China's 'nastier Rise' Will Affect Those Cheering America's Decline: South Asian Expert

[FairAndUnbiased]

Cut the crap dude. When will China impose sanctions on Australia ?

Australia faces down China in high-stakes strategy.

The government of Scott Morrison has reached a stark new view of China: It's not just a top trading partner, but also a threat to the nation's sovereignty.

www.reuters.com

"It suspended some beef imports on a technicality and effectively blocked a $439 million trade in barley by slapping tariffs of 80.5% on the Australian import. China has also launched an anti-dumping probe into Australian wine imports."

Will souring China-Australia relations force a rethink on trade?

Relations between China and Australia continued to decline on Tuesday after the hasty departure of the last remaining Australian journalists in China. The move comes in the wake of Beijing’s imposition…

www.france24.com

“Whether wrongly or not, China believes that Australia was doing the US’s bidding,” Dr Lee said. “But Australia itself has mounting concerns over China’s external behaviour in the South China Sea and over alleged China’s political intervention in its domestic politics via Chinese diasporas.”

Australia has refrained from a tit-for-tat response even as China continues to pile on trade sanctions.

But Australia is treading cautiously as it “does not have many other viable options for its commodity exports and cannot readily find customers other than Chinese importers”, Dr Lee says.

 

[nahtanbob]

Australia faces down China in high-stakes strategy.

The government of Scott Morrison has reached a stark new view of China: It's not just a top trading partner, but also a threat to the nation's sovereignty.

www.reuters.com

"It suspended some beef imports on a technicality and effectively blocked a $439 million trade in barley by slapping tariffs of 80.5% on the Australian import. China has also launched an anti-dumping probe into Australian wine imports."

Will souring China-Australia relations force a rethink on trade?

Relations between China and Australia continued to decline on Tuesday after the hasty departure of the last remaining Australian journalists in China. The move comes in the wake of Beijing’s imposition…

www.france24.com

“Whether wrongly or not, China believes that Australia was doing the US’s bidding,” Dr Lee said. “But Australia itself has mounting concerns over China’s external behaviour in the South China Sea and over alleged China’s political intervention in its domestic politics via Chinese diasporas.”

Australia has refrained from a tit-for-tat response even as China continues to pile on trade sanctions.

But Australia is treading cautiously as it “does not have many other viable options for its commodity exports and cannot readily find customers other than Chinese importers”, Dr Lee says.

Do you comprehend what an economic embargo on Australia is ?

Why iron ore has been out of bounds in China's trade war with Australia — for now

Wine, cheese, meat and barley have all been caught up in trade tensions between Beijing and Canberra, but China still accounts for 80 per cent of Australia's iron ore exports. For how much longer, asks Ian Verrender.

www.abc.net.au

We have one on Cuba

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

If not Australia where are the Chinese going to go ? Canada ? The same Canada that detained Huawei CFO USA ? the same USA that launched a trade war

There is no way White liberal democracies are joining China - that rules out Europe, Canada, Australia.
At some point in the future Russia may join.

The real question is whether any of Asian countries will join Chinese bloc. Right now Japan is part of the US camp. If China mishandles India it loses India.

You know who is in line for Russian leadership after Putin is gone? CPRF is the leading left wing opposition to the right wing United Russia. And CPRF is pretty much the descendant of the CCCP. There's no pro-west party in Russia. Russians will never forget how their empire was dismantled, they lost 50% of their GDP (more than Nazis destroyed in WW2) and they lost all dignity.

Japan is a country of power worshippers. They worship the strongest, hate the strong, and feel contempt for the weak. I predict Japan will suddenly rediscover their Asian roots in the next 10-15 years.

As for India, you do realize that the GDP difference between China and India is ~500%, while the power difference between China and USA is ~25%, right?

Do you comprehend what an economic embargo on Australia is ?

Why iron ore has been out of bounds in China's trade war with Australia — for now

Wine, cheese, meat and barley have all been caught up in trade tensions between Beijing and Canberra, but China still accounts for 80 per cent of Australia's iron ore exports. For how much longer, asks Ian Verrender.

www.abc.net.au

We have one on Cuba

Only specific Australian industries have been targetted for sanctions. A full embargo is unnecessary if Australia modifies its behavior.

 

[nahtanbob]

You know who is in line for Russian leadership after Putin is gone? CPRF is the leading left wing opposition to the right wing United Russia. And CPRF is pretty much the descendant of the CCCP. There's no pro-west party in Russia. Russians will never forget how their empire was dismantled, they lost 50% of their GDP (more than Nazis destroyed in WW2) and they lost all dignity.

