COMAC ARJ21 Regional Jet

[posters12345]

The problem is ARJ-21 is just liked LCA Tejas for IAF. A stepping stone to something better. ARJ-21 has many disadvantage compare to peer categories like poor fuel consumption and heavier but this is first time China designing a modern jetliner that put to service. There is sure alot of obstacles.

Nevertheless, C919 will be a different beast. It is a modern jetliner learn from the experience from ARJ-21 which has superior fuel consumption and lighter weight when compare to peer like Airbus and Boeing. China are pinning a lot of hopes on C919 that can really capture the market.

Is that means ARJ21 still got major problem?
I believe the focus of COMAC should be on ARJ21 instead of C919 since ARJ21 is the real plane can be put into market by now.

 

[Beast]

Is that means ARJ21 still got major problem?
I believe the focus of COMAC should be on ARJ21 instead of C919 since ARJ21 is the real plane can be put into market by now.

No major problem but it's more of obsolete when introduced plus regional jetliner is not the most profitable catergories.

C919 will be the Chinese second attempt to build a jetliner able to compete with western in terms of technology, cost , operating cost and fuel efficiency. This will be the breakthru.

 

[posters12345]

No major problem but it's more of obsolete when introduced plus regional jetliner is not the most profitable catergories.

C919 will be the Chinese second attempt to build a jetliner able to compete with western in terms of technology, cost , operating cost and fuel efficiency. This will be the breakthru.

Overweight cause higher fuel consumption, I also hear about noisy issues at seat near to engine.
These problems need to be fixed soon since ARJ21 has backlog in hundreds.
I believe it is a bit too early to discuss about C919. Instead I prefer to discuss about ARJ21 and FAA certified Y12F.

A little bit out of topic, Do you have any information regarding orders of Y12F?
I know Aztec airways buy Y12F.

 

[Han Patriot]

The problem is ARJ-21 is just liked LCA Tejas for IAF. A stepping stone to something better. ARJ-21 has many disadvantage compare to peer categories like poor fuel consumption and heavier but this is first time China designing a modern jetliner that put to service. There is sure alot of obstacles.

Nevertheless, C919 will be a different beast. It is a modern jetliner learn from the experience from ARJ-21 which has superior fuel consumption and lighter weight when compare to peer like Airbus and Boeing. China are pinning a lot of hopes on C919 that can really capture the market.

Don't compare with LCA, LCA still is utter incompetence. ARJ-21 was already complete with the first test flight but it was FAA certification which held it back. The Americans didn't want a chi* aircraft in the sky, but CAA stuck with FAA to learn about their certification procedure.

 

[Beast]

Don't compare with LCA, LCA still is utter incompetence. ARJ-21 was already complete with the first test flight but it was FAA certification which held it back. The Americans didn't want a chi* aircraft in the sky, but CAA stuck with FAA to learn about their certification procedure.

Even with FAA, this plane will hardly sell as mention of heavier weight and poor fuel consumption compare to other regional jetliner. But it is only Chinese first commercial attempt at jetliner, I do not expect we did it right first time.

Overweight cause higher fuel consumption, I also hear about noisy issues at seat near to engine.
These problems need to be fixed soon since ARJ21 has backlog in hundreds.
I believe it is a bit too early to discuss about C919. Instead I prefer to discuss about ARJ21 and FAA certified Y12F.

A little bit out of topic, Do you have any information regarding orders of Y12F?
I know Aztec airways buy Y12F.

Most of the backlog are without any deposition and can be cancel quickly if needed. I do not expect state to force those domestic airliner to take a higher fuel consumption plane to operate that result in losses. Plus these regional jetliner are not the most profitable session. Plane like C919 is better as they can ferry more passenger and better fuel to weight consumption which if accepted by state airliner will result in better profit.

There is reason why ARJ-21 induction into service is painfully slow. China state want a few ARJ-21 to serve the market in order to earn good service track record as a marketing for domestic produced jetliner. Pave the way for C919 bigger sales and order.

 

[posters12345]

Even with FAA, this plane will hardly sell as mention of heavier weight and poor fuel consumption compare to other regional jetliner. But it is only Chinese first commercial attempt at jetliner, I do not expect we did it right first time.


Most of the backlog are without any deposition and can be cancel quickly if needed. I do not expect state to force those domestic airliner to take a higher fuel consumption plane to operate that result in losses. Plus these regional jetliner are not the most profitable session. Plane like C919 is better as they can ferry more passenger and better fuel to weight consumption which if accepted by state airliner will result in better profit.

