Debunking Kargil Myths & How Pakistan Captured Point 5353

[LASER1]

they forget what was the objective of that conflict

Always do. Never fulfilled the main objective neither gained anything. The only gain was the Indus Water Treaty.

 

[Dalai Lama]

Half of Kashmir is already under Pakistan control. It's your half which is rebelling. It's your half which has over 1 million soldiers occupying 5 million Kashmiris.

All we need to do is sit back, and watch IOK further fall into abyss. How many stone peltings will your soldiers take until mutiny occurs and they refuse to be deployed to IOK?

You spend 10x more in your half than Pakistan does in it's half. Hang on cause it's gonna be a rough ride for you.

The cries for independence and whatever else will diminish as long as people have jobs, food and shelter. Admittedly, GoI has thus far failed to provide this to the Kashmiri people but thankfully we are on the path to prosperity and the future looks good for India and Asia in general.

People ultimately yearn for wealth and comfort, Kashmiris are not stupid people. Pakistan, if it continues to go the way it is will be left behind while the rest of Asia develops. Why would anyone want to be part of that?

 

[doorstar]

Half of Kashmir is already under Pakistan control.

I wonder how much Shri Modi Ji would pay me for using that ever-so subtle phrase to back his claim on Gilgit & Baltistan.

Pakistan controls less than 30% of the region even if Gilgit–Baltistan and Azad Kashmir are combined. Gilgit-Baltistan region is 6 times the size of Azad Kashmir, which means that Azad Kashmir only consists of a small sliver of land containing 3 districts now probably subdivided into more districts due to increase in population, but the land mass is still only that tiny strip of land

More myth creation is going on here than the supposed debunking

 

[Indus Priest King]

The cries for independence and whatever else will diminish as long as people have jobs, food and shelter. Admittedly, GoI has thus far failed to provide this to the Kashmiri people but thankfully we are on the path to prosperity and the future looks good for India and Asia in general.

Lol.

People ultimately yearn for wealth and comfort, Kashmiris are not stupid people. Pakistan, if it continues to go the way it is will be left behind while the rest of Asia develops. Why would anyone want to be part of that?

Lololol

1 million soldiers stuck in Kashmir...and talks like they have the upper hand. Have you ever talked to a soldier who deployed to IOK in your life?

They're not exactly happy being pelted with stones...not to mention lack of food and dismel conditions in winter.

Your arrogance is both laughable and sad at the same time.

As Kashmiris become more connected with the world and become less reliant on militancy and become more politically active, you're going to witness a Catalonia type situation whereby Kashmir will keep India hostage. You'll have to give in to any concession they say.

We'll be off on tbe sides laughing. I bet there will come a point where the Indian masses will say...please seperate from India. Lol.

I wonder how much Shri Modi Ji would pay me for using that ever-so subtle phrase to back his claim on Gilgit & Baltistan.

Pakistan only controls 30% of the region if Gilgit–Baltistan and Azad Kashmir are combined. Gilgit-Baltistan region is 6 times the size of Azad Kashmir, which means that Azad Kashmir only consists of a small sliver of land containing 3 districts now probably subdivided into more districts due to increase in population, but the land mass is still only that tiny strip of land

More myth creation is going on here than the supposed debunking

When you mark the LoC, about half is under Pak admin the other under Indian occupation. What exactly are you saying?

 

[doorstar]

When you mark the LoC, about half is under Pak admin the other under Indian occupation. What exactly are you saying?

I am saying that:
Pakistan controls less than 30% of the region even if Gilgit–Baltistan and Azad Kashmir are combined. Gilgit-Baltistan region is 6 times the size of Azad Kashmir, which means that Azad Kashmir only consists of a small sliver of land containing 3 districts now probably subdivided into more districts due to increase in population, but the land mass is still only that tiny strip of land

More myth creation is going on here than the supposed debunking.

I've been there, seen it on maps, and can still read maps and am still able to calculate ratios.

Getting knowledge about Kashmir from wiki or from Indian sources on internet is not the same as actually knowing it.

1 more time:
Azad Kashmir is NOT the same size as maqboozah Kashmir even if you include Northern areas of Pakistan (which no sane Pakistani would)

You are giving legitimacy to Indian (anti-CPEC) rhetoric, you are even using Indian phraseology.

 

[Indus Priest King]

I was referring to the former JK Princely State...I'm well aware of GB and AJK. Okay 30%...does that change anything? Not really...you're acting like we gave no part of Kashmir at all.

And I'm also well versed in what the Gilgit scouts did and forcing Ghansara Singh and his Indian forces to surrender Gilgit.

