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Thales To Deliver AESA Radars Soon - Defense News

Thales To Deliver AESA Radars Soon
By PIERRE TRAN

PARIS - Thales will begin deliveries in August of the first production batch of active electronically scanned array (AESA) radars for the fourth tranche of Rafale strike fighters, Pierre-Yves Chaltiel, head of electronic combat systems, said July 6.

A relative maturity in production of the AESA sensor allows Thales to launch the Searchmaster range of derivative products, which uses the active array technology. A compact version will be sold for UAVs and helicopters, and a larger model for medium-altitude, long-endurance drones, ground surveillance and maritime patrol aircraft, Chaltiel said.

The delivery of AESA production units marks the culmination of some 12 years' work and more than one billion euros ($1.3 billion) of government and industry investment, he told journalists ahead of the Farnborough airshow, which opens July 19.

It has taken "more than 10 years' effort to get to this stage," he said.

In the world market, only three industrial teams could claim this level of technological maturity, namely Lockheed Martin and Northrop Grumman, Boeing and Raytheon, and Dassault Aviation and Thales, he said.

An AESA radar will significantly boost operational capabilities for the Rafale in terms of range, interception, tracking a multithreat environment and also improve countermeasures.

The technology will allow for the first time the same active array to be used for the radar and countermeasures.

"It will be the only European aircraft with this capability," he said.

The AESA radars will equip the fourth tranche of 60 Rafales ordered by the Direction Générale pour l'Armement (DGA) procurement office at the end of 2009. No financial details were available. A preproduction batch of three AESA radars have flown on the Falcon, Mirage 2000 and Rafale.

The tranche-four Rafales will operate at the F3 standard and the first AESA-equipped squadron is expected to be operational in 2012.

Some five or six countries have shown interest in the Searchmaster concept, which could be delivered in two years for the compact model and five years for the larger version.

The I-Master radar developed for the British Watchkeeper tactical UAV has drawn interest from the U.S. Army and Marine Corps, Chaltiel said.

Chaltiel outlined the technology roadmap for developing the AESA radar, which uses a patented cloud technology receiver module system, intended to allow insertion of new technology over the next 20 years without requiring extensive recertification.

Eurofighter's E-Scan

In another European radar development, Eurofighter has signaled it plans to launch an e-scan radar program for the four-nation Typhoon fighter.

The German-based plane maker said July 6 that it planned to announce an "important industrial agreement to further upgrade the Typhoon" at a July 20 press conference at the Farnborough air show.

Eurofighter program sources say the four partner nations will give the go-ahead to the Selex-led program to equip the fighter with the must-have e-scan radar.

The new sensor is vital to the aircraft's chances of winning major export orders in India and Japan.

The company couldn't be reached for a comment.

Eurofighter is owned by BAE Systems, Finmeccanica and the German and Spanish parts of EADS.

 

[Dash]

Rafale is silently and teadily making progress, by teh time MOD will be negotiating for price, they will field the operational AESA.

this is what happens when you develope something on your own. Decisions are quicker and faster. Unlike Eurofighter which is still struggling with what kind of AESA they will field.

Too many chickens spoil the broath.

 

[sancho]

Rafale is silently and teadily making progress, by teh time MOD will be negotiating for price, they will field the operational AESA.

this is what happens when you develope something on your own. Decisions are quicker and faster. Unlike Eurofighter which is still struggling with what kind of AESA they will field.

Too many chickens spoil the broath.

Or you have to do it like the Americans, get a lot of so called "partners" in the F35 developments, but none of them has any say in the development and just remains as financiers.

Partners are good, if they have the same aim and that was the problem in the EF development. Italy and UK always saw it as an air superiority fighter and had the F35 development in their pocket for A2G roles. Germany and France instead wanted to replace all fighters with one multi role fighter, that's why France left the project and made Rafale alone and now Germany is fighting more, or less alone for EF and it's future developments. However, now with the financial crisis and UK, ITA and even GER reducing the orders, the whole project is going nowhere anymore. Sad, but that's the way it is and India can't take such a risk, while having LCA and future 5. gen developments in the pipeline.
MMRCA must be ready and operational as soon as possible and inducted fast and as far as I see it only Rafale and the US fighters can offer that.

