Can the military reform Pakistan’s politics?

[mr.robot]

...... yet another "This time it is different claim!" without any evidence to support it. As if the military has now any reason to stop expanding it influence?

It might be different or better but the actual question is who will stop next COAS or next after to reverse the process if he wants to.

 

[VCheng]

It might be different or better but the actual question is who will stop next COAS or next after to reverse the process if he wants to.

Nothing and nobody. That is the honest answer.

 

[RoadRunner401]

It might be different or better but the actual question is who will stop next COAS or next after to reverse the process if he wants to.

Strong civilian leaders.

 

[Gazi]

Yes Military can and they is doing it but for their own interest. Umpire ki Ungli is a clear example of that the phrase used throughout Dharna last year. Furthermore it also enjoys Favorable Public opinion in some Major Population Center of the Country which isnt a bad thing but it does Marginalize the other side in a very Hopeless Position and that is what causing the discomfort despite of having mostly Positive Intentions by the Military. I dont know what Message does Military wants to convey by Eliminating or engineering Political Parties in the name eliminating the real issues which they are being Assigned to like Eliminating Crime, Terrorism, Corruption etc which Pakistani people have trusted with extra power. There should be a line between meddling or Interfering in Politics and the actual tasks they are assigned to perform.

 

[saadee]

Do you drown a newborn before it draws it's first breaths and declare that it died of natural causes?



Yes, of course, why not uproot democracy for nth time, bring in a dictatorship again, watch it give us some nice inflationary growth for about 5-8 years and then exit with some fireworks and in a haze of smoke. And then back to square one, democracy all over again.

Newborn? Brother you are talking about two families who are responsible of destroying your economic infrastructure. Unfortunately, the future of the 20 million people is in the hand of few blood sucking leeches. I wont buy the democracy that failed to provide the basic necessities to its people. 1100 people died just because supposed to be democracy couldn't provide enough electricity specifically in the month of Ramadan?

 

[Jungibaaz]

Newborn? Brother you are talking about two families who are responsible of destroying your economic infrastructure. Unfortunately, the future if the 20 million people is. In the hand of few blood sucking leeches. I wont buy the democracy that failed to fulfill the basic necessities to its people. 1100 people died just because supposed to democracy couldn't provide enough electricity specifically in the month of Ramadan?

Sometimes when replying it seems like a feeble attempt to try and hint at some members to use their own knowledge, and apply some sane logic and thus arrive at what I was saying without trying to dictate it, because if I dictate it, I sound like an arrogant fellow, and if not, the same arguments are recycled by some members, again and again.

Newborn is exactly the phrase, 2008-2015, 7 years old the democracy of Pakistan is, successful democracies are built upon decades and centuries of painful and cumbersome labour, a process of self-improvement and gaining stability.

The reason why you have a few blood sucking leeches and a few family dynasties ruling you, is because your people voted them in, and until they vote them out, they can live with them without whining. Another reason is that these parties have repeatedly been made martyrs by your military, the reforms needed to make sure corruption like this never returns were never made under dictatorship. The reason why you have PPP, PML and the others around today, is directly because of the previous dictatorship, I can say with certainty, our political landscape would be much different had democracy not have been destroyed before it took off in the 90's.

If you want to see long term progress, it needs to be done through the hard work and success of the common man, no God given military one-man show will fix your lives for you, with democracy even with it's failures there is the incentive to do things for yourself, and in a successful democracy there is the platform to do so.

You have not even tasted democracy friend, 7 years is really nothing to go from scratch, to start off in a crappy situation to where we are today.

If you want to continue playing this game of military civilian musical chairs and see Pakistan remain as unstable as it ever was, continue, Quaid's dream has been repeatedly violated by our dictatorship, and progress, REAL progress denied to our people.

 

[Adecypher]

Yes - but without directly running the show as it has other very high priority goals to meet. But Army can play a vital role if the National Assembly get dissolved (Not going into the semantics behind how that would be done), next steps:
1) Bring a caretaker setup comprised of Honest and Selfless Citizens,brilliant Technocrats, Engineers, Scientists, Reformist, Intelligentsia, Religious and Secular Scholars etc for an interim agreed upon time period (or until sanity prevails)
2) Fix Governance, Judiciary, Law & Order etc etc etc
3) Groom next caretakers
Repeat steps 2 and 3 until the Country (i.e. its awaam) get matured enough to embrace true democracy.

Again my wishful thinking...

