China rolls out red carpet for Sudan president

[Roybot]

Oh I have plenty to say about the issue. Until he is convicted in an International Court, we will keep doing business with him. Innocent until proven guilty right?

I'm just saying, if we should stop doing business with countries that murder their own people in the millions every year, then India is a better candidate than Sudan.

No one is asking you to stop doing business with them, but condemning the Sudanese regime doesn't do any harm, but puts pressure on Sudanese regime and will deter them from repeating such crimes in the future. Instead you guys are rolling out the red carpet for them. Its not like Sudan is going to get pissed off an say, hey am not going to sell oil to you. They have to sell it to someone at the end of the day, and China is buying.

And please stop derailing the issue.

 

[Mosamania]

You know I know ALOT of Sudanese people some on a daily basis and one of my childhood friends is Sudanese I don't understand how come there is a war there anyways. They are some of the greatest people I have ever met. One of the most polite most funny and very warm hearted people.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

No one is asking you to stop doing business with them, but condemning the Sudanese regime doesn't do any harm, but puts pressure on Sudanese regime and will deter them from repeating such crimes in the future. Instead you guys are rolling out the red carpet for them. Its not like Sudan is going to get pissed off an say, hey am not going to sell oil to you. They have to sell it to someone at the end of the day, and China is buying.

And please stop derailing the issue.

You have heard of the expression "Innocent until proven guilty" right?

In my opinion, we should keep trading with him until it is proven that he has committed war crimes. We are not mind readers, and we cannot know for sure if he is guilty or innocent until he is convicted.

Maybe you can read minds or see into the future, but I doubt it.

 

[JayAtl]

Oh I have plenty to say about the issue. Until he is convicted in an International Court, we will keep doing business with him. Innocent until proven guilty right?

I'm just saying, if we should stop doing business with countries that murder their own people in the millions every year, then India is a better candidate than Sudan.

At least Sudan does not have the largest number of starving people on Earth. Or some of the world's dirtiest cities, and they even treat their women better than India does.

India fourth most dangerous place for women - NDTV

China no1 in the world for killing babies! through forced abortions! - we all great at subject headers too. Infact the killing of babies is govt mandated and that is genocide! in india it is not a govt policy to have women at risk.

Till he is convicted? Osama was not- I guess he would welcome in china too . hmmm

 

[Roybot]

You know I know ALOT of Sudanese people some on a daily basis and one of my childhood friends is Sudanese I don't understand how come there is a war there anyways. They are some of the greatest people I have ever met. One of the most polite most funny and very warm hearted people.

No one is against the common Sudanese civilians you know, its the regime which people oppose. You obviously just met the Arab Sudanese, you ll know the other side of the story, once you talk to the other Sudanese, you know the ones who were on the receiving end.

One of my close friend is a Sudanese of Arab descent, lovely people, his family loves me, treats me as one of their own, and their food is great

 

[JayAtl]

You have heard of the expression "Innocent until proven guilty" right?

In my opinion, we should keep trading with him until it is proven that he has committed war crimes. We are not mind readers, and we cannot know for sure if he is guilty or innocent until he is convicted.

Maybe you can read minds or see into the future, but I doubt it.

You don't have to be mind readers- you have to be of sane mind. if you are so for innocent till proved guilty' then why not have him arrested in your country and sent off to Hague to be tried? you can't protect someone and eat your cake.

Dalia Lama is not convicted - why do you ask countries to hand him over , not meet with him and call him a dangerous man?

 

[Roybot]

You have heard of the expression "Innocent until proven guilty" right?

In my opinion, we should keep trading with him until it is proven that he has committed war crimes. We are not mind readers, and we cannot know for sure if he is guilty or innocent until he is convicted.

Maybe you can read minds or see into the future, but I doubt it.

No need for snide remarks, read the Guardian article I posted earlier.