 

[Dash]

Partners are good, if they have the same aim and that was the problem in the EF development. Italy and UK always saw it as an air superiority fighter and had the F35 development in their pocket for A2G roles.

It cant be funnier from UK to choose a 5th Gen plane for A2G and choose a 4++ for air superiority. But I guess they choose it after knowing they cant get F-22 and F-35 is better in trike than air superiority for it low turn rate.

However, now with the financial crisis and UK, ITA and even GER reducing the orders, the whole project is going nowhere anymore. Sad, but that's the way it is and India can't take such a risk, while having LCA and future 5. gen developments in the pipeline.

i will agree with this Sancho, but I just posted my analysis on the MRCA elimination thread. I just deflected my vision and I thought -
With the recent crisis in Europe, India can be a good funding partner for the program and they need this deal more than we need them. If this deal crashes for them then BAE will be very much bothered.
We can take advantage of this situation and negotiate it to a level where we can rip the benifits in future. utilize them in LCA deal for engines and not to mention EADS is a choice for DRDO too. If we can help germany at this time of crisis along with Italy then we get a partner for a long time to come. I will not go into others details but i see a gain here.

What do you say.?

 

[saurabh]

It cant be funnier from UK to choose a 5th Gen plane for A2G and choose a 4++ for air superiority. But I guess they choose it after knowing they cant get F-22 and F-35 is better in trike than air superiority for it low turn rate.

Should not F-35 still be better for air superiority, than EFT? It can atleast perform hit and run, go close to enemy aircraft, fire and run away. Enemy can't fire at something it can't see!

 

[praveen007]

^^^for hit-n-run u must have to have speed-n-manuvarability which is quit less in f-35(mac-1.8) than eft(mac-2.4).

 

[Dash]

Should not F-35 still be better for air superiority, than EFT? It can atleast perform hit and run, go close to enemy aircraft, fire and run away. Enemy can't fire at something it can't see!

It can be, however we need to look at the challenges in air superriority combat.

When you are trying to achieve air superiority, meaning to say you either make deep penetration strikes. You are bound to face point defense and other sir superiority fighters.

Every one is capable of BVR and a fighter doesnt always has a head on. You are attacked by sides by SAMs, detected by AWACS and so on...

What you most nestly need to have is better TTW, high acceleration, Excellent agility and many other things..
And F-35 at 49,500 pounds in air-to-air take-off weight with an engine rated at 42,000 pounds of thrust, it will be a significant step backward in thrust-to-weight and acceleration for a new fighter. In fact, at that weight and with just 460 square feet of wing area for the Air Force and Marine Corps versions, the F-35's small wings will be loaded with 108 pounds for every square foot, one third worse than the F-16A.

This aircraft is not made for the worst case scenario and in war thats what counts.

 

[saurabh]

It can be, however we need to look at the challenges in air superriority combat.

When you are trying to achieve air superiority, meaning to say you either make deep penetration strikes. You are bound to face point defense and other sir superiority fighters.

Every one is capable of BVR and a fighter doesnt always has a head on. You are attacked by sides by SAMs, detected by AWACS and so on...

Isn't the whole idea of stealth is to avoid being detected by SAMs, AWACS, and other fighters?!! Just sneak in, without getting noticed, and your enemy is dead without knowing who did what! Or may be I am having wrong ideas about this whole stealth concept!

 

[anathema]

When you are trying to achieve air superiority, meaning to say you either make deep penetration strikes. You are bound to face point defense and other sir superiority fighters.

Every one is capable of BVR and a fighter doesnt always has a head on. You are attacked by sides by SAMs, detected by AWACS and so on...

