Does religion make Muslims more violent?

[waleed3601]

To answer the title in one word,
'Yes'.

 

[haman10]

Islamic Republic of Iran is widely known in the West for exporting terror or state-sponsor of terrorism around the globe.

West ? who is west ? US , Israel and their puppet EU ? well show me a country that is their enemy and has not been accused of terrorism . name one ! Russia ? china ? iran ?

all of them are accused of supporting terrorism especially iran whose ideology is to bring hegemony down . ask the EU parliament why iran supports terrorism . the immediate answer is : iran supports hamas and hezbollah . well the jokes on them

To answer the title in one word,
'Yes'.

all the names you have mentioned in your signature will be proud of you for bringing bad name to islam . Mr.Jinnah , allama iqbal and bi nazir bhutto all will be proud of you .

and of course i'm being sarcastic here

actually it very much does....
I am sorry to say... but muslims are very much violent people...

yeah , Whaaaat the hellll ?

 

[TankMan]

@Norwegian

You give the examples of some Islamic or Islam dominant countries that are not plagued by terrorism. Because of "good governance"

Implying its not Islam but "bad governance" that leads to terrorism.

Well, I have news for you then. There are a ton of countries around the world that are basket cases of governance.

How many of those that have terrorism - and Islam is nowhere in the picture? Save Colombia, as pointed out above.

Do you see the mathematical equation developing here?

What a piece of total bullshit your argument is. Those non-Muslim countries that are 'basket cases of governance' haven't been invaded fifty times by certain 'champions of Democracy' in their political endeavors, neither do they have civil wars or regional conflicts around them.

And you're talking as if Colombia is the only non-Muslim country that has terrorism at all - well, I have news for you then. That list you're using is the countries with the most terrorism. Not the only countries in the world with terrorism at all. There are plenty of Non-Muslim countries with terrorism in them, currently.

 

[doppelganger]

@Norwegian @TankMan @haman10

Can we whittle this down further possibly?

Could it be that Islam per se is not the problem, neither Shia Islam, but its Wahabi Islam that is creating this storm around the world?

Here is their footprint over Europe .....

I know you guys feel the Shia influence from Iran is also partly to blame in your own country, but in India we do not seem to have a problem with Shia Islam per se. Coincidence?

 

[TankMan]

We are discussing current affairs here only. Not history.

The world has a Muslim terror problem now. Today.

We are not discussing the Crusades or Jihad a la Kingdom of Heaven here.

I did not mention any crusades. Your argument is a strawman.
The IRA, Vietcong and all are very recent. The Maoists are still currently terrorists.

Muslim countries have a lot of political problems now. Today. Don't be surprised when terrorists show up after certain countries are invaded multiple times while having civil wars and general political shitfests around them.

The 'world' (west, mostly) and its victim complex can go to hell.

 

[jamahir]

Nuff said ......

your map mentions columbia... what can you tell me about the situation??

@TankMan you too.

forget western bloc produced maps and discuss with me.

 

[Kaniska]

The very thread that outlines and implies something that every one should think about..If iti reaches a point where intellectuals has to justify that their practiced religion is peaceful, it raise the critical question that why do you has to justify that you are peaceful...

Here is my context...religion is always good...But every religion has faces and so does Islam has it...If you see Islam through eyes or Indonesia, Turkey or to some extent Shia people around the globe, the perception is not the same...They represent a modern and peaceful personality to the others...But the same perception does not go to other Muslim nations...That he implies one important thing...No religion should be even questioned wheather it is good or bad...It is the people who practice those religion should be judged at....A muslim in the West is vastly different than the Muslim in the Arab ore Muslim in South Asia...So based on the type of people and its followes, the religions gets a face...

Hence my conclusion is that if you are talking about Islam from Turkey, Indonesia, Bangladesh and to some extent Shia people, Muslims people ( Again I am not referring any way to the religion) is very much a religion that deserve respect....For the rest, I have very different views...

 

[TankMan]

@Norwegian @TankMan @haman10

Can we whittle this down further possibly?

Could it be that Islam per se is not the problem, neither Shia Islam, but its Wahabi Islam that is creating this storm around the world?

Here is their footprint over Europe .....

This word, 'Wahabi', is a misnomer. There is no such thing as 'Wahabi' Islam, at least not the way it is described to be.
By bringing in this, you are not 'watering down' anything but rather complicating it even more. This word, 'Wahabi', is a misnomer used by political Mullahs to remove the blame from themselves and discredit anyone who disagrees with them.

Firstly, we must define 'Wahabism'. It is a form of Salafism that follows the teachings of Muhammad bin Abdul Wahab, a scholar and political figure. Salafism is when you don't follow any of the four schools of thought.

There is nothing in Salafism that encourages terrorism - however, it gives a little more flexibility, so you can say it is easier to twist around and thus, more prone to extremist narratives.