I don't recognize British provinces anyway. I was just making a point. We also control a part of the former princely state with less troops and less costs.

 

[Trango Towers]

The thing is Pakistan is not content on just keeping its half of Kashmir, it wants all of Kashmir. India, on the other hand, is content on just keeping the half under its control.

Pakistan has been waiting 70-years to get all of Kashmir and it looks like it will be waiting 70 more. Pakistan doesn't have the wherewithal to do anything on Kashmir like it did in 1999. Its resources are limited and its economy is even in worst shape today than in 1999. India can well afford to spend 10x or even 20x in Kashmir. So don't worry about the economic costs.

And there will be no more Kargil like misadventures this time around. Tactical nukes are a viable option now, and the Indian Army is not the same in 2018 as it is in 1999. If Kargil proved anything, is that Indian military had severe shortcomings, but it is making strides in this regard.

Yes in 2018
Indian soldier beg for food
India soldier beg for ammo
India doesn't have the kashmiri population against it
What on earth are you smoking

You still having Siachin on papers till now...

And that's all you got

 

[cloud4000]

Yes in 2018
Indian soldier beg for food
India soldier beg for ammo
India doesn't have the kashmiri population against it
What on earth are you smoking

I'm not smoking anything, but there are some on this forum who are definitely smoking something if they think 1) Kargil was a victory for Pakistan 2) Pakistan will get Kashmir in the next five minutes.

 

[darksider]

Dont derail the thread.
I just want to see a proof from indians.
Just show me on map where is 5353 peak? We can talk about kashmir in other threads.here just talk about kargil.

 

[doorstar]

I was referring to the former JK Princely State...I'm well aware of GB and AJK. Okay 30%...does that change anything? Not really...you're acting like we gave no part of Kashmir at all.

And I'm also well versed in what the Gilgit scouts did and forcing Ghansara Singh and his Indian forces to surrender Gilgit.

I don't recognize British provinces anyway. I was just making a point.

'Gilgit Agency' is made up of the princely states of Hunza and Nagar NOT part of Kashmir

----- Gilgit-Baltistan Area- 072,971 km²

------ Azad Kashmir Area- 013297K km²
Maqboozah Kashmir Area- 222,236 km²

We also control a part of the former princely state with less troops and less costs.

This implies that Pakistan is controlling AJK through force like Indians do in maqbooza areas. Pakistani troops are controlling nothing in AJK except for the LoC.

 

[Trango Towers]

I'm not smoking anything, but there are some on this forum who are definitely smoking something if they think 1) Kargil was a victory for Pakistan 2) Pakistan will get Kashmir in the next five minutes.

Kargil heights aren't still occupied by pakistan and Pakistan didn't take half of Kashmir by force.

Wake up get medical help

 

[Amalek]

Taking point 5353 is impractical from the Indian side. Terrain does not allow it. I am sure the Indian Army has 3D mapped the entire mountain range and mapped out best possible paths to the summit. But it has lost all strategic value in recent times.

It was useful as artillery observation post only, not staging area. But today, we have drones that can help direct artillery very well. No need to risk any soldier lives for that peak.

It is disheartening to see so many lives and resources being wasted over empty mountains.

 

[Trango Towers]

Taking point 5353 is impractical from the Indian side. Terrain does not allow it. I am sure the Indian Army has 3D mapped the entire mountain range and mapped out best possible paths to the summit. But it has lost all strategic value in recent times.

It was useful as artillery observation post only, not staging area. But today, we have drones that can help direct artillery very well. No need to risk any soldier lives for that peak.

It is disheartening to see so many lives and resources being wasted over empty mountains.

Nicely put.

Using your logic vacate Kashmir. Pakistan will ensure peace as there is no other beef between us and we live happily ever after. Andnyout drones can monitor the situation from afar. No need to risk 700000 plus lives for empty mountainous place like Kashmir

 

[Amalek]

Nicely put.

Using your logic vacate Kashmir. Pakistan will ensure peace as there is no other beef between us and we live happily ever after. Andnyout drones can monitor the situation from afar. No need to risk 700000 plus lives for empty mountainous place like Kashmir

The fight will go on. India's territorial integrity is at stake. It is an unfortunate situation. These scarce resources could have help improve lives of our people. But we are destined to waste it all away.

 

[Trango Towers]

The fight will go on. India's territorial integrity is at stake. It is an unfortunate situation. These scarce resources could have help improve lives of our people. But we are destined to waste it all away.

but you indians can end it. vacate kashmir and problem solved.
territorial integrity is just cobblers we took pakistan from you and Bangladesh....so cut the crap