Dash how are you going to counter F35's stealth which is second to F22 (excluding the b2's , b1's etc). Note that Interceptors can/may track F35 through IRST -- but by that time i suspect that the MAWS system on the interceptor will start to blare out load. SAM's doesnt even have that hope. AWACS again can detect F35 through IRST but it will be too late.

What you most nestly need to have is better TTW, high acceleration, Excellent agility and many other things..
And F-35 at 49,500 pounds in air-to-air take-off weight with an engine rated at 42,000 pounds of thrust, it will be a significant step backward in thrust-to-weight and acceleration for a new fighter. In fact, at that weight and with just 460 square feet of wing area for the Air Force and Marine Corps versions, the F-35's small wings will be loaded with 108 pounds for every square foot, one third worse than the F-16A.

On paper F35's performance characteristics are really poor when compared to latest 4th gen fighters -- but what it does have is Stealth and one of the best situational awareness suits in the form of DASS ( note i am saying best because well anything that has skunkworks on it is best)....

So on paper it has a poor twr ratio , 4 missile capability , etc .... but the catch phrase of F35 has always been --
'Stealthy 5th Generation fighter aircraft for a low price' -- PAKFA might change all that when it comes into play.

---------- Post added at 01:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:25 AM ----------

Isn't the whole idea of stealth is to avoid being detected by SAMs, AWACS, and other fighters?!! Just sneak in, without getting noticed, and your enemy is dead without knowing who did what! Or may be I am having wrong ideas about this whole stealth concept!

You are absolutely right -- lets hear what dash has to say.

 

[Dash]

Isn't the whole idea of stealth is to avoid being detected by SAMs, AWACS, and other fighters?!! Just sneak in, without getting noticed, and your enemy is dead without knowing who did what! Or may be I am having wrong ideas about this whole stealth concept!

Ok, we are going into discussion out of MRCA scope, however here are my own openions.(though Iam not an arodynamics expert, but with some knowledge I have and with friends I have this is what they say).

First of all, Do you really think a fighter, Undetected by anything, will sneak into enemy border, drop bombs on important installations and get away???...sounds like a science fiction story and nothing more. It could get close to a science fiction story only if US is attacking some African country but not that close is it?..

Next to F-22 means nothing....F-35 is only designed to have front aspect stealth. In many debates the front aspect stealth gives an advantage with head on combats only.

Think if the F-35 is countering S-300/400 then there is a real problem.
Just know that no countries borders are straight and not all S-300s will have headon visuals of the incoming F-35s. There will be several such SAM sites which will get a lock on on F-35 around 70-80 Kms
Coz these systems have 400 Km detection range for 1m2 targets.

The AWACS operating in L-Band radar modes will also get a visual of F-35 as F-35 is highly optimised against X band radars. A fighter which produces a tennis ball sized radar return in X band will produce a basket ball sized radar return in a lower band. The fighter built with high X band stealth will have to fight it out with its own aero dynamics.

The F-22 has enough sensor power and arodynamic power to bypass these scenarios, but The F-35 has only one power, if it doesnt get bypassed by the radars then it will be doomed, coz it has serious issues with its power.

 

[dbc]

Ok, we are going into discussion out of MRCA scope, however here are my own openions.(though Iam not an arodynamics expert, but with some knowledge I have and with friends I have this is what they say).

First of all, Do you really think a fighter, Undetected by anything, will sneak into enemy border, drop bombs on important installations and get away???...sounds like a science fiction story and nothing more. It could get close to a science fiction story only if US is attacking some African country but not that close is it?..

Next to F-22 means nothing....F-35 is only designed to have front aspect stealth. In many debates the front aspect stealth gives an advantage with head on combats only.

Think if the F-35 is countering S-300/400 then there is a real problem.
Just know that no countries borders are straight and not all S-300s will have headon visuals of the incoming F-35s. There will be several such SAM sites which will get a lock on on F-35 around 70-80 Kms
Coz these systems have 400 Km detection range for 1m2 targets.