 

[VCheng]

If you want to continue playing this game of military civilian musical chairs and see Pakistan remain as unstable as it ever was, continue, Quaid's dream has been repeatedly violated by our dictatorship, and progress, REAL progress denied to our people.

All indications are that this same old game is set to continue for the foreseeable future.

 

[third eye]

The Military is a part of Pak politics.

Why & how should it reform a system that keeps it buoyed & relevant ?

 

[saadee]

Sometimes when replying it seems like a feeble attempt to try and hint at some members to use their own knowledge, and apply some sane logic and thus arrive at what I was saying without trying to dictate it, because if I dictate it, I sound like an arrogant fellow, and if not, the same arguments are recycled by some members, again and again.

Newborn is exactly the phrase, 2008-2015, 7 years old the democracy of Pakistan is, successful democracies are built upon decades and centuries of painful and cumbersome labour, a process of self-improvement and gaining stability.

The reason why you have a few blood sucking leeches and a few family dynasties ruling you, is because your people voted them in, and until they vote them out, they can live with them without whining. Another reason is that these parties have repeatedly been made martyrs by your military, the reforms needed to make sure corruption like this never returns were never made under dictatorship. The reason why you have PPP, PML and the others around today, is directly because of the previous dictatorship, I can say with certainty, our political landscape would be much different had democracy not have been destroyed before it took off in the 90's.

If you want to see long term progress, it needs to be done through the hard work and success of the common man, no God given military one-man show will fix your lives for you, with democracy even with it's failures there is the incentive to do things for yourself, and in a successful democracy there is the platform to do so.

You have not even tasted democracy friend, 7 years is really nothing to go from scratch, to start off in a crappy situation to where we are today.

If you want to continue playing this game of military civilian musical chairs and see Pakistan remain as unstable as it ever was, continue, Quaid's dream has been repeatedly violated by our dictatorship, and progress, REAL progress denied to our people.

There is no way besides getting rid of these sewerage rats. Military operation is the only option we have.

The Military is a part of Pak politics.

Why & how should it reform a system that keeps it buoyed & relevant ?

Military needs to drown Nawaz and billo rani in the Arabian sea. 70 percent of our problems will be resolved

 

[third eye]

Military needs to drown Nawaz and billo rani in the Arabian sea. 70 percent of our problems will be resolved

You drown one Nawaz and ten more will sprout.

The problem is not an individual but the system your Military propagates / nurtures that throws up the likes of Mush, Zia, Nawaz etc

 

[saadee]

You drown one Nawaz and ten more will sprout.

The problem is not an individual but the system your Military propagates / nurtures that throws up the likes of Mush, Zia, Nawaz etc

This new COAS can really turn the tables around. I meant to say look at the success of recent military operations in NW. He can close the doors on the people like Zardari and Shareef family. We need someone to take initial step. KPK govt starts using computerized voting system and Nawaz Shareef won't let it happen because he knows that he won't make it without rigging the elections.

 

[Jungibaaz]

There is no way besides getting rid of these sewerage rats. Military operation is the only option we have.

Military needs to drown Nawaz and billo rani in the Arabian sea. 70 percent of our problems will be resolved

Backward thinking this is. I hate being courteous when faced with so hugely damaging opinions.
The actions of military are perhaps the biggest reason we still have to deal with NS and Zardari types.

Had we have been voting, these faces might have been gone by now.

Also, the last part, not even 1% of your problems will be gone? Last time you kicked them out, what happened... they came back twice as bad as before.

Even the intelligence possessed by a goldfish is enough to tell you that trying this sort of thing again will probably fail, given that it has failed EVERY SINGLE TIME BEFORE!

 

[third eye]

This new COAS can really turn the tables around. I meant to say look at the success of recent military operations in NW. He can close the doors on the people like Zardari and Shareef family. We need someone to take initial step. KPK govt starts using computerized voting system and Nawaz Shareef won't let it happen because he knows that he won't make it without rigging the elections.

This is just the point

Countries cannot run on individual personalities , the institutions must gain strength so that the nation does not have to look for personalities.

 

[mr.robot]

Strong civilian leaders.

Hahaha. History tells us otherwise. Leaders like Fatima Jinnah, Mujeeb and Bhutto were treated as as shit despite being strong civilians. First treatment gave birth to unrest in Karachi. Second resulted in Fall of Dhaka. Third gave us current shitty political lot. We are still dealing with aftermaths of first and third.