China to make public Pak N-deal on June 24

[mehru]

very much true entertainment like rupee news

Do u mean that we have no sense of humour? Off-course we have it.

 

[Donatello]

We need nuclear power for electricity as our energy needs are more than what we produce. What's wrong with that? I mean, Pakistan already has plutonium and uranium reactors and already enough nuclear warheads, that it wouldn't matter even if we used chinese reactors for weapons fuel. I mean, we already have 80+ warheads, can make 5-8 per year already, so whether Pakistan gets the nuclear reactors from China or not, would not mean anything. It's just our electric needs, and the West must understand, the more power we have, the better economy would be, and less people would be lying around free to get brainwashed by mullahs and turn into insurgents. It's gonna help in eradicating the poverty.

It seems India is just trying to block anything Pakistan wants, be it Nuclear or fighter jets. Don't know if they will ever succeed.

 

[karan.1970]

well that should come at the end or after the meeting which is today i guess ?

Its New Zealand so by the time Canada comes up,the day is over in NZ. But I just realized that its a 4 day session. So we may see fire crackers any day. Dont get me wrong, but in my view, strategically, this deal is more important for China than for Pakistan.

 

[Creder]

Its New Zealand so by the time Canada comes up,the day is over in NZ. But I just realized that its a 4 day session. So we may see fire crackers any day. Dont get me wrong, but in my view, strategically, this deal is more important for China than for Pakistan.

They had their first meeting today, discussing usual guidelines and stuff..i dont think there is going to be much clash over anything, its all the media hype.

What exactly is US objection ? what is their official stance on this deal ?..all they want to get is more "information" about the deal. No one has opposed it, not even India

 

[javaman]

Do u mean that we have no sense of humour? Off-course we have it.

u accepted

 

[karan.1970]

I never said we were getting an NSG waiver or want to partake in nuclear trade with other countries. Nuclear energy/weapon development and maintenance is an expensive task, we do not want to do partake in deals that benefit others financially. We are a developing nation that do not have the funds to undertake such expensive deals at the cost of our populace. Appeasment is not our forte, we try and get what we can from a situation.



Good for India, I hope these deals fast track your countries development. But the real question is at what cost.



I must say your whole post reeks of envy and bitterness, but such is expected. Anyway, you proved once more that you people find solace whenever pkistan is undergoing difficult situations.



I hope this project does end up like the Dhabol plant where you flushed down a lot of money just so you can appease USA.

June 2001: Enron Shuts Down Expensive Indian Plant After Afghan Pipeline Fails to Materialize
**
Enron’s power plant in Dabhol, India, is shut down. The failure of the $3 billion plant, Enron’s largest investment, contributes to Enron’s bankruptcy in December. Earlier in the year, India stopped paying its bill for the energy from the plant, because energy from the plant cost three times the usual rates. [NEW YORK TIMES, 3/20/2001] Enron had hoped to feed the plant with cheap Central Asian gas, but this hope was dashed when a gas pipeline through Afghanistan was not completed. The larger part of the plant is still only 90 percent complete when construction stops around this time. [NEW YORK TIMES, 3/20/2001] Enron executives meet with Commerce Secretary Donald L. Evans about its troubled Dabhol power plant during this year [NEW YORK TIMES, 2/21/2002] , and Vice President Cheney lobbies the leader of India’s main opposition party about the plant this month. [NEW YORK TIMES, 2/21/2002]

Trust me dude.. I do not envy Pakistan getting this deal, since Pakistan is anyway getting the nuclear cooperation from China since decades. This deal just further establishes the muscle power of China in the world order more than anything.

Also understand, traditionally India has avoided complete alignment to a single camp in the world order. Even in the cold war era, despite being so close to USSR, India never explicitly aligned itself to Warsaw. The same approach is visible in the Nuclear deals India is cracking with multiple countries. Basically hedging her bets specially since India's uranium deposits are not much to write home about.

Pakistan has been the opposite in this strategy. In past decades it was NATO/USA. Now that is shifting to China.

So basically 2 different approaches aligned to 2 different strategies of 2 different countries. Replicating my comment from my initial post on the thread

Hence its foolhardy at best to compare the 2 deals since these deals attained different strategic objectives for india and Pakistan. Exuberance is good, and its a good event for Pakistan, but lets not allow it to get out of hand and take it in the direction of flaming and unnecessary comparisons..