There is reason why ARJ-21 induction into service is painfully slow. China state want a few ARJ-21 to serve the market in order to earn good service track record as a marketing for domestic produced jetliner. Pave the way for C919 bigger sales and order.

Pardon me, but for me you sound like COMAC is not going to continue ARJ21 program in near future and focus on C919.
There is no doubt that C919 will make more profit.

Anyone know about this

http://www.chongqingcac.com/

Chongqing Commercial Aircraft Corporation (CCAC) is a new Joint Venture (JV) between Mei Li Xing Hang Industrial Corp (MLXH) of Chongqing, China and Alliance Aircraft Ltd. of Reading, PA.

CCAC intends to design, certify, and produce the StarLiner 100, a 50-seat aircraft in the 50,000 pound (22,700 kg) class. It is designed to replace the first generation of 50-passenger fanjet and turboprop regional airliners, including ERJs, CRJs, ATRs. It is expected to sell in the $20M USD range.

The company is 8 months into a 47-month development program to include design, procurement, fabrication, assembly, flight test, certification, sales and marketing. CCAC is projecting certification and first deliveries of of the SL100 in late 2018-19.

 

[Keel]

ARJ21 makes new flight tests following design optimisation

• 21 April, 2017
• SOURCE: Flightglobal Pro
• BY: Mavis Toh
• Singapore

The ARJ21-700 regional jet has made new flight tests following some design optimisation of the aircraft, says Comac.

These include crosswind tests, testing of an upgraded flight control system software, as well as an evaluation of the VHF antenna's vibration during flight.

The Chinese manufacturer says the aircraft has since successfully completed crosswind tests, which took five rounds over 13 days.

It adds that the various tests were conducted concurrently, greatly improving utilisation of resources. Previously, only a single module was done each time.

Aircraft 103 spent 25 days making the tests at Dongying and Xilinhot airports. The aircraft has since returned to Shanghai.

Last September, Comac told FlightGlobal that the ARJ21 still needs to be optimised in areas including reducing cabin noise, simplify the aircraft's warning systems, resolving a door pressure issue as well as to ensure that the aircraft is safe for operations even in heavy rain.

Comac is targeting for these changes to be completed by the end of 2017, thereafter it will work to upgrade the aircraft's systems and functions, and reduce its weight.

The ARJ21 received type certification from the Civil Aviation Administration of China in December 2015, but has yet to receive a production certificate. Sources tell FlightGlobal that the regulator has given Comac a list of seven or eight improvements it must make to the jet before it will provide a production certificate for the type.

Flight Fleets Analyzer shows that Comac has delivered three ARJ21 to launch customer Chengdu Airlines.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/a...-flight-tests-following-design-optimi-436408/

 

[Beast]

Pardon me, but for me you sound like COMAC is not going to continue ARJ21 program in near future and focus on C919.
There is no doubt that C919 will make more profit.

Anyone know about this

http://www.chongqingcac.com/

Chongqing Commercial Aircraft Corporation (CCAC) is a new Joint Venture (JV) between Mei Li Xing Hang Industrial Corp (MLXH) of Chongqing, China and Alliance Aircraft Ltd. of Reading, PA.

CCAC intends to design, certify, and produce the StarLiner 100, a 50-seat aircraft in the 50,000 pound (22,700 kg) class. It is designed to replace the first generation of 50-passenger fanjet and turboprop regional airliners, including ERJs, CRJs, ATRs. It is expected to sell in the $20M USD range.

The company is 8 months into a 47-month development program to include design, procurement, fabrication, assembly, flight test, certification, sales and marketing. CCAC is projecting certification and first deliveries of of the SL100 in late 2018-19.

Hi, I am not trying to pour cold water on ARJ-21 but imagine AVIC now say they are going to discontinue with ARJ-21 and concentrate on C919. You can imagine the setback for AVIC and China domestic aviation. All this so called big plan for ARJ-21 is just a boaster and marketing for China first jetliner put into service. When C919 is put into service. These ARJ-21 is not going to do much business.

C919 is the mother of all China aviation hope.

 

[Han Patriot]

Even with FAA, this plane will hardly sell as mention of heavier weight and poor fuel consumption compare to other regional jetliner. But it is only Chinese first commercial attempt at jetliner, I do not expect we did it right first time.


