorists killed in India as per JuD periodicals.
In a meeting of JATM om March 6, 2007, information regarding deportation of Mohammed Naeem from Bangladesh, explosions in Ahmedabad’s public transport, bombing of the special task force office in Hyderabad, grenade attacks on tourists in Srinagar and recovery of explosives from Aurangabad were discussed.
On October 22, 2007, Pakistan was informed with regard to attack on Mangat Ram Sharma, J&K ex-deputy chief minister, an attack on a meeting of the Prime Minister on November 17, 2004, another ones on CPM leader M Y Tarigami, the Firdaus cinema hall and the CRPF camp at Srinagar.

Article Window

The events in Gaza are a tragedy. Trying to link the Mumbai events to them is a farce.

 

[IceCold]

I dont see it as to how you call it a spin or an attempt to dodge? There is no spin in it and no one is trying to dodge here not us anyway. I will comment on two things one he accused the world of double standards, yes indeed and he was very right in that, because the world is showing double standards here. The number of people killed in Palestine is far greater infact 3 or 4 time more then those who got killed in Mumbai. He is absolutely right in pointing out this fact and the double standards maintained by the so called champions of Human rights of the world. But how exactly does that mean that he is spining stories to makeup. I didnt see anything nor did he say that just because more people are killed in Palestine, therefore we should stop the Mumbai investigation and focus on Palestine. His intention was only to highlight an equally important issue and i think India should have also done the same because this is too a form of terrorism.
Also as far as the feed back is concerned, the Indian autorties said they didnt received them and they will give their comment only when it will be received, but how exactly does it point out that we are spinning things up here AGAIN, no we are not. If we needed a spin then we would have also spin Kasab's indentity. Moreover if you talk about spinning things up, i'll suggest you read your governments remarks as well and the way they are trying to spin things up specially in an recent attempt when singh sb decided to accuse Pakistani state of its involvement in the Mumbai blasts for which they have provided no evidence.

The rest of the article is all blame game that we are seeing from day1. There hasnt been anychange in the attitude but truth to the matter is that if really India was able to bring everything on a white sheet of paper, then Pakistan would have been declared as a terrorist sponsoring state or the least it could do was to achieve an international condemnation, but did it happen, NO, that means that there are more fantasies then reality in the Indian claims and whatever the reality is, we have investigated and acted upon.

 

[roadrunner]

The FBI are not a neutral investigation team in this.

If anything, America is trying to forge closer ties with India to counter China.

I sincerely hope that Pakistan does not trust the FBI with any such things of the analysis.

It's like Pakistan bringing in China to investigate matters.

In all honesty, Pakistan should drop the USA now. China is the one to throw the tennis balls towards.

The FBI can find evidence where there is none. For example, WMD. So, they can find evidence anywhere.

 

[IceCold]

The FBI are not a neutral investigation team in this.

If anything, America is trying to forge closer ties with India to counter China.

I sincerely hope that Pakistan does not trust the FBI with any such things of the analysis.

It's like Pakistan bringing in China to investigate matters.

In all honesty, Pakistan should drop the USA now. China is the one to throw the tennis balls towards.

The FBI can find evidence where there is none. For example, WMD. So, they can find evidence anywhere.

I couldnt agree more but even with that the FBI has cleared the ISI and yet India/Indians seem to be vary of that as was clearly seen by the Indian PMs recent accusations about the involvement of the Pakistani state and its institutions.

 

[roadrunner]

Noone knows regarding the credibility of the evidence. For all we know, cartons of noodles frm Mustafa's shop that were stamped made in Pakistan, could easily have been bought and planted.

The evidence may exist, and may credibly exist, but whether this is proof of a coverup, or proof of the attacker's origin, is not known.

 

[Neo]

Its upto GoP and our High Comission to decide id the dossier is credible or not, not the foreign intelligentia serving its own interests. We should be granted access to the crime scene as requested by FO, it will help a lot.

 

[Vinod2070]

Icecold, if Pakistan's PM wanted to strongly condemn the Gaza tragedy he could have done that independently.

The attempt at linkages is pathetic. This combined with the statement about calling it an internal matter of India and intelligence failure doesn't send out positive signals.

 

[Neo]

We Can’t incriminate Pakistan agencies without evidence: U.S. envoy ​

Sunday January 11, 2009

While maintaining that it would work “non-stop” to bring the masterminds of the Mumbai terror attack to justice, the United States has not concurred with India’s formulation of official Pakistani agencies having given a helping hand to the attackers.