 

[karan.1970]

They had their first meeting today, discussing usual guidelines and stuff..i dont think there is going to be much clash over anything, its all the media hype.

What exactly is US objection ? what is their official stance on this deal ?..all they want to get is more "information" about the deal. No one has opposed it, not even India

That's my point. There is no real objections to this deal by India except may be to build some pressure in the diplomatic arena since practically, nothing is changing on the ground. I still havent seen a single personally attributable formal objection by any big Indian leader to this deal. All news articles are talking about faceless officials and unnamed sources.

As I see it , it may become more of a jostling match between USA and China where USA is the established bully in the Nuclear camp and China is the challenger. The Pakistan deal is just an excuse.

 

[T-Faz]

^^^^^^^^

So why all the hue and cry.

 

[karan.1970]

^^^^^^^^

So why all the hue and cry.

From who?? Leave aside the members on this forum. Here at times a lot of us (both Indians and Pakistanis) argue for the sake of arguing

 

[Creder]

That's my point. There is no real objections to this deal by India except may be to build some pressure in the diplomatic arena since practically, nothing is changing on the ground. I still havent seen a single personally attributable formal objection by any big Indian leader to this deal. All news articles are talking about faceless officials and unnamed sources.

As I see it , it may become more of a jostling match between USA and China where USA is the established bully in the Nuclear camp and China is the challenger. The Pakistan deal is just an excuse.

That above would have somehow made sense under normal circumstances, US right now needs Pakistan or atleast it cant have pakistan supporting taliban or putting hurdles in the reconciliation process. They dont have a reason to object to this deal, and therefore no reason to fight China. If your saying they will clash just for the hell of it so they can size each other up, im afraid thats not how superpowers think..Only us Indians and Pakistanis have that kinda thinking

 

[T-Faz]

From who?? Leave aside the members on this forum. Here at times a lot of us (both Indians and Pakistanis) argue for the sake of arguing

I am referring to the ever exuberant Indian media and they coverage they are giving to this particular deal. It is not a topic of great interest in ours or the Chinese media whereas the Indian media has the deal coverage cornered.

Diplomacy is done to achieve an objective, in this case it is nothing but riling up the people for some unknown purpose.

 

[karan.1970]

That above would have somehow made sense under normal circumstances, US right now needs Pakistan or atleast it cant have pakistan supporting taliban or putting hurdles in the reconciliation process. They dont have a reason to object to this deal, and therefore no reason to fight China. If your saying they will clash just for the hell of it so they can size each other up, im afraid thats not how superpowers think..Only us Indians and Pakistanis have that kinda thinking

Its not just sizing each other up. Its basically China openly challenging US's dominance over NSG. I am not sure what will be US reaction and you may be right in your assessment, but it will be interesting to see the reaction and its justification. Because if US does not react, Obama's non proliferation plank will start losing credibility . Hence the devil and the deep sea situation for USA and hence my interest in the reaction (or lack there of)

 

[karan.1970]

I am referring to the ever exuberant Indian media and they coverage they are giving to this particular deal. It is not a topic of great interest in ours or the Chinese media whereas the Indian media has the deal coverage cornered.

Diplomacy is done to achieve an objective, in this case it is nothing but riling up the people for some unknown purpose.

Thats how some yellow channels make money. Have you forgotten the coverage in Pakistani media when Indo US deal happened. A lot of interview tones were as if India and US have jointly declared war on Pakistan. And diplomacy is the last thing on the minds of media. Its all about eyeball ratings..

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

Thanks China

 

[deckingraj]

That above would have somehow made sense under normal circumstances, US right now needs Pakistan or atleast it cant have pakistan supporting taliban or putting hurdles in the reconciliation process. They dont have a reason to object to this deal, and therefore no reason to fight China. If your saying they will clash just for the hell of it so they can size each other up, im afraid thats not how superpowers think..Only us Indians and Pakistanis have that kinda thinking

Well you are right sir when you say that US needs Pakistan but so is vice-versa....There is a status quo and any support for such an important matter for Pakistan needs to be backed by something equal for US....Don't you think so????

You might have noticed that US has up the ante on Pak-Iran pipeline which has been rebuked by your PM.....Not sure what happened in the back ground but would be highly surprised if US is opposing this deal just for the sake of it....