Can PAK SPECIAL FORCES hunt down Maulvi FazalUllah and other TTP leadership residing in Afghanistan?

[Icarus]

Sir what action did Pakistan take after 2011 OBL operation? Afghans already hate us .We cant change their mind.

That is an infantile assertion. Rather than build your argument on the shortcomings of mine, you've given me a simple "oh, what the heck, let's poke it with a stick and see" type answer.

 

[Syed Asif Bukhari]

That is an infantile assertion. Rather than build your argument on the shortcomings of mine, you've given me a simple "oh, what the heck, let's poke it with a stick and see" type answer.

Every Sovereign country herself protects it interests. Turkey is doing this in Syria , America is doing this all over the world . Recently ,India has done this in Myanmar. It is the basic duty of any state to provide protection of life to its citizen . look what Israel is doing . Israel is crossing every limits to protects its citizens.

 

[Icarus]

Turkey is doing this in Syria

And what fine results they have been getting right? If anything, Turkish intervention has made the country unsafe.

America is doing this all over the world

To limited avail, add to that their global hegemon status and $800 Billion Defence Budget.

Recently ,India has done this in Myanmar

Rebuked by Myanmar, challenged by the world.

look what Israel is doing . Israel is crossing every limits to protects its citizens

And finally you come to the same point as me. Crossing limits. We must protect our citizens without crossing ours because fortunately for the Israelis, what happens next door doesn't come to haunt them for the next several decades.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

In the War on Terror each State is going after the forces that threaten the security of their own citizens and national interests.

no only America does that to some extent and where it can... it seeks approval or participation of the host country as well

Pakistan is in no position to copy that policy when itself it is facing acute security issues. Afghan regime will overtly support elements to cause chaos inside Pakistan as a revenge.

the capability to conduct the operation is there but what matters is .. the outcome and the fallout and who and how will that be handled

 

[Syed Asif Bukhari]

And what fine results they have been getting right? If anything, Turkish intervention has made the country unsafe.



To limited avail, add to that their global hegemon status and $800 Billion Defence Budget.



Rebuked by Myanmar, challenged by the world.



And finally you come to the same point as me. Crossing limits. We must protect our citizens without crossing ours because fortunately for the Israelis, what happens next door doesn't come to haunt them for the next several decades.

Sir , Turkey is intervening in Syria for years. They are bombing Kurdish Pkk in Iraq and Syria without any hesitation. They have a ongoing insurgency for years . we should learn something from turks.2nd thing , India did it because they have muscles so we have .

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Pakistan is in no position to copy that policy when itself it is facing acute security issues. Afghan regime will overtly support elements to cause chaos inside Pakistan as a revenge.

My original post was to convey this message:

The only people who will go after terrorists Pakistan has categorized is Pakistan. Not America, Afghanistan, or Russia.

American drone strikes have gone after terrorists America wants dead. Not terrorists butchering Pakistani school children. If Pakistan wants terrorist havens in Afghanistan eliminated it'll have to do that themselves.

The Afghan governments have shown themselves willing to accuse Pakistan for it's failed campaigns to impose it's writ beyond Kabul and other cities.

Until Pakistan is able to have enough power to enforce the border, it would backfire to carry out any foreign direct action.

Continue to carry out operations to push terrorist over the border, secure the border, get the JF-17 with domestic/ chinese precision weaponry, and it'll be open season in Afghanistan. No one is going to give a damn about some terrorist safe houses being bombed.

 

[HttpError]

No need for such stuff, provide intelligence to USA and let the Drones do their work.

 

[django]

A question is circling in my mind for a very long time. The Taliban killed our soldiers , attacked mosques and military installations . They even slaughtered our children . What are we waiting for? .Our Special forces are well trained and battle hardened . They can easily take out any high value target in Afghanistan . our home has nearly been cleared from these bastards . Now , it is time for Payback .I demand sincere suggestions from all members . My suggestions can be wrong because I am not a military professional but at least I am a Pakistani . So , please guys . Stay on topic . Looking for your sincere and unbiased suggestions .

We are capable of executing such a mission as long as we have the relevant intelligence, however such an operation would surely weaken the hand of Ashraf Ghani who has gone out of his way to improve ties with Pakistan despite substantial resistance from members of the Afghan security apparatus. I say a covert operation that can not be traced back to us is the best option in regards to Fazlullah.kudos

 

[Hellfire]

Sir , Turkey is intervening in Syria for years. They are bombing Kurdish Pkk in Iraq and Syria without any hesitation. They have a ongoing insurgency for years . we should learn something from turks.2nd thing , India did it because they have muscles so we have .