The AWACS operating in L-Band radar modes will also get a visual of F-35 as F-35 is highly optimised against X band radars. A fighter which produces a tennis ball sized radar return in X band will produce a basket ball sized radar return in a lower band. The fighter built with high X band stealth will have to fight it out with its own aero dynamics.

The F-22 has enough sensor power and arodynamic power to bypass these scenarios, but The F-35 has only one power, if it doesnt get bypassed by the radars then it will be doomed, coz it has serious issues with its power.

..not the right thread to spread your ignorance. Neither the F-22 nor the F-35 are in the MRCA competition so please stay on topic - thank you.

 

[Dash]

..not the right thread to spread your ignorance. Neither the F-22 nor the F-35 are in the MRCA competition so please stay on topic - thank you.

You are not welcome as I already mentioned this is not the right thread.
So thank "You" and stick to your own thread.

 

[CONNAN]

Europe launches a broadside against US in `mother of all defence deals'

NEW DELHI: The Europeans have launched a fresh counter-offensive to ensure the perceived US influence does not skew the hotly-contested battle to grab the "mother of all defence deals", the lucrative $10.4 billion project to acquire 126 fighters for IAF.

The defence ministry does proclaim the selection process in the medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) project, which has now entered a decisive phase with IAF finalising its technical evaluation report after gruelling field trials of the six foreign fighters in contention, will be "competitive, fair and transparent".

But it's also a fact that India is sure to factor in its geo-political considerations while finally choosing the MMRCA winner, with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh himself in the past holding that large defence deals should be leveraged to serve the country's larger political and diplomatic ends.

With the Americans increasingly cornering a major chunk of the lucrative Indian defence market, the Europeans are obviously apprehensive. Some of them even see the "American hand" behind the last-minute scrapping of virtually-finalised deals like the $1.5 billion one for six Airbus A-330 MRTT mid-air refuellers with European aerospace major EADS.

They do not want the story to be repeated with the MMRCA project, in which Eurofighter Typhoon is pitted against the American F/A-18 `Super Hornet' (Boeing) and F-16 `Falcon' (Lockheed Martin), apart from Swedish Gripen (Saab), French Rafale (Dassault) and Russian MiG-35 (United Aircraft Corporation).

"Through Eurofighter, four nations (UK, Germany, Spain and Italy) have come together to enter into a real security and cutting-edge technology partnership with India for the next 20 to 30 years," said German ambassador Thomas Matussek.

Holding that the "unhappiness" over the cancelled deals had been conveyed to the Indian government, Matussek wondered whether India would like to acquire a fighter which was flying across the border as well, in a clear reference to the US supplying F-16s to Pakistan despite Indian objections.

Added the CEO of EADS military air systems, Bernhard Gerwert, "Our price is the best value for money. Our bid has the full support of the four nations. So, we are not afraid of competition."

The strong European pitch comes soon after the American undersecretary of defence for policy, Michele Flournoy, strongly advocated "US solutions for India's defence needs" to further cement the expansive Indo-US strategic partnership.

The inking of the MMRCA project, of course, will still take well over a year. The defence ministry will open the commercial bids only after a shortlist of the fighters is drawn up keeping in mind the field evaluation test and the staff evaluation.

Complex issues like "life-cycle costs" and 50% offsets, among other things, will have to negotiated before the actual contract is signed. So, the race is still very much open.

 

[sancho]

Nope , Eurofighter was the first one to have this capability ,

I have highlighted concerned text with yellow marker in picture...

DASS (btw now called Pretorian) was the first "so called" fully integrated system, but actually it uses the wingtip stations for the ECM pods and that indeed occupies weapon stations just like poded version before. Spectra instead has the pod at the tail fin and is really a fully integrated system.
Also the normal DASS includes only the ECM pods with RWRs, MAWs, LWRs, or TD are only optional features and only UK EFs use them all so far. Spectra instead combines these features at once!