Sudanese president Omar al-Bashir charged with Darfur war crimes | World news | The Guardian

The Sudanese president, Omar al-Bashir, has been charged with war crimes over the conflict in Darfur, becoming the first sitting head of state issued with an arrest warrant by the international criminal court (ICC).

The court, based in The Hague, upheld the request of the chief prosecutor, Luis Moreno-Ocampo, to charge Bashir with war crimes and crimes against humanity. More than 200,000 people have died since 2003 in the country's western Darfur region

 

[Mosamania]

No one is against the common Sudanese civilians you know, its the regime which people oppose. You obviously just met the Arab Sudanese, you ll know the other side of the story, once you talk to the other Sudanese, you know the ones who were on the receiving end.

One of my close friend is an Sudanese of Arab descent, lovely people, his family loves me, treats me as one of their own, and their food is great

Oh yeah the saryeh is awesome.

But what saddens me is that if the the southern and northern sudan's go into a fight those great people will be caught in the middle. and we all know who the west is going to back and appearntly china chosen the other for a little chinese American proxy war. really really saddning in every since of the word.

Looking at the way the world is shaping up I think we are heading for a Cold War round 2. starring China and the USA.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

No need for snide remarks, read the Guardian article I posted earlier.

That's right, he has been "charged", but not "convicted".

Do you have any special privilege, which allows you to determine whether he is guilty or innocent, BEFORE he is actually convicted of anything?

"Innocent until proven guilty" - What argument do you have against that?

 

[JayAtl]

That's right, he has been "charged", but not "convicted".

Do you have any special privilege, which allows you to determine whether he is guilty or innocent, BEFORE he is actually convicted of anything?

"Innocent until proven guilty" - What argument do you have against that?

Simple- the man has a warrant for his arrest- send him off to Hague to prove it . If not don't ask the world to not welcome his honorable Dalia lama or call him a criminal. The man has warrant ( international) for his arrest again!

you know exactly that you playing the field here- you won't send him off and he won't go voluntary. should the question not be for china to ask him_ dude we can do business but you need to clear a freaking genocide charge against you first! You can refuse visa to the commander of kashmir army but can't to a genocidal maniac.

why is it so hard to say " my govt is wrong in inviting such a genocidal murderer" - if he is innocent then let him prove it before touching our shores.

 

[below_freezing]

The list provided about swiss banks were private citizens. secondly- it is your politicians shown to have run off to the US with millions

...and thirdly do you even know what your countries corrupt does enmasse -other than snippets that leak out. Nooooo- because it is whitewashed. No free media to put those check and balances. lastly- if it is intentional starvation then India would be called out by the world body as doing such.

You don't have to take Indians seriously- you can take me - Americana, if it helps open your eyes to standing up one time against your countries govt. on genocide killers. I mean shoot- even genocidal killers can't make you guys NOT walk lock step with your govt

The US has supported far more murderous dictators than China has. Examples include Syngman Rhee, butcher of 50,000 at Jeju Island and 1.5 million Koreans in 1 summer during the Bodo League massacre under the guidance of the US Marine CORPSE.

Bodo League massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Another includes SADDAM HUSSEIN who gassed tens of thousands of Iranians whose only crime was believing in Islam, and then went back and stabbed him in the back when he was no longer useful.

Or perhaps you want to talk about Pinochet, or maybe US chemical bombing of Vietnam?

And most of all the US burned its records about the Korean War. How do we know how many actually died during the Bodo Massacre? Perhaps the US Marine Corpse killed half the population of South Korea in their bloody rampage. If they can do this to an "ally" I can't imagine what kind of monstrous brutality they do to their enemies.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Simple- the man has a warrant for his arrest- send him off to Hague to prove it . If not don't ask the world to not welcome his honorable Dalia lama or call him a criminal. The man has warrant ( international) for his arrest again!

you know exactly that you playing the field here- you won't send him off and he won't go voluntary. should the question not be for china to ask him_ dude we can do business but you need to clear a freaking genocide charge against you first! You can refuse visa to the commander of kashmir army but can't a genocidal maniac.

