Chinese Weapons Reaching ‘Near-Parity’ with West

[AndrewJin]

This is about military technology of China. Frankly speaking Indians are not even qualified to make a comment given the well known failure records of your country. So fvck off from the topic！

I believe their Arjun and Tejas are sought after by every major country......
India is the supa powa of 2012 announced by the dead president.
They produce the best weapons in the world.

 

[Sanchez]

I believe their Arjun and Tejas are sought after by every major country......
India is the supa powa of 2012 announced by the dead president.
They produce the best weapons in the world.

In Kagil war Indians had to wait for imported munitions to arrive before they could continue. It's a clown type of military powa and they are so ignorant...

 

[AndrewJin]

In Kagil war Indians had to wait for imported munitions to arrive before they could continue. It's a clown type of military powa and they are so ignorant...

They were waiting for 2012 when Arjun and Tejas were ready in their mind.

 

[Beast]

That's a very naive understanding of weapons exports.

All big-ticket military hardware is subject to transfer to third party nations. Many countries even have laws on it. That is the reason countries like Jordan and Turkey still need US approval for sale of their older F16s to Pakistan.
This is a passage from an article re the F16 sale.

Another defence ministry official Rear Admiral Mukhtar Khan, however, said the US had so far not objected to the deal with Jordan, but under the current environment getting American approval for the sale, a mandatory requirement, would not be easy to manage.

You can also educate yourself with this

https://www.state.gov/t/pm/rsat/c14021.htm
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a272992.pdf - a declassified report that, amongst others, comments on Russian restrictions on third party sales and how China avoided those by reverse-engineering

Chinese interest in the Su-35 is, going by past experience, limited to reverse engineering the jet - a commendable feat in itself if accomplished. Sale of that reverse engineered jet is not prohibited but there's no legal way China can onward sell Russian arms to Pakistan (or any other country) without prior Russian approval.

The one that is naive is you. Comparing countries like Jordan with China is simply a joke. Third party rules to China is just a crap of paper. China is an industrial powerhouse with manufacturing feat including world leading 3D printing aeronautical equipment and not to mention electronics component and our own AESA radar. Even without Russia support, China has proven able to service many of those equipment. China is now entering a deep strategic defense pact with Russia. We are just facilitating a good deal that satisfy both our friends Russia and Pakistan. Its a win win situation.

Even smaller countries like Iran which is sanctioned for many years by US, still able to keep some of their F-14 flying. So what's the hurdle for a bigger and more powerful country like China?

 

[BATMAN]

Can some expert shed some light over blue, red and green sentences text in OP?

@Khafee any clue about the green text?

 

[Mustang06]

It was bound to happen with the money Chinese are putting in R&D!

 

[rott]

.
The vast majority of Chinese members (if not all) will agree.

I agree!

 

[Khafee]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/chinese-weapons-reaching-near-parity-west-study-135238342.html


It said that Chinese-made armed drones had been seen in Nigeria and Saudi Arabia.


@MastanKhan @Khafee @Windjammer

It is correct.

 

[nang2]

I find it funny that Chinese get so sensitive about reverse engineering (a polite euphemism for IPR theft).

Actually I don't. I am very proud of the capability of my countrymen to "steal intellectual property". Those who are brainwashed by Western media on the inalienable intellectual property rights simply act against the very nature of human development.

 

[BATMAN]

Actually I don't. I am very proud of the capability of my countrymen to "steal intellectual property". Those who are brainwashed by Western media on the inalienable intellectual property rights simply act against the very nature of human development.

Do you know which short range Chinese missiles are mentioned in OP?

 

[schoolboy]

The naive is you. Comparing countries like Jordan with China is simply a joke. Third party rules to China is just a crap of paper. China is a industrial powerhouse with manufacturing feat including world leading 3D printing aeronautical equipment and not to mention electronics component and our own AESA radar. Even without Russia support, China has proven able to service many of those equipment. China is now entering a deep strategic defense pact with Russia. We are just facilitating a good deal that satisfy both our allies of Russia and Pakistan. Its a win win situation.

Even smaller countries like Iran who has been sanction for many years by US, still able to keep some of their F- 14 flying. So whats the hurdle for bigger and more powerful country like China?

You misunderstand my post. Jordan was used to illustrate that exporting countries typically mandate in the contract that the importing country will not resell the product to some other (third party) country without prior approval. This serves many purposes - from a strategic perspective it reduces proliferation of sensitive technology and from an economic perspective it also sustains demand for the product from the original manufacturer.

Why just Jordan? No country the US exports arms to - including NATO countries can resell those arms to others without prior US approval. Heck, the US (like Russia) has a stringent law that forces exporters (like Boeing) to stipulate this restriction in the contract (see the links I posted earlier). I used Jordan as the issue of indirect acquisition of F16s came up last year - as it is the most recent example of such a potential third party transfer.