Speaking at a farewell ceremony for him organised by Confederation of India Industry here, U.S. Ambassador to India David Mulford sought to differentiate the American stand from the one articulated by Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and Union Home Minister P. Chidambaram.

“I don’t think we want to take the view that we make accusations against certain parties without the usual evidences or proofs. There is a new government in Pakistan which we support. So does India. We are seeking to assist it in carrying out its obligations,” Mr. Mulford said in response to questions, including whether the U.S. agreed with India’s suspicion of Pakistani agencies’ involvement in the terror attacks and if Islamabad was capable of taking on terrorist organisations.

“The U.S. has its own law. When Americans are killed anywhere, we pursue those people and that is what we are up to in Pakistan. We will press ahead and we will do it non-stop as long as it takes,” said Mr. Mulford.

“Like India, we have a common agenda — we want to see Pakistan succeed, not fail, not become a serious problem, not become a failed state. That is the American agenda. But the situation in Afghanistan has complicated that agenda where the U.S. is pursuing its national interests.”

 

[blain2]

Dossier is credible, but give Pakistan some time: Mulford

New Delhi: The U.S. has contended that the dossier given by India to Pakistan on the Mumbai attacks was “credible” but suggested that New Delhi should allow time to Islamabad to act on it.

U.S. ambassador to India David C. Mulford said the dossier contains extensive inputs from the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI).

“From what I have seen it is a very credible material. The FBI is cooperating in Mumbai...It is information which tells and gives a very accurate account of what has happened,” he told Karan Thapar’s programme ‘Devil’s Advocate.’

“As far as I see, it (FBI material) was used extensively because the material was the same.”

Underlining the credible aspect of the dossier, he said, “As far as the FBI is concerned, they do not deal with non-credible material. It is a truly professional organisation supported by absolutely hi-tech techniques.”

“A serious problem”

Mr. Mulford said, “There were handlers who were in touch with these people on the ground. It is a serious problem. This act of terrorism came from Pakistan.”

With reference to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s view that “official agencies” of Pakistan could have been involved in the terror strikes, the ambassador said, “I think one needs to be very careful about making those kinds of allegations unless you have very concrete evidence to that degree of specificity.”

He said his country cannot get into “that kind of specificity unless there is some justification for it.”

Mr. Mulford said there were a lot of things that tell that “this is a very serious situation. You don’t need to know that degree of specificity…to pursue the matter.”

Emphasising that Pakistan has a “serious problem on its hand,” he said, “you don’t need some kind of a definitive state to know that you have a definite problem on hand.”

On Pakistan’s virtual rejection of the credibility of evidence within 24 hours after getting it, he said, “Well, I don’t think you can cut some quick reaction on the statement of one particular individual. I think it takes some time. You have, after all, a situation where there is a civilian government, a very strong military, a very strong intelligence agency and a media and other players.

“And I think you have to take a view that it is going to take a little time to percolate to see what really is the outcome.”
Denial mode

He said, “Somebody in denial [mode] doesn’t necessarily remain in denial and isn’t always on a specific point in denial even if they are projecting a sense of denial.”

Mr. Mulford said, “It is complex and you would be mistaken to seize on a statement that is particularly irritating to you...”

He said the U.S. view was that the Pakistani government has “responded cooperatively with us.” — PTI
The Hindu : Front Page : Dossier is credible, but give Pakistan some time: Mulford

May also want to highlight "He said the U.S. view was that the Pakistani government has “responded cooperatively with us."

 

[must7]

GOP took action .. we took out Durrani a CIA agent from his position.

Now is that clear for the Americans & Indians.

 

[roadrunner]

May also want to highlight "He said the U.S. view was that the Pakistani government has “responded cooperatively with us."

I think too much emphasis is placed on the US as the judge and jury.

It really shouldnt matter what the US says. This is an Indo-Pak situation, and a neutral body like say Interpol should be doing the judging, if anyone. The US has its own interests in the region. You will find the conclusions of the US to match those of its interests.

 

[Jihad]

I think too much emphasis is placed on the US as the judge and jury.

It really shouldnt matter what the US says. This is an Indo-Pak situation, and a neutral body like say Interpol should be doing the judging, if anyone. The US has its own interests in the region. You will find the conclusions of the US to match those of its interests.

Well said, I have the same feeling too, Interpol would be much more reliable, afterall, the Americans have their own twists and turns for Pakistan and India.
FBI should stay out of this, mind their own business, let them interrogate and humiliate innocent people, something they're really good at.