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China and Hong Kong Hold Edward Snowden's Fate

Götterdämmerung;4461433 said:
That exactly is a strawman argument, boy.
A 'strawman' is when a completely different subject is being substituted. That is not what I am trying to do. Am asking you: For a country that can detain its own citizens IN SPITE OF ITS LAWS, how can you credibly argue that China is all of a sudden respectful of the laws and cannot arrest Snowden? That is laughable in light of experience.

Götterdämmerung;4461433 said:
Why don't you tell the New Yorkers and Californians that they are not the real America? :lol:
Plenty of Americans have.

Götterdämmerung;4461433 said:
In the meantime, European consumer protection orgs are starting sue US internet platforms
And am sure they are confident that they will win...

Götterdämmerung;4461433 said:
Yeah, kill the messenger ... avoid talking abou the topic, which is fascist surveillance that makes the Stasi look like kindergarten.
As if you know what a fascist society looks and live like. Wait a sec...You do know: China. And now just like the Chinese members here, you are trying to drag US down to that level. Nevertheless, see if you can explain the inconsistency in Snowden's behavior.
 
A 'strawman' is when a completely different subject is being substituted. That is not what I am trying to do. Am asking you: For a country that can detain its own citizens IN SPITE OF ITS LAWS, how can you credibly argue that China is all of a sudden respectful of the laws and cannot arrest Snowden? That is laughable in light of experience.


Plenty of Americans have.


And am sure they are confident that they will win...


As if you know what a fascist society looks and live like. Wait a sec...You do know: China. And now just like the Chinese members here, you are trying to drag US down to that level. Nevertheless, see if you can explain the inconsistency in Snowden's behavior.

Repeating a strawman argument the n-time doesn't make you look intelligent nor knowledgeable.

Well, you guys have to sort that out yourself with regard to who is real and who is unreal American.

It's not me who drags you down, the US is doing a good job in dragging itself down.

Read the comments of German reaction
Diplomatischer Streit um US-Geheimdienstexperten Snowden | meta.tagesschau.de

British reaction
Ecuador breaks US trade pact to thwart 'blackmail' over Snowden asylum | World news | The Guardian

French reaction
Les commentaires sur Affaire Snowden : l'Equateur tape du poing sur la table - Libération

In fact, everyone is laughting at the US. :D
 
China should be a responsible power to guard the basic human rights and a brave fighter.

It's your time, China. Don't be a coward, hope you will not let all the world down.

They let the 'world down' :lol:
 
US who preach "rule of law" all the time is asking another country to disrespect that and forgo due process?

That again expose the same hypocrisy and double standard that US exhibit in that US insist rule apply to everybody else , but when it is not convenient for US, screw the rule.
 
Restricted web access to The Guardian is Armywide, officials say

Security concerns cited in blocking Guardian news
By PHILLIP MOLNAR
Herald Staff Writer
Posted: 06/27/2013 03:12:16 PM PDT
Updated: 06/28/2013 09:11:43 AM PDT

The Army admitted Thursday to not only restricting access to The Guardian news website at the Presidio of Monterey, as reported in Thursday's Herald, but Armywide.

Presidio employees said the site had been blocked since The Guardian broke stories on data collection by the National Security Agency.

Gordon Van Vleet, an Arizona-based spokesman for the Army Network Enterprise Technology Command, or NETCOM, said in an email the Army is filtering "some access to press coverage and online content about the NSA leaks."

He wrote it is routine for the Department of Defense to take preventative "network hygiene" measures to mitigate unauthorized disclosures of classified information.

"We make every effort to balance the need to preserve information access with operational security," he wrote, "however, there are strict policies and directives in place regarding protecting and handling classified information."

In a later phone call, Van Vleet said the filter of classified information on public websites was "Armywide" and did not originate at the Presidio.

Presidio employees described how they could access the U.S. site, Latest US news, world news, sport and comment from the Guardian | guardiannews.com | The Guardian, but were blocked from articles, such as those about the NSA, that redirected to the British site.

Sources at the Presidio said Jose Campos, the post's information assurance security officer, sent an email to employees early Thursday saying The Guardian's website was blocked by Army Cyber Command "in order to prevent an unauthorized disclosure of classified information."

NETCOM is a subordinate to the Army Cyber Command, based in Fort Belvoir, Va., said its website.

Campos wrote if an employee accidentally downloaded classified information, it would result in "labor intensive" work, such as the wipe or destruction of the computer's hard drive.

He wrote that an employee who downloads classified information could face disciplinary action if found to have knowingly downloaded the material on an unclassified computer.