Japan is a country of power worshippers. They worship the strongest, hate the strong, and feel contempt for the weak. I predict Japan will suddenly rediscover their Asian roots in the next 10-15 years.

As for India, you do realize that the GDP difference between China and India is ~500%, while the power difference between China and USA is ~25%, right?


Only specific Australian industries have been targetted for sanctions. A full embargo is unnecessary if Australia modifies its behavior.

Russians are white European. It does not matter what their ideology is.

Russians will never forget the fact CCP backstabbed them in 1969. Russians do not like traitors. It will be golden when they get the chance to play kingmaker in midst of USA-China cold war.

The difference between China and India is 500% now. What will be if USA decides to prop up India ? What difference does it make ? India is showing you the middle finger

Australia have shown you the middle finger. There is nothing you can do about it

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Russians are white European. It does not matter what their ideology is.

Russians will never forget the fact CCP backstabbed them in 1969. Russians do not like traitors. It will be golden when they get the chance to play kingmaker in midst of USA-China cold war.

The difference between China and India is 500% now. What will be if USA decides to prop up India ? What difference does it make ? India is showing you the middle finger

Australia have shown you the middle finger. There is nothing you can do about it

You are right, Russians do not like traitors. Russians were backstabbed when liberalization meant losing 50% of their GDP and 20% of their land. Russians were backstabbed in the 1990's when the promise of no NATO expansion past East Germany was broken.

Compared to 1969 where less than 10 km2 of land changed hands and the border was demarcated. Ask Russians what happened in 1969 vs. what happened in 1991? let me know how many Russians even know the year 1969.

US can prop up India at the cost of its own economy, letting more H-1Bs take American jobs, letting more American jobs be outsourced to India, etc. and it will still be too small to make a difference.

Here's how big the difference is:

If US gave India 50% of its GDP for free, India will still be smaller than China. Yes, a $10 trillion dollar trade deficit with India, every year, will still be too small for India to do anything about China.

Australian PM Scott Morrison still says he "values the importance of the relationship with China" after Chinese diplomats called him gum on their shoes. Zero dignity.

 

[nahtanbob]

You are right, Russians do not like traitors. Russians were backstabbed when liberalization meant losing 50% of their GDP and 20% of their land. Russians were backstabbed in the 1990's when the promise of no NATO expansion past East Germany was broken.

Compared to 1969 where less than 10 km2 of land changed hands and the border was demarcated. Ask Russians what happened in 1969 vs. what happened in 1991? let me know how many Russians even know the year 1969.

US can prop up India at the cost of its own economy, letting more H-1Bs take American jobs, letting more American jobs be outsourced to India, etc. and it will still be too small to make a difference.

NATO expansion promise was never made on Warsaw Pact countries.
Was it made on the ex-Soviet Republics ?

Russian military & communist party elite never forget it

USA will prop up India moving factories from China to India. They can supply weapons to deter Chinese military actions

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

NATO expansion promise was never made on Warsaw Pact countries.
Was it made on the ex-Soviet Republics ?

Russian military & communist party elite never forget it

USA will prop up India moving factories from China to India. They can supply weapons to deter Chinese military actions

Poland, Czech Republic, Hungary - Warsaw Pact, now NATO
Ex-Soviet Republics: Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, now NATO.

Russian military never forgets no longer being the Soviet military lol. Now you also have Russian voters to deal with, thanks to the US, and Russian voters vote United Russia and CPRF.

It doesn't matter how much US moves. US companies doesn't own the factories in China, US businesses contract with Chinese ones. Even if US gives India $10 trillion for free every year they'll still be smaller than China, but US will be smaller than China too.

 

[FuturePAF]

That is called colonialism

maybe I was vague In the way I described it. I didn’t mean full control as in the way a colonial power operates, but contract based investments; FDI. Starting small and if the country is trust worthy, then more investment, such as mining contracts. In my earlier post, I believe I said, similar to South Korean or Japanese investments abroad.

 

[Ghost Hobbit]

what 'rise'? China's growth is exactly as predicted. so long as it could give cheap labor, it was factory. As the incomes began to rise it became less of factory and growth began to decline. It is headed to be a proper middle income country like Thailand. And it will generally plateu there without moving forward. There is no indication that China has the kind of creative, innovative society that the US has to power it further.

Maybe someday if it goes through social reform and becomes the kind of free, democratic country that the US is, it can look at a long term prominence. Else it will have a middling growth and keep plodding along.