Most of the backlog are without any deposition and can be cancel quickly if needed. I do not expect state to force those domestic airliner to take a higher fuel consumption plane to operate that result in losses. Plus these regional jetliner are not the most profitable session. Plane like C919 is better as they can ferry more passenger and better fuel to weight consumption which if accepted by state airliner will result in better profit.

There is reason why ARJ-21 induction into service is painfully slow. China state want a few ARJ-21 to serve the market in order to earn good service track record as a marketing for domestic produced jetliner. Pave the way for C919 bigger sales and order.

Totally agree, ARJ-21 is a stepping stone and learning curve. We need to do it to get the experience, but market wise, C919 is the beast.

 

[Keel]

ARJ21-700 aircraft obtains the first production certificate for jets in China
Last Updated (Beijing Time):2017-07-09 Source:News Center of COMAC

Site of certificate issuance ceremony.



Civil Aviation Administration of China (CAAC) issued a Production Certificate (PC) for ARJ21-700 aircraft to Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China, Ltd. (COMAC) in Beijing on July 9th, 2017. Mr. Li Jian, Deputy Director of CAAC, Mr. He Dongfeng, President of COMAC, Mr. Yin Shijun, Chief Engineer of CAAC, Mr. Yang Shuanchang, Deputy Director General of Equipment Industry Department of Ministry of Industry and Information Technology (MIIT), Mr. Jiang Huaiyu, Director of CAAC East China Regional Administration, Mr. Liu Linzong, Deputy Secretary of the Party Committee and Vice President of COMAC, Mr. Zhao Yuerang, Vice President of COMAC and General Director of ARJ21 Program, Mr. Xu Chaoqun, Director General of Department of Aircraft Airworthiness Certification of CAAC, Mr. Hu Zhenjiang, Director General of Department of Flight Standard of CAAC, Mdm Wang Jingling, Deputy Director General of Department of Aircraft Airworthiness Certification of CAAC and Director of ARJ21-700 Production Certification Board, and Mr. Shen Xiaoming, Minister of Shanghai Aircraft Airworthiness Certification Center of CAAC, attended the certificate issuance ceremony. Mr. Xu Chaoqun presided over the ceremony.

Mr. Li Jian fully affirmed the achievements of COMAC in his speech. He pointed out that acquiring the production certificate for ARJ21-700 aircraft was another major milestone following the acquisition of the Type Certificate (TC), which indicates that ARJ21-700 aircraft enters into the phase of batch production formally and shows that COMAC has established a quality management system meeting the requirements of airworthiness regulations. He hoped that COMAC would take the production certification as a new starting point, seize the opportunity, stay true to the mission, focus on solving the problems occurred during the operation of ARJ21-700 aircraft and concerned with the design and operation support with an attitude of being responsible to the party and the people, further integrate into civil aviation safety and operation management system with respect to design, production and services, sum up experience, continuously improve the management system, and accelerate design optimization, in order to ensure that each aircraft delivered meets approved design and is in safe and serviceable condition. He expressed that CAAC would support ARJ21 program as always, and regulate the continual improvement, batch production and operation of the aircraft effectively in accordance with the regulations, in order to ensure that the aircraft operates safely and smoothly and achieves commercial success.

Mr. He Dongfeng expressed that the production certification indicates that ARJ21-700 aircraft has officially got a pass for mass production and lays the foundation for the aircraft to comprehensively go to the market. He stressed that as the follow-up work of ARJ21 program was still arduous, COMAC would make persistent efforts, adhere to the principles of customer centered, market oriented, quality first and safety foremost, carry out key tasks such as design optimization, batch production and delivery, operation support and market development in a down-to-earth manner, strive to build ARJ21 into an aircraft that "airlines are willing to purchase, pilots are willing to fly, and passengers are willing to ride", meet customer and market demands with all their efforts, accelerate to make up for the shortage of Chinese civil aircraft supply, and make new contributions to building China into a manufacturing power.

Mr. Yang Shuanchang expressed that since the ARJ21 program was set up in 2002, we have explored and established a series of civil aircraft development systems including the standard specification system, design assurance system, production system, customer service system, flight test management system, supplier management system, quality management system, airworthiness management system and operation support system and suitable for China's actual conditions, enriched the connotation of independent intellectual property right, and promoted the development and progress of China's airworthiness system. He said that ARJ21 program was a great achievement in the development of China's civil aircraft industry and provided the basis for the development of the follow-up civil aircraft such as C919. He hoped that COMAC could make persistent efforts, work strictly in accordance with the production quality system approved by CAAC, and strengthen the maintenance and perfection of batch production quality system. He also said that Equipment Industry Department of MIIT would support the development of COMAC as always, support the "airworthiness breakthrough" specific work led by CAAC, and serve the trunk liner strategy actively.

