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China-Philippines Fishery News and Discussion

Abit out of topic here but:

China's average IQ score is 105
PH's average IQ score is 86

I wanna link the source(sources atually- because all of them show China at the 1-5 postion but im not allowed to by the editor).


The attempt to fool the Chinese by this Yasay by playing around with words/clauses to conceal current situations in that proposed agreement is ridiculously futile. :omghaha:


Kindly reminder: Please stay on topic, thanks!
 
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Will return? I doubt it. You simply can't include ohter people's territory into your EEZ.
 
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Id say let them return.

The islands and surrounding sea is Chinese territory so subject to Chinese rules and laws. They can fish there provided that they dont fcuk around and bring up issues about sovereignty.
 
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And why bother mentioning the Average IQ on this topic? So that you could show of that your country is more "superior"?

my point is to illustrate my opinion of the proposed clause that the PH 'will not drive Chinese fishermen away from Scarborough Shoal' as an attempted ploy by the PH, 1 that is ridiclously insulting by my opinion- on China when it wouldnt be able to anyway. You will have to cite instances when it did before if im wrong about this.

Ironically, it was also precisely the reason that the PH atually tried which ultimately triggered the 2012 standoff that led to the situation today.

BTW, im not from China.

Id say let them return.

The islands and surrounding sea is Chinese territory so subject to Chinese rules and laws. They can fish there provided that they dont fcuk around and bring up issues about sovereignty.

Then what's the point of an having an 'EEZ'?

An exclusive economic zone (EEZ) is a sea zone prescribed by the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea over which a state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources(fishes included), including energy production from water and wind.[1] It stretches from the baseline out to 200 nautical miles (nmi) from its coast. In colloquial usage, the term may include the continental shelf. The term does not include either the territorial sea or the continental shelf beyond the 200 nmi limit. The difference between the territorial sea and the exclusive economic zone is that the first confers full sovereignty over the waters, whereas the second is merely a "sovereign right" which refers to the coastal state's rights below the surface of the sea. The surface waters, as can be seen in the map, are international waters.[2]
 
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During the Department of Foreign Affairs (DFA) budget briefing at the House of Representatives on Tuesday, Foreign Affairs Sec. Perfecto Yasay pushed for the signing of a provisional agreement between the Philippine and Chinese governments. This will allow Filipino fishermen to go back to their traditional fishing grounds.

Yasay said, in the deal, the Philippine government will also agree not to drive out Chinese fishermen from the Scarborough Shoal. He hopes China will sign the agreement before the beginning of bilateral negotiations between the two countries.

Yasay said China may be dubbed as the "biggest loser" if it continues to ignore the decision of the arbitral tribunal on the South China Sea.

"I personally believe that if China will continue to isolate itself before the international community by not respecting the decision of the arbitral tribunal or by not upholding the rule of law, at the end of the day, they will end up the biggest loser in this matter. And I stick to that," he said.

@Cossack25A1
@Zero_wing

@ahojunk the OP is not using the proper article title as it should be:

PH eyes provisional agreement to allow Filipino fishermen in Scarborough Shoal

Please change title as the current title is misleading
 
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@ahojunk the OP is not using the proper article title as it should be:

PH eyes provisional agreement to allow Filipino fishermen in Scarborough Shoal

Please change title as the current title is misleading

I agree. The title suggests that China somehow is to return Huangyan island back to PH.

This is not a case at all.

Besides, it is basically a speculation, no sources from China indicated Beijing is willing to let PH fishermen to fish around Huangyan, let alone leave the island to PH.

This is basically PH blowing the flute and itself being enchanted by the melody.

China will most likely verbally brush it off or simply ignore it.

I hope the title will be corrected.

@Shotgunner51
 
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I have checked the link and have corrected the thread title.

@Cossack25A1 , thanks for providing the link.
 
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Asking China for permission to send PH fishermen to fish around the Huangyan Island (likely off 12NM territorial sea) is practically accepting China's sovereignty over the island.

If PH had sovereignty, it would definitely not be in the lower position of asking for permission from China.

That's a promising sign. Thanks @BoQ77 for bringing this to my attention.

China can let PH fishermen fish off Huangyan on the condition that Huangyan's status under China's sovereignty is recognized.

Nonetheless, the reclamation work will likely begin the first sign of PH provocation. If not, I believe ADIZ will come first.
 
