China Delivers First Batch of Military Aid to Afghanistan

[A-Team]

Unlike a fanboy, I can assure you I know exactly what I write. Pak-China collaboration is beyond all other relations that China has to be frank with you (from a strategic standpoint). Not too long ago the Chinese told the US and the UN that "Pakistan is their Israel". If this doesn't explain the level of connectivity between the two, than I can't help you as you've become delusional (sorry).

Also, Pakistan's strategy has shifted for good as of a few months ago and its been explained to Mr. McCain yesterday. There is no such concept of the "strategic depth" anymore, which is why they were supporting some people. Just like Afghans were supporting terrorism inside Pakistan through India's $$$$ and training.

Sen. John McCain just visited Pakistan and has conveyed the will to keep Pakistani relations outside of India and Afghanistan relations. Believe it or not, Pakistan will be leading the fight against ISIS in the near future. The PA has tremendous amounts of experience in this area at this point and many countries will be learning from them. The US and Pakistan share the SAME set of enemies that others do. This was said by Mr. McCain today and last week (before his trip). The US would never want to lose Pakistan as an ally. They get upset on the concept of double game sung by the Indian lobby every day in Washington. But one small visit on the ground erases that influence as they get to see ground realities. Thanks.

Well I am glad when you say there is no concept of Strategic Depth anymore, hope this also translate into actual change on the ground as well.

But then when you have Generals like Durrani Sahib as mentioned by @pakistani342 who are still thinking of keeping the pot boiling then it is hard to believe that GHQ has changed its outlook vis-a-vis Afghanistan.

@DJ_Viper

 

[DJ_Viper]

Well I am glad when you say there is no concept of Strategic Depth anymore, hope this also translate into actual change on the ground as well.

I am telling you what's been shared and has proved out to be truth in its early stage investigations and analysis. I am not an authority over it, nor do I sit with POTUS to know what's going on in real time. But knowing a little bit, Pakistan's core focus is to grow the economy and they have goals around it, some short term and some very long term, but they ALL produce serious results and economic change in Pakistan. So that's their focus.

On "change on the ground" issue.....well they have over 3 million Afghab refugees who, instead of appreciating the fact that they were sheltered, clothed and fed, they are too busy destabilizing Pakistan from the inside by supporting Indian networks designed to destabilize Pakistan through violence and terrorism. So unless you guys stop it too, how could the reality be changed??

 

[TaimiKhan]

Your argument is based on the assumption .

- US will leave : I am sorry to break it to you but no they are not leaving, we have a strategic security agreement with them and we will provide bases to their military for decades to come, like South Korea model.

- Whatever conclusions you infer from the Torkham incident is your right, but you are right that AF is not a banana republic, you act against our interests, we will return the favor like another sovereign state.

- lastly I agree with you that civilians on both sides suffer, and that comes back to my central thesis, which is peace will only come with AF-PK government have genuine conversation with each other and address each other's grievances.

Conflict between AF-Pak has no winners, we are both losers in the end.

/Peace

I know well US is not gonna leave, they came here for never to leave until they are thrown out. Occupying Afghanistan was always their objective for their greater vision / plans.

Torkham border incident, the recent issue at Angoor Ada border post, the statement by Afghan army chief that area till Attock belongs to Afghanistan, the recent video of an Afghan Brigadier or above rank giving lecture to his troops about Pakistan, harboring of Baloch militants, harboring of TTP guys, giving free hand to Indians, letting them open consulates where not needed along the border of Pakistan and so many other incidents give a clear indication about the intentions of Afghans. We were building on our side of the border, thus i don't see where the Banana republic of Afghanistan had to come in. Afghans interfere in our territorial integrity, we will retaliate and you guys do the same. You harbor our enemies and we will do the same. You are no Banana republic and let me clear it that we are also no Banana republic.

 

[A-Team]

I am telling you what's been shared and has proved out to be truth in its early stage investigations and analysis. I am not an authority over it, nor do I sit with POTUS to know what's going on in real time. But knowing a little bit, Pakistan's core focus is to grow the economy and they have goals around it, some short term and some very long term, but they ALL produce serious results and economic change in Pakistan. So that's their focus.

On "change on the ground" issue.....well they have over 3 million Afghab refugees who, instead of appreciating the fact that they were sheltered, clothed and fed, they are too busy destabilizing Pakistan from the inside by supporting Indian networks designed to destabilize Pakistan through violence and terrorism. So unless you guys stop it too, how could the reality be changed??

Fair enough.

BTW can you give me one example in which AF refugees have been involved in terrorism in Pakistan via Indian networks..

