Did you know Pakistan used to train Chinese engineers?

[KediKesenFare3]

We used to do that.. made Emirates.. taught the Arabs how to fight against Israel.. were the strongest economy.. were ruling India before that.. invaded it by calling in Bin Qasim.. gave Buddha his first university.. invented ceramic seals as part of Indus Valley Civilization.. recognized Fire as a useful tool.. crawled out from the ocean onto land.. were first cell to engage in Mitosis...

Glorious history

If I recall correctly, you even stood at the gates of Vienna several times.

Our people (Pakistanis & Turks) indulge in celebrating the past while our enemies are learning from their past. It's like holding a knife in your hand. You can either cut yourself or prepare a wonderful feast. Unfortunately, we tend to cut ourselves and our neighbors on top of that.

 

[313ghazi]

If I recall correctly, you even stood at the gates of Vienna several times.

Our people (Pakistanis & Turks) indulge in celebrating the past while our enemies are learning from their past. It's like holding a knife in your hand. You can either cut yourself or prepare a wonderful feast. Unfortunately, we tend to cut ourselves and our neighbors on top of that.

It's six of one and half a dozen of the other.

You're right - we do look back quite a bit, but at the same time, having positive role models is important. Who do people aspire to be like? In a world where you are near the bottom of the food chain, it helps to have role models to guide talent. I guess the important part is the bit where you stop day dreaming and get up to try and achieve something.

A bit part of success of motivation and marketing.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

It's six of one and half a dozen of the other.

You're right - we do look back quite a bit, but at the same time, having positive role models is important. Who do people aspire to be like? In a world where you are near the bottom of the food chain, it helps to have role models to guide talent. I guess the important part is the bit where you stop day dreaming and get up to try and achieve something.

A bit part of success of motivation and marketing.

Having the wrong role model is worse than having no role model at all. Take the Ottoman Empire as an example. It's gone due to its incapability of reformation. There is simply no need to take a bygone nation as a role mode because the very fact that it is past proves its ideational and therefore materialistic weakness.

Our people are trying to copy structures, conceptions and ideas which has been proven to be inferior many times in - our - history. Our enemies are learning from their and our mistakes, whereas we stuck in a vicious cycle of repeating our own faults again and again and expecting a different result at the same time - Einstein's very definition of insanity.

Instead of mimicking defective, hazy notions of the past, we should understand why those empires were successful. They prevailed because of their great ability to accommodate to the version of their present age modernity.

Something the entire Muslim world of our reality is unable or unwilling to do so.

Look at the past and take the right idea as a role model; if you can't do so, look at those who defeated you in your present and copy them. You may not be able to prevail but you'll prevent them from harming you once again. This is what China, Japan and Germany did.

Btw, I'm not good in articulating myself well in English but @Indus Pakistan or @Oscar kind of understand the points I'm desperately trying to make here. They could spell out my position much more accurately.

 

[I S I]

Who says I retired? This is part of the remit. Get the ****-stanis off guard; meanwhile the bushes are full of lean, hungry commandos, creeping forward.

Oh i see, serving BSF sipahis wasting their time on PDF while neglecting boarder security. That's why so called "mujahideens" are crossing the boarder in big numbers these days.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Oh i see, serving BSF sipahis wasting their time on PDF while neglecting boarder security. That's why so called "mujahideens" are crossing the boarder in big numbers these days.

Who says I was on 'boarder' duty? That's a different branch. And who says those are mujahideen from across the boarder? They are native to the land, and have lived there for at least 24 hours each.

 

[I S I]

and have lived there for at least 24 hours each.

Still a better time frame than BSF soldiers on LOC.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...this-year-since-2013/articleshow/64571103.cms

 

[Joe Shearer]

Still a better time frame than BSF soldiers on LOC.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...this-year-since-2013/articleshow/64571103.cms

Cheap shot. I don't mock soldiers dying. I don't admire or respect those who do.

 

[Crixus]

Good write up , India also suffers from the points raised by you the only difference maybe the extent....

Having the wrong role model is worse than having no role model at all. Take the Ottoman Empire as an example. It's gone due to its incapability of reformation. There is simply no need to take a bygone nation as a role mode because the very fact that it is past proves its ideational and therefore materialistic weakness.

Our people are trying to copy structures, conceptions and ideas which has been proven to be inferior many times in - our - history. Our enemies are learning from their and our mistakes, whereas we stuck in a vicious cycle of repeating our own faults again and again and expecting a different result at the same time - Einstein's very definition of insanity.

Instead of mimicking defective, hazy notions of the past, we should understand why those empires were successful. They prevailed because of their great ability to accommodate to the version of their present age modernity.

Something the entire Muslim world of our reality is unable or unwilling to do so.