The Guardian's website has classified documents about the NSA's program of monitoring phone records of Verizon customers, a project called Prism which gave the agency "direct access" to data held by Google, Facebook, Apple and others, and more.

The source of the leaks, 29-year-old Edward Snowden, is on the run from American authorities. He is a former contractor for the agency.

Van Vleet said the department does not determine what sites its personnel can choose to see on the DOD system, but "relies on automated filters that restrict access based on content concerns or malware threats."

He said it would not block "websites from the American public in general, and to do so would violate our highest-held principle of upholding and defending the Constitution and respecting civil liberties and privacy."

The Guardian declined to comment, but its editor-in-chief, Alan Rusbridger, sent a link to The Herald's story on Twitter.

Army Cyber Command: U.S. Army Cyber Command

The Guardian's "The NSA Files" page: The NSA files | World news | The Guardian.

Phillip Molnar can be reached at 646-4487 or pmolnar@montereyherald.com.


-------------------------------------

The US Army has no access to a newspaper that is published in an allied "democratic" country. And what the hell is network hygiene? :cheesy: This is getting funnier by the minutes. :partay:
 
Götterdämmerung;4461527 said:
Repeating a strawman argument the n-time doesn't make you look intelligent nor knowledgeable.
Pointing out a strawman when there is not one is not going to help you weasel out of your flawed argument.

For a country that has a historical behavior of ignoring its own laws in persecuting its own citizens, how can you credibly argue that all of a sudden, China cannot arrest Snowden and is respecting its own laws when Snowden is a second degree employee of an intelligence agency? :lol:
 
Pointing out a strawman when there is not one is not going to help you weasel out of your flawed argument.

For a country that has a historical behavior of ignoring its own laws in persecuting its own citizens, how can you credibly argue that all of a sudden, China cannot arrest Snowden and is respecting its own laws when Snowden is a second degree employee of an intelligence agency? :lol:

How about China sees no benefits in arresting Snowden and it suits here interests more by letting Snowden go as Snowden intended? By going through the comments in European newspapers I see all kinds of positive comments regarding China's move. China earned the soft power points, US lost.

BTW, why are you stucked with China, what about your "friends and partners" that you shamelessly spy on and steal from?
 
Götterdämmerung;4465185 said:
How about China sees no benefits in arresting Snowden and it suits here interests more by letting Snowden go as Snowden intended?
Fine. Stick with that story. But do not try to portray China as a saint.

Götterdämmerung;4465185 said:
By going through the comments in European newspapers I see all kinds of positive comments regarding China's move. China earned the soft power points, US lost.
We do not care. In the end, Euro-trash will find a better friend and ally in the US than in China.

Götterdämmerung;4465185 said:
BTW, why are you stucked with China, what about your "friends and partners" that you shamelessly spy on and steal from?
You mean like this...

Berlin Profits from US Spying Program and Is Planning Its Own - SPIEGEL ONLINE

The German Prism: Germans Would Like To Spy More - SPIEGEL ONLINE
The truth is that the Germans would love to be able to engage in more online espionage.

Consequently, an outraged reaction from Berlin would have seemed fairly hypocritical.

Roughly half a dozen countries maintain intelligence agencies like the NSA that operate on a global scale. In addition to the Americans, this includes the Russians, Chinese, British, French and -- to a lesser extent -- Israelis and Germans.

Last year, BND head Gerhard Schindler told the Confidential Committee of the German parliament, the Bundestag, about a secret program that, in his opinion, would make his agency a major international player.
It is hilarious to US unsophisticated Americans that Euro-trash like you sneered down your upturned noses at US for our coarseness but is completely blind to the snot dripping out of those same noses when your governments wants to do the exact same things and actually collaborated with US on those same things.
 
Fine. Stick with that story. But do not try to portray China as a saint.

I was not painting in anyway but rather you demonising China. China does what benefits her and the US does what benefits her.

We do not care. In the end, Euro-trash will find a better friend and ally in the US than in China.

We are Euro-trash. What a great friend who thinks that the majority is trash. Very telling. As a matter of fact, more and more people are of the opinion that having China as a friends will be more beneficial than with the US and that even from people in high positions.

You mean like this...

Berlin Profits from US Spying Program and Is Planning Its Own - SPIEGEL ONLINE

The German Prism: Germans Would Like To Spy More - SPIEGEL ONLINE

It is hilarious to US unsophisticated Americans that Euro-trash like you sneered down your upturned noses at US for our coarseness but is completely blind to the snot dripping out of those same noses when your governments wants to do the exact same things and actually collaborated with US on those same things.

Haha, look at you screaming like a hysterical fishwife and calling names.