If I may add a bit to what others are saying:

1. For the bold part: Turkey's intervention has actually backfired. If you think that there is going to be no long term repercussion on their flawed proxy intervention and now overt intervention, you shall be mistaken. One of the biggest side effect so far has that the fragile yet workable truce between Government of Turkey and Kurds is now history. Turkey has reopened its own wounds with added benefit of antagonizing Russia, which was not only stupid but is extremely dangerous. The thought process of the time was that NATO and US will back Turley sending in ground troops to secure Kurd dominate area - a non-starter as it proved to be. Also Turkey thought that it could continue keeping a lopsided view on ISIS, again something that has backfired.

2. India has been entering neighbouring countries regularly when required, but with prior information (it maybe just 30 mins notice) - the only difference is that this time it came out and the Myanmar government was left red faced (and correctly so). Also, you don't see Indian forces entering Pakistani territory even when there is hard actionable intel, do you? that is because of the consequences of entering the territory without permission ...... suicidal for your relations. So Indian analogy you can definitey bin here.

 

[DesiGuy1403]

It all depends on how strong your current political dispensation is and how much political capital they have both internally and internationally.

Any unilateral decision by the military might be extremely costly if things go south.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

not without invitation of the Afghan regime . which wont be forthcoming.
any one sided action carries a risk of disaster and possible failure and escalation of hostilities between Kabul and Islamabad,

Americans are the best alternative. provide them with the intelligence and they will take action together with Afghan forces.

thats not what americans did in case of OBL. Trusting them too much is unwise.

 

[massattack]

A question is circling in my mind for a very long time. The Taliban killed our soldiers , attacked mosques and military installations . Looking for your sincere and unbiased suggestions .

He should be killed or captured as soon as possible.

Yes but Pak get ourlt of love affair of afghanistan

Officially, no we can not do this as we respect others border.
Yes with the permission of Afghan gov, we can hunt down those culprits that currently seems difficult because of tension between governments.
Secondly, we ourselves can not open the door for others (USA) to come inside our area to hunt their prey.

Then , what should we do ? . Can we afford and bear another APS like incident? Look at India . Indian army conducted cross border raid in Myanmar . If Indians can do it , then why Pakistan cant do it? Afghans hate us and situation will remain same whether we conduct operation or not.

They can. Are they doing? We might never know.

He should not be killed under any circumstances. We need him alive and we need all the information that he has.

He should be captured or at least killed (worst case scenario). but he should not be let free.

there are a ton of ways to find a loophole around that.......think mercenaries, black ops etc....
P.S: Pak Afghan border is the least respected border in the world...

Question is not can they do it, SSG is professional and capable. But does Pakistan want to do it? The military forces of any nation which is not a banana republic is a capable and potent force - it is the political directive which has to be given .. something that is usually missing.

not without invitation of the Afghan regime . which wont be forthcoming.
any one sided action carries a risk of disaster and possible failure and escalation of hostilities between Kabul and Islamabad,

Americans are the best alternative. provide them with the intelligence and they will take action together with Afghan forces.

Thank you for making the most informed post on this thread.

Yes, the man is absolutely right. The question is not about whether the military can do it, trust me, they can. The question is whether it is politically feasible to do it. So let's war game this scenario a bit.

At the moment, MFU is nothing more than a figure head, his organization has become redundant in Pakistan and its Umer Khurasani that has emerged as the greatest threat to Pakistan's internal security. For now, MFU is easily replaceable, we can kill him and the Taliban will have a successor announced before he has bled out.
On the contrary, by breaching Afghanistan's sovereignty so blatantly, we will not only undermine the Afghan regime and energize the Taliban but make the Afghans further weary of our intentions. Add to that the fact that we will set a negative precedent in the region.

Sir , we all know that Afghan Establishment and intelligence agencies are their sympathizers . They will simply alert them in advance . We can trust Americans but not Afghans. That is why , US did not inform Pakistan about OBL operation.


Sir what action did Pakistan take after 2011 OBL operation? Afghans already hate us .We cant change their mind.

In the War on Terror each State is going after the forces that threaten the security of their own citizens and national interests.