I would like to welcome to read this article by a well known Pakistani diplomat who destroys the myth that AF refugees are doing all the evil work.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/1123645/deepening-pak-afghan-divide/

All this hoo-haa about AF refugees started when Mullah Mansoor was taken out in Pakistan carrying a Pakistani passport, so I would say it's more of deflection tactic by GHQ than an objective facts on the ground.

I know well US is not gonna leave, they came here for never to leave until they are thrown out. Occupying Afghanistan was always their objective for their greater vision / plans.

Torkham border incident, the recent issue at Angoor Ada border post, the statement by Afghan army chief that area till Attock belongs to Afghanistan, the recent video of an Afghan Brigadier or above rank giving lecture to his troops about Pakistan, harboring of Baloch militants, harboring of TTP guys, giving free hand to Indians, letting them open consulates where not needed along the border of Pakistan and so many other incidents give a clear indication about the intentions of Afghans. We were building on our side of the border, thus i don't see where the Banana republic of Afghanistan had to come in. Afghans interfere in our territorial integrity, we will retaliate and you guys do the same. You harbor our enemies and we will do the same. You are no Banana republic and let me clear it that we are also no Banana republic.

1. So when you know that the US will never leave why are you banking on the assumption that ANSF will fail, it is not failing, it is improving carrying hundreds of operations across the country.

2. You have now returned back to my central thesis, this tit for tat game between us has no winners. GHQ must shake hands with Ashraf Ghani and put an end to this hostilities between us.

/Peace

 

[Mav3rick]

I think it is mistake to go back in the past as we both did nasty things to each other, the question is that with all the turmoil happening in our neighbourhood is it wise for two neighbours, inseparable for eternity to be in a never ending cycle of hostilities ?

We do not agree with that thinking at all, in our opinion all that we have ever done for Afghanistan is help! We helped with the Talibaan, tried to resist the US invasion and then supported your Government. Even today, if Talibaan rule most of Afghanistan that can only mean that most of Afghanistan supports Talibaan and not your US imposed democratically elected government. In such as case, our choice is extremely difficult, do we absolutely abandon Talibaan and go only with the elected Government or do we try and negotiate a peace deal b/w Talibaan and the Government.............I think we are trying to do the later.

One thing is certain, there will come a day when the US will pack up and leave. When that happens, Pakistan will remain a neighbor of Afghanistan, a supportive neighbor. It is indeed in your best interest to align with Pakistan rather then to focus on short term advantage by aligning with India against Pakistan.

 

[DJ_Viper]

BTW can you give me one example in which AF refugees have been involved in terrorism in Pakistan via Indian networks..

Can you see the Air? Not really. Does it exist? Hell yea!! Same goes for this here. There are things that are open like a book. A little connections and know how tells you all that. What are the 50 Indian cultural centers producing in Afghanistan on the border on hard mountains away from the population?

And btw, the Generals from Pakistan's side shared NDS's involvement and captured agents with the US envoy........hope that answers you question.

I would like to welcome to read this article by a well known Pakistani diplomat who destroys the myth that AF refugees are doing all the evil work.

I don't know what you think of me. But I can assure you I know all about this topic. The Afghan refugees, some of which have become rich through running their transportation network inside Pakistan, are entirely responsible for Drug smuggling into Pakistan and then to the entire globe.

Next is the issue of Weapons proliferation inside Pakistan, and these weapons are used in violence and target killing, etc. Then, the same Afghans who hate Pakistan without logic, work with NDS and the Indians, resulting in terrorism and sad, inhumane slaughter of Pakistani citizens. There should be some people from the Pak Military on here to verify what I am saying is actually true. Thank

 

[Kompromat]

You got these weapons because of Pakistan in the first place, we are trying to create an alternative supplier for Afghan military.

@A-Team

 

[neem456]

Basic point is no matter who ever supply the weapons, once its fired by afghan army, will not fliter out anyone and will hit only where the one with triger intends to hit.

 

[TMA]

Frankly I am bit surprised that you are accusing me of hating you or Pakistan, I am a pacifist and pan-regionalist as a matter of fact I want Pakistan to succeed because it will help AF succeed but I just don't agree with the current policies of Pak establishment which supports groups that kill Afghans everyday so I am putting across my view and the current geo-political consideration that is happening the region which shows that Pakistan must pivot its polices vis-a-vis Afghanistan, stop supporting proxies and deal with the Afghan government one-one as two sovereign states. If Pakistan wants to have its genuine grievances addressed it must address it via the elected Afghan Gov and not via proxies such as the Haqqanis or Talis.