Then why don't you arrest him. It's not our business to go around arresting foreign diplomats. In fact, diplomatic immunity is one of the cornerstones of the international system.

If they knew we would arrest foreign diplomats, then they wouldn't come in the first place.

You keep saying he is guilty of "genocide", but he has not yet even been convicted. Until it is proven in the international courts whether he is guilty or innocent, I will reserve my own judgement, and I expect my government to do the same.

Pre-emptively "assuming" that someone is guilty, before they are even convicted, is simply illogical.

 

[JayAtl]

The US has supported far more murderous dictators than China has. Examples include Syngman Rhee, butcher of 50,000 at Jeju Island and 1.5 million Koreans in 1 summer during the Bodo League massacre under the guidance of the US Marine CORPSE.

Bodo League massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Another includes SADDAM HUSSEIN who gassed tens of thousands of Iranians whose only crime was believing in Islam, and then went back and stabbed him in the back when he was no longer useful.

Or perhaps you want to talk about Pinochet, or maybe US chemical bombing of Vietnam?

And most of all the US burned its records about the Korean War. How do we know how many actually died during the Bodo Massacre? Perhaps the US Marine Corpse killed half the population of South Korea in their bloody rampage. If they can do this to an "ally" I can't imagine what kind of monstrous brutality they do to their enemies.

Ask me if I think US was right in doing so most of your examples --- I have something that in not stuck in my throat to say " NO" now what...

 

[JayAtl]

Then why don't you arrest him. It's not our business to go around arresting foreign diplomats. In fact, diplomatic immunity is one of the cornerstones of the international system.

If they knew we would arrest foreign diplomats, then they wouldn't come in the first place.

You keep saying he is guilty of "genocide", but he has not yet even been convicted. Until it is proven in the international courts whether he is guilty or innocent, I will reserve my own judgement, and I expect my government to do the same.

Pre-emptively "assuming" that someone is guilty, before they are even convicted, is simply illogical.

if he lands in our shores we will... he landed in yours!. what you are doing is snake oil salesman tactics. you know if he is convicted you won't anyhow get to do business with him- because he will be in Jail! Stop with the diplomatic immunity excuse- there is no diplomatic immunity if interpol has warrant for your arrest!

if you catch a mass murderer in china of diplomatic status there are international laws that have clauses that will allow you to try him! and why the hell did you invite him in the first place or even do business with him - he did not have diplomatic immunity to force you do business with a genocidal maniac

see below - diplomat was convicted in the US: http://www.nytimes.com/keyword/gueorgui-makharadze
"A Georgian diplomat imprisoned for manslaughter in the drunken-driving death three years ago of a 16-year-old girl has been transferred from the United States to serve the rest of his sentence in his homeland, Justice Department officials said today. The diplomat, Gueorgui Makharadze, had been serving a 7- to 21-year sentence in a federal prison. Jovine Waltrick of Kensington, Md., was killed in a five-car pileup at a traffic circle in Washington on Jan. 3, 1997. Prosecutors said Mr. Makharadze was drunk and driving about three times the speed limit."

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

if he lands in our shores we will... he landed in yours!. what you are doing is snake oil salesman tactics. you know if he is convicted you won't anyhow get to do business with him- because he will be in Jail! Stop with the diplomatic immunity excuse- there is no diplomatic immunity if interpol has warrant for your arrest!

Like I said, you arrest him if you want him.

He came to China for business purposes, and he represents his country as senior diplomat.

if he lands in our shores we will... he landed in yours!

Yes, he came here because he knows that we don't arrest foreign diplomats, unless they have been convicted under International Law. Otherwise he wouldn't have come in the first place.

he did not have diplomatic immunity to force you do business with a genocidal maniac

Under International Law (and your own laws) he is innocent until proven guilty. Something you have been unable to grasp so far.