 

[nahtanbob]

Poland, Czech Republic, Hungary - Warsaw Pact, now NATO
Ex-Soviet Republics: Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, now NATO.

Russian military never forgets no longer being the Soviet military lol. Now you also have Russian voters to deal with, thanks to the US, and Russian voters vote United Russia and CPRF.

It doesn't matter how much US moves. US companies doesn't own the factories in China, US businesses contract with Chinese ones. Even if US gives India $10 trillion for free every year they'll still be smaller than China, but US will be smaller than China too.

there was never any promise on Warsaw Pact countries. They are independent states free to do what they want. They do not like Soviet behavior in the past.

The Russian voters do not care about the past. Given the chance and money they vacation in the French Riveria, shop in London.

Foxconn owns the Apple's factories. Technically they are not Chinese. What good is a factory without orders ?

 

[beijingwalker]

There is no indication that China has the kind of creative, innovative society that the US has to power it further.

Your Indian media will never tell you, China is already the country boasts most patent filings by a large margin in the world.

 

[FuturePAF]

Russians are white European. It does not matter what their ideology is.

Russians will never forget the fact CCP backstabbed them in 1969. Russians do not like traitors. It will be golden when they get the chance to play kingmaker in midst of USA-China cold war.

The difference between China and India is 500% now. What will be if USA decides to prop up India ? What difference does it make ? India is showing you the middle finger

Australia have shown you the middle finger. There is nothing you can do about it

The US learned its mistake propping up China, it will not do the same with India. propping up India will mean less economic and political clout for the US. The US will be better off spreading it’s investments in smaller nations with the right technical training (Vietnam) or proximity to the US (Latin America) to make it most advantageous to invest there, vs a country like India which is far and has limited numbers of people with the right highly technical training and low enough wage vs. nations in Southeast Asia.

 

[nahtanbob]

The US learned its mistake propping up China, it will not do the same with India. propping up India will mean less economic and political clout for the US. The US will be better off spreading it’s investments in smaller nations with the right technical training (Vietnam) or proximity to the US (Latin America) to make it most advantageous to invest there, vs a country like India which is far and has limited numbers of people with the right highly technical training and low enough wage vs. nations in Southeast Asia.

Even a limited prop up of India will frustrate and deter China. All USA has to do is to remind India who is propping Pakistan.

It is bang for the buck to move factories out of China to Vietnam and Latin America. You weaken China and increase your hold on Vietnam and Latin America

 

[FuturePAF]

Even a limited prop up of India will frustrate and deter China

Frustrate is too strong of a word. Irritate maybe a better one. In 1960, Pakistan allowed the US to fly U-2s from Peshawar over the Soviet Union. It was an irritant, but didn’t really change the balance of power. It brought unwanted Soviet attention, especially after the U-2 with Gary powers on board was shot down.

The only thing it will bring is more attention by the Chinese to the Indian border, and more reason for them to support Pakistan.

In the long run, India would be better off resolving its border disputes with Pakistan and China, and focusing on its economic growth, before the demographic dividend window closes. China was more than willing to invest in India before 2019 changes to the status of Ladakh forced them to act. An Independent Kashmir would take the burden off of India to spend so heavily on defense expenditures when the ultimate goal is greater regional influence and better global connectivity. Germany has peacefully achieved through the EU what Nazi Germany could not through its military means; strong German influence in European affairs and global connectivity allowing them stable markets for export.

 

[nahtanbob]

Frustrate is too strong of a word. Irritate maybe a better one. In 1960, Pakistan allowed the US to fly U-2s from Peshawar over the Soviet Union. It was an irritant, but didn’t really change the balance of power. It brought unwanted Soviet attention, especially after the U-2 with Gary powers on board was shot down.

The only thing it will bring is more attention by the Chinese to the Indian border, and more reason for them to support Pakistan.

In the long run, India would be better off resolving its border disputes with Pakistan and China, and focusing on its economic growth, before the demographic dividend window closes. China was more than willing to invest in India before 2019 changes to the status of Ladakh forced them to act. An Independent Kashmir would take the burden off of India to spend so heavily on defense expenditures when the ultimate goal is greater regional influence and better global connectivity. Germany has peacefully achieved through the EU what Nazi Germany could not through its military means; strong German influence in European affairs and global connectivity allowing them stable markets for export.

you conveniently deleted one of my sentences
" All USA has to do is to remind India who is propping Pakistan. "