Regarding 360° detection:

The modular nature of the DASS has also resulted in each consortium nation refining their individual DASS fits. At this time it is becoming increasingly clear that only the Royal Air Force Typhoon's will employ the full set of detection and counter measure systems originally envisaged. However this can be seen as being of potential benefit for overseas purchases who will be able to specify individual fits tailored to their requirements. An additional benefit of using such a modular system is that upgrade paths can be somewhat simplified. At the present time (mid-2000) discussions are already underway as to future improvements in the DASS architecture for each subsequent Tranche. This will lead to later Eurofighter's benefiting from complete 360° spherical detection and protection capabilities. However even in its current state DASS represents one of the most advanced self-protection systems available.

So DASS in future might offer comparable performance, but not at the moment, while Spectra already has this and is increasing the capabilities with the new addition of NG DDM, which will be integrated by 2012.

The best way to explain what imo gives Spectra a clear edge over comparabel 4th gen systems and makes it even comparable to the 5. gen EO DAS EWS of F35 is like this:

The DAS provides:
-Multi spectral full spherical coverage
-Missile detection and tracking
-Launch point detection
-Situational awareness IRST & cueing
-Weapons support
-Day/night navigation

Now compare that to Spectra:

Spectra EW system, developed by Thales and MBDA, provides a multi-spectral threat warning capability against hostile radars, missiles and lasers. According to test pilots who have flown the Rafale, the EW system provides the aircraft with the highest survivability assets against airborne and ground threats to date. It also provides passive, 360-degree tactical situation awareness.

Considered a fully automatic self-protection system, Spectra provides passive, all-weather reliable, long-range detection, identification and geographical location of threats in the infrared, electromagnectic and electro-optical ranges. It uses short response times and cutting-edge defensive measures based on a combination of jamming, decoying and evasive maneuvers and technologies, such as Digital Radio Frequency Memory (DRFM) for signal processing.

The efficiency of Spectra notably was demonstrated in 2008 at the Red Flag exercise at Nellis Air Force Base, Nevada, where during all sorties the Rafale escaped SAM missile threats. This followed a successful demonstration at the NATO MACE electronic warfare campaign in Europe.

The angular localization performance of Spectra makes it possible to precisely discover ground threats and to target them for immediate destruction with precision-guided munitions. In this totally passive mode, Spectra is also used as a general awareness and intelligence reporting system...

In addition to that:

According to Lt. Colonel Fabrice Grandclaudon, squadron leader of the EC 1/7 in Saint-Dizier and commander of the detachment," the weapon system Rafale, taking its place in COMAO (raids) of thirty different combat aircrafts, made at the ATLC the demonstration of his extraordinary flexibility. And to cite the case of this mission on November 29 during which a Rafale pilot, has launched, in barely 66 seconds, 3 Mica on 3 enemy planes (two virtually destroyed) and six AASM bombs on as many targets, some 48 km far . All destroyed!

Versatility is not an empty word.

Better yet, december 7, a pair of Rafale which protected a SAR combat device shot down 10 incoming hostile fighters while dropping six AASM on 6 different land targets forty km far , everything without leaving their CAP racetrack.In addition, the Rafale OSF allowed the positive identification of hostile fighters forty kilometers far. And, December 6, a MICA has been assigned its target - indeed virtually destroyed - only with the SPECTRA system. SPECTRA which was also capable, twice, to detect and classify - and to propose flight path changes to the pilot to avoid detection-specific envelope - some air defense systems (SA-6) that even the F-16 CJ American specialized in the SEAD mission (suppression of air defense opponents), yet also in flight, were not able to collect

As you can see, just like F35s EO DAS (a so called 5. gen system), Spectra already provides enhanced situational awareness through 360° multi spectral full spherical coverage, weapon cueing, day and night navigation and all that besides the normal aim of an EWS, to detect threats and counter them by jammig, or using chaf and flares.
Spectra, which it also does excellent (no kill by a ground target during Red Flag)!
With techs like this it shouldn't surprising, why they found the French technology package more comprehensive and why the Rafale came out very close behind the F35 in the technical evaluation in the Netherlands.