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China construction at Scarborough?
Duterte says coast guard report shows many barges at shoal in South China Sea
Raul Dancel Philippines Correspondent In Manila


Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte says China may already be building structures at Scarborough Shoal in the South China Sea, one of Asia's most dangerous flashpoints.

In a speech at the inauguration of a new port in Davao del Norte province yesterday, Mr Duterte said a report he received from the Philippine Coast Guard showed that "there are a lot of barges" around Scarborough.

He said the report suggested that "there is construction somewhere".

"What is the purpose of a barge? You put something there and bring it somewhere usually," he said. "I think they are starting (at Scarborough), and (there) would be another ruckus there."

This is the first time reports about China trying to reclaim land at Scarborough have surfaced since an international tribunal at The Hague struck down China's claims to the South China Sea on July 12. China claims nearly all of the South China Sea, where about US$5 trillion (S$6.8 trillion) of seaborne trade passes annually. Brunei, Malaysia, the Philippines, Taiwan and Vietnam also have claims on parts of the sea.

China seized control of Scarborough after a two-month stand-off with the Philippines in 2012, which began when a Philippine Navy frigate seized eight Chinese fishing boats suspected of poaching coral and giant clams around the shoal.

SUSPECTED CONSTRUCTION

What is the purpose of a barge? You put something there and bring it somewhere usually. I think they are starting (at Scarborough), and (there) would be another ruckus there.

PHILIPPINE PRESIDENT RODRIGO DUTERTE, on reports of Chinese activity at Scarborough Shoal.

The United States eventually mediated a deal. Both sides were told to withdraw from Scarborough.

The Philippines pulled out its ships, but China stayed and later roped off the mouth of the lagoon, sealing off the entire atoll.

Since then, China has been chasing fishermen from the Philippines away from Scarborough.

In March, US President Barack Obama warned Chinese President Xi Jinping that there would be serious consequences if China reclaimed land at Scarborough, located just 220km west of the main Philippine island of Luzon.

Mr Obama raised the stakes with Mr Xi after US intelligence concluded that China was moving towards reclaiming land at the shoal.

Some officials worry that China may install radars and missiles there. Along with facilities in the Paracel and Spratly islands, that would enable China to create a strategic triangle, which could threaten the US military presence in Hawaii and Guam.

Asean and China are expected to sign at next week's Asean summit in Laos an agreement to establish hotlines and adopt communications protocols to avoid potential naval clashes in the South China Sea, said Foreign Affairs Assistant Secretary Helen de la Vega.

The Code for Unplanned Encounters at Sea "is one way of de-escalating tensions in the South China Sea", she said.

A senior Philippine Navy commander told Reuters: "This is very important because any accident that can lead to a major confrontation will be avoided if our navies and coast guards are communicating with each other."

He said there had been instances when Chinese vessels had not responded to radio and signal communications when they encountered a Philippine Navy ship.

Mr Duterte is holding nine bilateral talks at the summit, including with Mr Obama, Russian leader Vladimir Putin and Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

China's foreign ministry said yesterday it was open to a meeting with Mr Duterte at the summit, but no meetings had been scheduled with Chinese Premier Li Keqiang or United Nations Secretary-General Ban Ki Moon.

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/china-construction-at-scarborough
 
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South China Sea dispute: China may give Filipino fishermen access to Scarborough

  • Benjamin Kang Lim and Ben Blanchard
OCTOBER 19 2016 - 3:02PM

Duterte in China.jpg

Duterte visit in China


Beijing: China will consider giving Filipino fishermen conditional access to disputed waters in the South China Sea after the presidents of the two countries meet in Beijing this week, two Chinese sources with ties to the leadership said.

Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte plans to raise the plight of Filipino fishermen when he meets his Chinese counterpart, Xi Jinping, on Thursday, a Philippine official told Reuters.

China seized Scarborough Shoal - claimed by Beijing as Huangyan island and by Manila as Panatag - in 2012, denying Philippine fishermen access to its rich fishing grounds.

The seizure formed part of a case the Philippines took to the Permanent Court of Arbitration in the Hague, which in July rejected China's territorial claims over much of the South China Sea, including its assertion of a 320 km exclusive economic zone around the disputed Spratly Islands.

China immediately declared the ruling "null and void"but said it was time to get talks started again between the countries directly involved in the territorial disputes to reach a peaceful resolution.

Arriving at his hotel in Beijing, Mr Duterte told reporters he expected to achieve "plenty of happiness for my country" during his trip to China.