The production certification of ARJ21-700 aircraft shows that the production quality assurance system of COMAC meets the requirements of CAAC airworthiness regulations, indicates that ARJ21 program can now enter batch production, and lays the foundation for the batch production of other aircraft types going forward. With the issuance of the production certificate for ARJ21-700 aircraft, COMAC will strengthen management and expand production capacity to constantly meet customer and market demands and accelerate the marketization development of Chinese jets.

Generally, a civil aircraft needs to acquire three key airworthiness certificates from being developed to being delivered to customers, which are respectively a Type Certificate (TC) to demonstrate that the design of the aircraft type meets airworthiness regulations, a Production Certificate (PC) to demonstrate that the batch production quality system meets airworthiness procedures, and an Airworthiness Certificate (AC) to demonstrate that the physical configuration of an individual aircraft meets type design. The production certification reflects the high-level production organization, quality management and comprehensive management of the aircraft's main manufacturer, and means that there are regulations to go by and documents to trace to for the aircraft production from the raw material and supplier management to each manufacturing step and detail, which ensures that all parts, components and systems are traceable, safe and controlled, in order to guarantee that the aircraft manufacturer can continually and constantly produce aircraft with positive quality, safety and serviceability.

CAAC East China Regional Administration accepted the PC application of ARJ21-700 aircraft submitted by COMAC on December 9th, 2014. Since the opening meeting of ARJ21-700 Production Certification Board (PCB) was held in Shanghai in April 2015, COMAC has been committed to establishing and improving a production quality assurance system which meets the requirements of CAAC airworthiness regulations under the strong support and strict examination of the authority, and creatively established a responsible manager system and a functional line organization structure centering on the management principle of "one company having one system, one manual and one process", which broke the original barriers of each center, passed down the responsibilities to relevant business departments level by level according to the functional line organization structure, and standardized the preparation and management of program files at the same time. A Production Quality Assurance Manual and 190 program files were finally formed after review by experts of quality supervision group, sand table exercise of program files, internal review of test run, and concentrated review and on-site review by ARJ21-700 PCB.

At the closing meeting of ARJ21-700 Production Certification Board (PCB) on June 9th, 2017, it was agreed that ARJ21-700 PCB had completed the review of the quality system in accordance with the procedures specified in Production Certification and Surveillance Procedures, confirmed that the production quality assurance system of COMAC met the requirements of 21.139 and 21.143 of Certification Procedures for Civil Aviation Products and Parts (CCAR-21-R3), and proposed that a production certificate for ARJ21-700 aircraft should be issued to COMAC.

The production certification is a key milestone marking the transition from design and development to batch production of ARJ21-700 aircraft and a necessary step for the program to achieve market success and commercial success. Since the first ARJ21-700 aircraft was delivered to Chengdu Airlines on November 29th, 2015, this type of aircraft has accumulatively carried more than 15,000 passengers and obtained a total of 413 orders from 19 customers by now.

Officers of the MIIT, CAAC, Civil Aviation Management Institute of China, and relevant departments of COMAC headquarters participated in the certificate issuance ceremony.

Mr. Li Jian made a speech on July 9th, 2017.

Mr. He Dongfeng made a speech on July 9th, 2017.

Mr. Yang Shuanchang made a speech on July 9th, 2017.

A photo of the production certificate for ARJ21 aircraft.

Five ARJ21 gathered at the final assembly shop.

Workers kept improving in their work.

The program stepped into a new phase.

http://english.comac.cc/news/latest/201707/11/t20170711_5426254.shtml

 

[posters12345]

at last, arj21 is mass produced.
Now time for optimising plane efficiency and performance.
Also opening mro or partnering with mro for comac for supporting arj21 in Myanmar, Indonesia, Congo.

 

[Han Patriot]

at last, arj21 is mass produced.
Now time for optimising plane efficiency and performance.
Also opening mro or partnering with mro for comac for supporting arj21 in Myanmar, Indonesia, Congo.

The last piece of the puzzle is the engine, avionics and flight control and fuselage wise, we are already quite good. ENGINES are the last hurdle for a complete Chinese jet.