@Spring Onion

The NUG also kills Afghans. There is a civil conflict in Afghanistan since the NATO invasion and even before then. Pakistan is not sovereign and Afghanistan is even less sovereign. NATO is in Afghanistan for three main strategic reasons and they are not conducive to Pakistan, until NATO leaves willingly or unwillingly the NUG government is acting as an accomplice to NATO'S hegemonic designs.

 

[A-Team]

The NUG also kills Afghans. There is a civil conflict in Afghanistan since the NATO invasion. Pakistan is not sovereign and Afghanistan is even less sovereign.

Check out latest UNAMA / UN statistics to see how much civilians are killed by the Talis, its is beyond criminal.

I don't know about the sovereignty of Pakistan, it is for you to judge as a Pakistani but AF is is sovereign state period.

You got these weapons because of Pakistan in the first place, we are trying to create an alternative supplier for Afghan military.

@A-Team

Fair enough

Basic point is no matter who ever supply the weapons, once its fired by afghan army, will not fliter out anyone and will hit only where the one with triger intends to hit.

Touche

 

[TMA]

Check out latest UNAMA / UN statistics to see how much civilians are killed by the Talis, its is beyond criminal.

I don't know about the sovereignty of Pakistan, it is for you to judge as a Pakistani but AF is is sovereign state period.



Fair enough



Touche

May God help you... Afghanistan is sovereign...after being invaded by the most powerful military force ever recorded in human history (NATO) and having a "fair and free" political process with the invading forces ever present during this "transition" to democracy and still "hosting" NATO bases and without NATO succour the NUG would collapse. This is not sovereignty no matter how it "legal" it is on paper.

 

[Kaniska]

- China needs Pakistani approval ?

- All I am saying is that China just gave weapons to the AF gov that she will use to eliminate GHQ proxies, you do the math my friend

I am just finding it surprising and amused to know that Pakistan posters think that China will take approval from Pakistan GHQ for having any relation with Afganistan...

 

[DJ_Viper]

Check out latest UNAMA / UN statistics to see how much civilians are killed by the Talis, its is beyond criminal.

I don't know about the sovereignty of Pakistan, it is for you to judge as a Pakistani but AF is is sovereign state period.

Who were these "Talis" to begin with? These were Afghan fighters who didn't lay down their arms post Soviet war, didn't let go of their extremist mentality and the quest to establish a 7th century version of an Islamic government in 1980's and 1990's and in 2000's and as of today!! You are an Afghan and I know Afghanistan well. How many fathers (% of the population) as of today, want their daughters to be educated? The answer is less than 5%!!!! See the mentality (and we are in 2016)?

A crazy man decides to kill others and is used by someone else who gives them the money and weapons (like its happening today inside Pakistan, through Afghanistan). Whose fault it is? The guy who gave you a weapon and asked you to go kill scores of innocent people, or, You, who was so blind in painted religious hatred that you actually decided to commit such a heinous crime?

The fault relies upon you who was a fool enough to risk his/her own life as well as many others. Over 50,000 Pakistan men, women and children have been slaughtered barbarically by these bas*ard terrorists. Thousands were killed in Afghanistan too. I think its time we let go of the blame and realize there is a problem inside Afghanistan and it needs help to fix it.

 

[A-Team]

Who were these "Talis" to begin with? These were Afghan fighters who didn't lay down their arms post Soviet war, didn't let go of their extremist mentality and the quest to establish a 7th century version of an Islamic government in 1980's and 1990's and in 2000's and as of today!! You are an Afghan and I know Afghanistan well. How many fathers (% of the population) as of today, want their daughters to be educated? The answer is less than 5%!!!! See the mentality (and we are in 2016)?

A crazy man decides to kill others and is used by someone else who gives them the money and weapons (like its happening today inside Pakistan, through Afghanistan). Whose fault it is? The guy who gave you a weapon and asked you to go kill scores of innocent people, or, You, who was so blind in painted religious hatred that you actually decided to commit such a heinous crime?

The fault relies upon you who was a fool enough to risk his/her own life as well as many others. Over 50,000 Pakistan men, women and children have been slaughtered barbarically by these bas*ard terrorists. Thousands were killed in Afghanistan too. I think its time we let go of the blame and realize there is a problem inside Afghanistan and it needs help to fix it.

I never said there are no issues on the AF side of course there are, those needs internal fix, here you and I were talking about the external aspects of it.

 

[DJ_Viper]

I never said there are no issues on the AF side of course there are, those needs internal fix, here you and I were talking about the external aspects of it.

I am speaking about a 360 degree view on the entire thing.