Asked about the South China Sea dispute, he said: "No, that is not one of the topics on the agenda. It might crop up but it is going to be a soft landing for everyone. No impositions".

Beijing is now considering making a concession to Mr Duterte, whose rapprochement with China since taking office on June 30 marks an astonishing reversal in recent Philippine foreign policy

Phillipines Pro china.jpg

Phillipines people Pro-China Demonstration


"Everybody can go, but there will be conditions," one of the Chinese sources who speaks regularly with senior officials told Reuters, referring to Chinese and Filipino fishermen.

Asked what the conditions were, the source said: "The two countries would have to form working groups to iron out details."

It was unclear, however, if China would agree to joint coastguard patrols.

The sources did not say what, if anything, China might demand from Manila in exchange for the fishing concession.

"It will be a return to the Arroyo days," the second Chinese source said, referring to the administration of former president Gloria Macapagal Arroyo (2001-2010), when fishermen from both countries had access to waters near Scarborough Shoal.

Pinoy Anti US 3.jpg

Phillipines People Anti US Demonstration

If all goes according to script, fishery cooperation would be one of more than 10 broad framework agreements the two countries would sign during Mr Duterte's visit, the sources said, without giving further details.

The United States, along with Japan and other powers, want to ensure Beijing doesn't interfere with free navigation in the strategic South China Sea, which connects the Indian and Pacific Oceans and through which flows $US5 trillion of trade a year.

Pinoy Anti US 9.jpg

Phillipines Anti US Demonstration

US Navy ships have conducted "freedom of navigation" operations around artificial islands China has been building in the disputed Spratly Islands, which mostly consist of coral reefs and tidal features in the South China Sea.

Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi did not answer directly, when asked whether China would offer any concessions to the Philippines on the South China Sea, including fishing rights around Scarborough Shoal.

"China's position on the South China Sea is clear and consistent. There is no change and there will be no change. This position accords with historical facts and international law," Mr Wang said at a news conference with his New Zealand counterpart.

Mr Wang, however, was upbeat about Mr Duterte's trip saying it would be a "historic visit and a new beginning in China-Philippines relations.

Pinoy Anti US 4.jpg

Phillipines Anti US Demonstration

On Friday, China's ambassador to Manila, Zhao Jianhua, said a budding bilateral friendship could boost chances of removing one of their biggest bones of contention in the South China Sea.

But on Sunday, Mr Duterte said he would raise the Hague ruling and vowed not to surrender any sovereignty, comments that will not sit comfortably with Beijing.

Philippine Supreme Court senior associate justice Antonio Carpio warned that Mr Duterte could be impeached if he gives up the country's sovereignty over the Scarborough Shoal, according to Philippine media.

Pinoy Anti US 8.gif

Phillipines Students Anti US Demonstration

China's objective is to jointly develop resources in the South China Sea with its neighbours, said Lu Xiang, an international relations expert at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, a government think-tank. "Disputes with any neighbour are not conducive for China," he said, when asked what China wanted in exchange for any concession to Mr Duterte.

"We need a better external environment," Mr Lu said.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/south-c...en-access-to-scarborough-20161019-gs5qfa.html

Congratulations for Both Chinese and Phillipines people :china::usflag::smitten:
 
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"Everybody can go, but there will be conditions,"

The conditions should involve recognizing China's de jure sovereignty, in conformity with de facto reality.

It was unclear, however, if China would agree to joint coastguard patrols

No need for this. China's CG is more than capable of enforcing law and keeping order. Why would PH side be wasting money on waters which do not belong to it?

"China's position on the South China Sea is clear and consistent. There is no change and there will be no change. This position accords with historical facts and international law," Mr Wang said at a news conference with his New Zealand counterpart.

That's the bottom line which, apparently, Mr. Duterte has come to understand. From this point of understanding, any economic and security cooperation is likely.
 
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The conditions should involve recognizing China's de jure sovereignty, in conformity with de facto reality.



No need for this. China's CG is more than capable of enforcing law and keeping order. Why would PH side be wasting money on waters which do not belong to it?



That's the bottom line which, apparently, Mr. Duterte has come to understand. From this point of understanding, any economic and security cooperation is likely.


South China sea is Chinese Territory, that's Clear and Consistent.
And there is no change and there will be no change !







But now, Phillipines people can Realize.
Become Friend's of China is very Good, and Constructive for Phillipines itself. :china::smitten:

But, If you become America Doormat, you just get Misery and Pain :tsk:
 
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