Now, Wahabism is considered to be more extremist because it conflicts with the beliefs of certain scholars regarding things like saints and their graves etc. Abdul Wahab's position on this was that those who hold those beliefs (happens to be majority in the subcontinent especially) and have saints etc are not Muslims. That is a very bad position to have. Thus, this conflict results in a sectarian division that does become violent sometimes.

Secondly, a good portion of terrorists including major outfits such as the Taliban are Hanafi-Deobandi, which is very different from 'Wahabi Islam' as they are not Salafi and follow Imam Abu Hanifa.

Sorry for the long post, but you've stepped into a sectarian hornets nest by bringing in this topic.

DISCLAIMER - I am not a Wahabi. I strongly disagree with any form of takfir and tafarruq and thus do not identify with any sect. That technically makes me a Salafi, if someone is that fond of labels.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

No religion has anything to do with violence----. Violence in a society is about NO ORDER & NO RULE OF LAW.

You start providing people with expedient justice and have order in the society---the violence will disappear---.

Bottomline is that it is all about JUSTICE.

Anyone can bad mouth Islam, Prophet Mohammad, The Qura'an---but the problem here is with the MUSLIM---the MUSLIM is the one who is the CRIMINAL. He is the one not forcing order and the rule of law in his community.

 

[TankMan]

your map mentions columbia... what can you tell me about the situation??

@TankMan you too.

forget western bloc produced maps and discuss with me.

Colombia is having plenty of issues with separatists, a rebel group called FARC and practically a civil war because of it as paramilitary fighters are countering the rebels. I am not that knowledgeable about it, so i'll have to read up on it if we are to discuss that. Besides, it's also off-topic.

My point basically is that politics and warfare leads to ideological or religious terrorism, not the other way around. This has been the case historically and, being a Muslim and aware of Islamic ideology and texts, I see no reason to believe it's any different in this case.

Islam is being hijacked because of the current political landscape of predominantly Muslim regions.

 

[utraash]

There were millions of peaceful people on the streets before Iraq invasion! I get you understand that democracy doesn't always work in front of military industrial complex
Protests against the Iraq War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So killing some American/Canadian/Japanese journalist is their way of bringing down west at its knees ?
ME has been under such turmoil even before US invasion..... US exploited that situation to secure its own interest....
Brother I believe in one thing you reap what you sow n entire Islamic world is reaping what it sowed from Iran to Indonesia.....

 

[doppelganger]

Thanks @TankMan

Au contraire you post was very educative.

What are the 4 schools of thought that Salafism does not adhere to or diverges out of the bounds of?

Is Deobandism a sub group of Salafism, like Wahabism is?

What are the basic differences, points of divergence? Especially related to the topic - i.e. propensity for violence.

 

[Schutz]

No religion supports violence but humans do, and its a fact that religions are strongest in regions where people are desperate and life is generally shit. So when you are poor and uneducated you turn to religion, and because of your surroundings where there is a good chance you have an ak next to your door you probably have experienced some form of violence.

Now if you look at muslim communities in western countries where the culture is different its generally alot better for muslims although there are some groups who for cultural reasons are fairly violent, somalis, sometimes paksitans etc tend to hang around in gangs and cause trouble, more of a cultural issue of violence as opposed to religion but religious people are more WILLING to commit violence for their beliefs.

If 1% of the worlds population is mentally unstable/violent (lets face it its more than 1%) then thats millions of muslims in the world who are prepared to commit violent acts in the name of religion , and because a % of humans is generally aggressive/mentally unstable then you are likely to have alot of violent people in a religion, its not to do with religion.

The problem is though, a non religious mentally unstable person with aggressive tenancies might stab someone or just fight alot, if you have those mental problems and are religious your probably more likely to believe alot of extremist doctrine and as such more willing to commit far more dangerous acts than someone non religious with violence problems who most likely just has a drink and fights/causes trouble, the religious mentally unstable is probably watching hate preachers and thinking of starting Jihad.

 

[jamahir]

Thanks @TankMan

Au contraire you post was very educative.

What are the 4 schools of thought that Salafism does not adhere to or diverges out of the bounds of?

Is Deobandism a sub group of Salafism, like Wahabism is?

What are the basic differences, points of divergence? Especially related to the topic - i.e. propensity for violence.

deobandism ( from deoband town, present uttar pradesh ) and tableeghi jamaat are indianized and corrupted form of islam... and it is mainly this stream rather than wahabism that is responsible for most of today's "muslim" criminal gangs... so indian culture is responsible really for every fake-muslim gang committing terrorism from china to russia to afghanistan to africa to west asia.

 

[DrawingDead]

Try to provoke buddihsts, and you"ll get the same violence if not more.

Line from Anger Management "How does a guy who weighs over 600 lbs have the balls to teach people about self-discipline". Movies been out for 12 years. Haven't heard anyone being killed over it, have you? Compare that the Rushdie, the movie by the Egyptian guy, Charlie Hebdo, Danish cartoonist and then tell me the reaction is the same among followers of all religions.