I see it differently. we cannot do things which are not appropriate at the time or will hurt the cause, keeping inview the trouble we are in and the load of shi**t we are facing due to our tarnished image in the world, anything below par or without keeping in view the dynamics of foreign policy and the "Art of war" will be counter productive. Coming back to the questions. As per now its way too early to make such assertions/suggestions. The main objective of zarb e azab is to demoralize the destabilizing factors forces in or out side pakistan......and demoralizing a group or power is a slow and steady process. in other words... this can been seen in the previous 10-15 years what was done to us unfortunately....now since moral of troops and nation is all time up. Ma Sha Allah. same fight of nerves is taken up to the door steps of the hostile powers what once was done to us is done to them. Allhumdulliah...this Mozart music will go on for unspecified period of time till the objective is achieved. The security forces have a big plan this time and i can see how deep it goes. it requires self rectification and over coming challenges we see daily....one thing is for sure the present political will eventually and finally be fine tuned for the final blow. In Sha Allah. before any venture is tried. Because anything/venture/ move less than perfect will only result in further degradation of the state and rise of moral of the anti pak powers. its a delicate balance we will keep In Sha Allah and will succeed In Sha Allah.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Paks must have ample assets on the ground inside Afganistan, and this is their selling point. They crushed the USSR inside Afgainstan. Otherwise, how can they check RAW activities as India's redemption lies in Pak's destruction? But, what's their use plan with these assets is another ball game. It's very easy for the USA to leave at a moment's notice and forget this episode as a bad dream, but the Paks aren't that lucky. They need all the patience and skills in the world to out maneuver India whose stake in the game is so high, cost and capital wise, that she doesn't give even any damn to keep 50% of her own population in sub human conditions...

 

[Syed Asif Bukhari]

If I may add a bit to what others are saying:

1. For the bold part: Turkey's intervention has actually backfired. If you think that there is going to be no long term repercussion on their flawed proxy intervention and now overt intervention, you shall be mistaken. One of the biggest side effect so far has that the fragile yet workable truce between Government of Turkey and Kurds is now history. Turkey has reopened its own wounds with added benefit of antagonizing Russia, which was not only stupid but is extremely dangerous. The thought process of the time was that NATO and US will back Turley sending in ground troops to secure Kurd dominate area - a non-starter as it proved to be. Also Turkey thought that it could continue keeping a lopsided view on ISIS, again something that has backfired.

2. India has been entering neighbouring countries regularly when required, but with prior information (it maybe just 30 mins notice) - the only difference is that this time it came out and the Myanmar government was left red faced (and correctly so). Also, you don't see Indian forces entering Pakistani territory even when there is hard actionable intel, do you? that is because of the consequences of entering the territory without permission ...... suicidal for your relations. So Indian analogy you can definitey bin here.

Sorry Sir , u have muscles but not enough muscles militarily to conduct cross border raid in Pakistan. Both Afghanistan and Myanmar have weak military. India even cant conduct cross border raid in Bangladesh without her permission. India cant afford to conduct cross border raid in her Nuclear armed Pakistan . Don't drag diplomatic relations. First of all, INDIA will have to face the military might of Pakistan.

I did not get it??? So, you would trust Americans even though they did not trust you enough by conducting OBL raid in secret.

Now I get it. You are not trust worthy....LOL

These Indians don't spare a moment to spoil a Pak thread. All the other indian members except u are giving unbiased suggestions . Please stay on topic. I don't want to start another indo pak war in this thread . America is a Superpower . She pursues her own interests. America does not care about neither India nor PAKISTAN.

 

[Hellfire]

Sorry Sir , u have muscles but not enough muscles militarily to conduct cross border raid in Pakistan. Both Afghanistan and Myanmar have weak military. India even cant conduct cross border raid in Bangladesh without her permission. India cant afford to conduct cross border raid in her Nuclear armed Pakistan . Don't drag diplomatic relations. First of all, INDIA will have to face the military might of Pakistan.

Don't troll the thread. Read the thing in context. Cross border raids in terms of going in on Int missions by either sides SFs is common, what we are talking about is legitimate targeting of terror camps, which everyone including Pakistan is bound to honor .
My point is exactly the same that you can not do something without severely affecting the relationship with the neighbouring country - it may be diplomatic row or a retaliation, and a nation can not afford to stand isolated diplomatically in the world today, nuclear weapons or not. North Korea a case in example. And it is not about being militarily weak or not, any troops entering a neighbour's territory without information is implausible as its a violation of territorial integrity as also a potential powder keg. Your contention of not dragging diplomatic relations is not only unrealistic but also suicidal if one looks at the decision making process of conduct of anti-terror operations, including your own decision making process,

All such acts of cross border elimination of terror camps are with consent of host government usually ... until there is a rogue nation involved.

Lets not deviate into nuclear realm for every thing and derail the thread. Thanks