Your reference to Iran is wholly inappropriate. Iranian F14s were legally purchased from the US in the 1970s. There is no third party sale involved.

China and Russia might have 'deep strategic defense pact' as you suggest - but current Russian export restrictions would legally prevent China from selling those Russian exports to any third party. Why do you think China has never directly sold USSR / Russian equipment to anyone?

 

[axisofevil]

In Kagil war Indians had to wait for imported munitions to arrive before they could continue. It's a clown type of military powa and they are so ignorant...

Cant blame the military. India has been ruled by Congress and specifically one family for over 60 yrs! People have finally woken up and see the corruption involved. India is going to change more then you can imagine.

 

[schoolboy]

Unfortunately, NATO member Turkey copy Chinese WS-2 rocket launcher. The news disappointed you, Isn't it?

Err..Turkey rejected that deal. Your information is dated.

http://www.defensenews.com/story/defense/2015/11/15/turkey-cancels-missile-deal-china/75826180/

Btw - that link you posted is a very poor translation - hard to understand what the author is trying to say - but it appears to be a case of sour grapes resulting from the rejection.

When India used French design drawings, the USA engine, the Israeli missile then "make" LCA. I don't think it can beat J-7 or JF-17. do you think?

Well - the LCA project is legit. We already had production licenses for Mig 21, Mig 27 and Su-30 and if we wanted we could have simply reverse engineered those but for a variety of reasons a decision was taken to develop the LCA with legal way. Now it can be argued that we should have done what China does (i.e. reverse engineer) - and that's debatable - there are benefits and costs in either approach.

Anyway it's noteworthy that China has still not been able to reverse engineer the critical component - the jet engine and still depends on Russia for a supply of the RD-93 engine (and France for the M-53) which powers the JF-17.

Lastly I'm not a pilot or an aviation engineer so I can't comment of whether the JF-17 is better than the LCA or vice-versa but merely because a product has parts sourced from different countries does not mean it is necessarily bad (or good).

 

[SBUS-CXK]

Err..Turkey rejected that deal. Your information is dated.

http://www.defensenews.com/story/defense/2015/11/15/turkey-cancels-missile-deal-china/75826180/

Btw - that link you posted is a very poor translation - hard to understand what the author is trying to say - but it appears to be a case of sour grapes resulting from the rejection.



Well - the LCA project is legit. We already had production licenses for Mig 21, Mig 27 and Su-30 and if we wanted we could have simply reverse engineered those but for a variety of reasons a decision was taken to develop the LCA with legal way. Now it can be argued that we should have done what China does (i.e. reverse engineer) - and that's debatable - there are benefits and costs in either approach.

Anyway it's noteworthy that China has still not been able to reverse engineer the critical component - the jet engine and still depends on Russia for a supply of the RD-93 engine (and France for the M-53) which powers the JF-17.

Lastly I'm not a pilot or an aviation engineer so I can't comment of whether the JF-17 is better than the LCA or vice-versa but merely because a product has parts sourced from different countries does not mean it is necessarily bad (or good).

First you confuse a problem. Turkey canceled the HQ-9 deal. Not WS-1 and WS-2. Turkey was a copy of Chinese WS-1. Its name is T-300 Kasirga

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/ws-1.htm
http://zonwar.ru/news4/news_625_T-300_Kasirga.html

Look at this link.
https://defence.pk/threads/turkey-china-military-relation.151995/

So, when I saw a weapon importer laugh at the world's third largest arms exporter. It is interesting. Like a cripple teasing a long-distance runners.... Because there is no competition, so the only thing you can do is to put the world's third largest arms exporter down to the level of India. Well, China is just a reverse engineering. It's no big deal. India can do it...But it is clear that the world is no more stupid than India, oh, in addition to Ecuador, .But now Ecuador doesn't need free weapons in India.

I don't mean —— “a product has parts sourced from different countries does mean it is necessarily bad ”.

I mean —— India uses the best products in the world to make the world's most junk the products.

India research funding is only GDP of 0.88%, What do you expect it to do?

Oh, “simply reverse engineered those”... But why does India have the best products, but it's impossible to make advanced weapons? Oh, let me try and answer. What can you expect from an agricultural country?

This is a list of aircraft engines in china.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_aircraft_engines

WS-10 aero engine has been equipped with J-10a and J-10b and J-11. as well as J-20 and J-31, they are using the WS-10 engine for testing.

Come on! let's do a simple reverse engineering. Production of aero engines, and equipped with LCA...Let's see if the India engine can take off the world's lightest fighter!

Finally, China has been in the position of the world's arms exporter top 3. Waiting for India to enter top 10....

As always, international jokes.