Look at the past and take the right idea as a role model; if you can't do so, look at those who defeated you in your present and copy them. You may not be able to prevail but you'll prevent them from harming you once again. This is what China, Japan and Germany did.

Btw, I'm not good in articulating myself well in English but @Indus Pakistan or @Oscar kind of understand the points I'm desperately trying to make here. They could spell out my position much more accurately.

 

[313ghazi]

Having the wrong role model is worse than having no role model at all. Take the Ottoman Empire as an example. It's gone due to its incapability of reformation. There is simply no need to take a bygone nation as a role mode because the very fact that it is past proves its ideational and therefore materialistic weakness.

Our people are trying to copy structures, conceptions and ideas which has been proven to be inferior many times in - our - history. Our enemies are learning from their and our mistakes, whereas we stuck in a vicious cycle of repeating our own faults again and again and expecting a different result at the same time - Einstein's very definition of insanity.

Instead of mimicking defective, hazy notions of the past, we should understand why those empires were successful. They prevailed because of their great ability to accommodate to the version of their present age modernity.

Something the entire Muslim world of our reality is unable or unwilling to do so.

Look at the past and take the right idea as a role model; if you can't do so, look at those who defeated you in your present and copy them. You may not be able to prevail but you'll prevent them from harming you once again. This is what China, Japan and Germany did.

Btw, I'm not good in articulating myself well in English but @Indus Pakistan or @Oscar kind of understand the points I'm desperately trying to make here. They could spell out my position much more accurately.

Your English is fine, I agree with your point.

I am a big fan of a Turkish show Diriliş: Ertugrul. It is very popular amongst Muslims across the world.

Some people will watch this show and buy a hat and call them self an Alp and act like children. For them Ertugrul is Turkish Rambo.

Other people will watch this show and see lessons on how his state was built using trade, military might, political compromise and patience. Now Muslim countries today cannot be strong by making swords and carpets, but the wise there is a signal to focus on education and trade.

Everything in life is what you make from it. Like you said, history is not meant to be impersonated, but studied to learn lessons from only.

I do not know which country you live in. I live in the UK and here we are taught success is found in pushing forwards, In improving, innovating and exploring new ideas.

 

[I S I]

Cheap shot. I don't mock soldiers dying. I don't admire or respect those who do.

Mujahideens are also soldiers of Indian Occupied Kashmir.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Mujahideens are also soldiers of Indian Occupied Kashmir.

This is not an exchange that gives me pleasure. Feel free to search through my 19080 posts and do let me know when you find one mocking the death of another human being.

 

[I S I]

This is not an exchange that gives me pleasure. Feel free to search through my 19080 posts and do let me know when you find one mocking the death of another human being.

Hypocrisy at its finest. Not surprised though. Indians are Pro in it.

They are native to the land, and have lived there for at least 24 hours each

 

[Joe Shearer]

Hypocrisy at its finest. Not surprised though. Indians are Pro in it.

I cannot say that some others are pros at anything, including selecting their terms carefully. You refer to mujahedin; nobody objects, it is your privilege, we have free speech on this forum, within limits. You had the audacity to say what has been denied consistently of late, that these were infiltrators.

The official story, from YOUR side, is that these are native Kashmiris, and that is what I referred to. YOUR official stance on the issue. No mockery involved, except of the statement you used.

Look again, Mr. Fact Checker.

 

[I S I]

we have free speech on this forum, within limits.

So do i. I have every right to express my opinion here which is that Indian Army is an army of cowards which can only target unarmed innocent IOK civilians by labelling them as "inflators" & "aatankwadiis".

Ahhh wait... Your army men are also very good at killing each other & committing suicides on daily basis in fear of getting a sniper shot by Pak Rangers right in their filthy heads...
Or maybe it's all because of salt-less "daal" you get served on daily basis.

 

[Joe Shearer]

So do i. I have every right to express my opinion here which is that Indian Army is an army of cowards which can only target unarmed innocent IOK civilians by labelling them as "inflators" & "aatankwadiis".

Ahhh wait... Your army men are also very good at killing each other & committing suicides on daily basis in fair of getting a sniper shot by Pak Rangers right in their filthy heads...
Or maybe it's all because of salt-less "daal" you get served on daily basis.

'Inflators'? The only inflators of the forum are members like you.

As far as those whom you yourself have called infiltrators are concerned, no residents of the Vale have to infiltrate. You have given yourself away, as I lost no time in pointing out.

It is of no use, after committing this ghastly mistake, for you to wriggle around, once hiding behind those who are misguided into coming into the Vale to be killed in short order, once attacking other people's soldiers, all the while snugly behind a desk somewhere, fighting every war by proxy.