Here some more infos about it:

Self Defence:
The Rafale's SPECTRA (Système de Protection et d'Evitement des Conduites de Tir du Rafale – Self Protection Equipment Countering Threats of Rafale Aircraft) is one of the most advanced EW suites ever created for a combat aircraft. Being of a modulare design, SPECTRA is controlled by the GIC computer (Gestion de l'Interface et Compatibilité) comprising 3 processors.
The SPECTRA components include:
- 3 digital RWR antennas with each 120° azimuth coverage and a frequency coverage of 2 - 40 GHz mounted on the airlift intakes and at the rear of the SPECTRA fin tip pod. Functions/characteristics include:
- detection localisation, identification and priorisation of radar emitters at distances up to 200 km+ (EFs EWS has only half the detection range)
- Bearing accuracy below 1° in azimuth using interferometry
- Weapon cueing against ground based emitters
- ELINT/SIGINT

- Active ECM system with DRFM and AESA antennas in the canard roots and in the tail pod at the base of the fin, with offensive, defensive and stealthy jamming modes. Pencil thin jamming beams are directed towards threat emitters

- DDM (Détecteur infrarouge de Départ de Missiles) missile approach warning system based on dual-band midwave IR sensors which are located on each side of the SPECTRA fin tip pod, providing 360° atimuth coverage

- 3 DAL (Detecteur d’Alerte Laser) laser warning receivers with sensors on the fuselage sides and the rear of the SPECTRA fin tip pod

- 4 vertical firing flare/decoy dispensers on the top of the fuselage near the wing trailing edges and 2 chaff dispensers on the rear fuselage sides behind the wings

Note:
The RWR and ECM systems are integrated as the DBEM (Détection et Brouillage Electromagnétique) sub-system.

 

[sancho]

Sorry, forgot this part:

If you meant by destroying missile launchers ,
one - you no longer remain passive
second - you are giving away your own position

As you mention about cost wrt to weapons , any air-force would prefer cost-effective solution ? ? ?

Possible, but you need to keep in mind that we will have big numbers of cost-effective Russian and soon even indigenous weapons and the lesson we learned from Kargil should be, that it is good to have an capable alternative, be it on the weapon side, as well as for fighters.

The French already offered in Brazil that they can integrate their weapons like A Darter (WVR missile, co-developed with South Africa), or MAR-1 (anti-radiation missile) and so could we do it too. Our LGB should be more cost-effective than US Paveway bombs, just like Astra should be compared to MICA EM. But in addition to them, some more capable weapons like AASM, Meteor as well as Scalp missiles should be excellent to give IAF (sanction proof) alternatives in war times. Not to forget that we will use the same weapons till 2025 anyway with the upgraded Mirage 2000 fighters.

Regarding SEAD, if the earlier post about Spectra didn't make it clear, the following examples should:

in an article written by a AASM programme responsable, Jean-Vincent Legrand, at Sagem, a EM variant for SEAD/DEAD would be useless (too costly, single use, and prone to jamming).
The man explains that the INS/GPS, or even the INS/GPS/IIR should do the job well enough when coupled with the right RWR.

He explains two different scenarios:

- against short and medium range SAM, a Rafale will close in to the target, and as soon as Spectra provide accurate enough data, the weapon is fired ;
- against long range SAM, Rafale will close in but this time it will fly as low as possible to benefit from terrain masks. The inconvenient is that in this case, the shooting rely on an external designation system.

Rafale detects radars, or ground targets with Spectra in long distances, as well in passive mode and can destroy them with AASM guided by Spectra too. The 250Kg version has ranges (similar to JDAM) of up to 60Km, the 125Kg weapons is said to have ranges up to 100Km and the Rafale/AASM combo has shown the capability to fire 6 AASM on 6 different targets in a single flyover.