As I already said before, our gov. is being under heavy attack for not addressing this scandal and our supposedly "free" media is keeping a low profile about this matter because the gov. has been complicit in this affair. It's going to be a hot election year here and a hot autumn in all over the EU with lot's of riots.

All these surveillances are not against terrorists but against us. All our govs in the EU and the US are very, very afraid.
 
Götterdämmerung;4465376 said:
I was not painting in anyway but rather you demonising China. China does what benefits her and the US does what benefits her.
But you did tried to paint China in a certain portrait. You effectively said China could not detain Snowden because he broke no Chinese laws...

Götterdämmerung;4456280 said:
How is that? Snowden didn't want to stay in China and China can hardly force him to stay and there is no reason for China to do so, since Snowden didn't commit any crimes in China.
...Which is absurd given the fact that China imprison citizens without charges or trumped up charges. How can anyone with any bit of intellectual honesty say that with a straight face is beyond me.

Götterdämmerung;4465376 said:
We are Euro-trash. What a great friend who thinks that the majority is trash. Very telling. As a matter of fact, more and more people are of the opinion that having China as a friends will be more beneficial than with the US and that even from people in high positions.
Are you finally admitting that Europeans thinks Americans are trash? :lol: Do not try to play victim with me, buddy. I have been to your part of the world. But if you think the Chinese thinks the world of Europeans, you are even more naive than I thought.

Götterdämmerung;4465376 said:
Haha, look at you screaming like a hysterical fishwife and calling names.

As I already said before, our gov. is being under heavy attack for not addressing this scandal and our supposedly "free" media is keeping a low profile about this matter because the gov. has been complicit in this affair. It's going to be a hot election year here and a hot autumn in all over the EU with lot's of riots.

All these surveillances are not against terrorists but against us. All our govs in the EU and the US are very, very afraid.
You called US 'fascists' and compared US against the worst of your country produced and now you are offended that I pointed out your governments are doing the same thing as US?
 
Haha ... now lets see how the US will react to this. Germany is classed as tier 3 "friend" and not only is our chancelor (who must be a terrorist) being hacked by the NSA, but the EU mission in Washington and the UN in New York. In the eyes of the US, the EU has to be a terror organisation.

Bericht: US-Geheimdienst verwanzt und infiltriert EU-Institutionen | heise online

Empörung über NSA-Spionage in Deutschland und der EU | tagesschau.de

Steinbrück fordert von Merkel Aufklärung über NSA-Überwachung - SPIEGEL ONLINE

The comments are just delicious!

USA, your days of having the EU as your reliable partner are numbered. :D


Ceterum censeo Vasingtoniam esse delendam
 
Götterdämmerung;4469646 said:
USA, your days of having the EU as your reliable partner are numbered. :D
Sure...

German spy chief says targets Russian, Chinese industrial espionage | Reuters
The head of Germany's military intelligence said in a rare interview that one of his main challenges was to protect defense projects from industrial espionage by the Chinese and Russian secret services.
Your Germany could prove loyalty to partner China by opening every doors and windows to the inner workings of German defense. :lol:
 
Sure...

German spy chief says targets Russian, Chinese industrial espionage | Reuters

Your Germany could prove loyalty to partner China by opening every doors and windows to the inner workings of German defense. :lol:

There are indeed a lot of reasons to protect ourselve from industrail spying against China and Russia. But now we add the US into the monitor. Even leaders of the German industry are already saying that the US harms our economy more than the Chinese could ever do.

Ceterum censeo Vasingtonem esse delendam!
 
Götterdämmerung;4471592 said:
There are indeed a lot of reasons to protect ourselve from industrail spying against China and Russia. But now we add the US into the monitor. Even leaders of the German industry are already saying that the US harms our economy more than the Chinese could ever do.

Ceterum censeo Vasingtonem esse delendam!
You sure about that...???

France should remember its own history before complaining too much about American espionage – Telegraph Blogs
A 2009 US diplomatic cable acquired by Wikileaks quotes the CEO of a top German satellite manufacturer as saying that “France is the evil empire, stealing technology, and Germany knows this”, and that French industrial espionage was so widespread that it did far more damage to the German economy than that of China or Russia.
Now Germany can add France to that list as well. Who knows? May be other EU partners? :lol:
 
You sure about that...???

France should remember its own history before complaining too much about American espionage – Telegraph Blogs

Now Germany can add France to that list as well. Who knows? May be other EU partners? :lol:

We have know this for ages. France wants our technology, heck, every country wants our technology, but they at least stop at wanting to know our technology. The US wants all information of everyone in the world.

Stop finding excuses for the disgusting behaviour of your government. We just won't buy it!

Ceterum censeo Vasingtonem esse delendam!
 
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