Burqa fines:Muslim pledges to pay 'burka fines' for Muslim women

[Hussein]

And tomorrow they will force women to be naked in summer as men can go naked completely so that there is equality between men and women ??

No men are not naked. It is forbidden except the places designed for it where people naked can go together. nudist beachs and camps.

force and allow are two different matters.
nobody is forced to wear this or this.
but they want to not allow a dress that for them it is a symbol of unequality. and extremism.

This criteria or excuse they use for equality is silly and laughable. I would like to see more equality between the genders in terms of salary, jobs, opportunities in every field than demonstrating it only in dressing because thats easy and can be done anytime voluntarily instead of forcing it

Sarkozy is trying to do much about it.
I cannot say i am a fan of him for other reasons here and i feel more Iranian than French of course.
But this is a "battle" here many women fight for better conditions.
You're right anyway. But situation here is far better than in my country where women are so much mistreated: they are "half a man".

Not everyone who wears burqa is extremists neither extremists are behind every burqa-clad woman.

If so then it means all those burqa-clad Westerner men arrested in Pakistan are also part of extremism then.

I am a religious family.
I respect all ideas except when people are using it as political front . here clearly in France they do. When i hear the women speak about Islam i am impressed they don't know anything about Islam. Their knowledge is near zero.
They just want to say "**** France" and people clearly see it.
They want to create a muslim front against the other French people. This is not acceptable.

 

[Durran3]

My only concern is human rights and right to wear whatever one wants. I have no issue if anyone wants to roam naked similarly i advocate excerising my right to wear whatever i want be it burqa or the skirt. Since these Western, European countries cry loud and claim loudly that they support freedom of expression and human rights hence the onus is on them ensure my right to wear whatever i want.

You really want to talk about Human Rights Jana in France without looking at Pakistan? First of all many people consider it rude that when you talk to them and you don't show your face, I personally find it rude forget the people in France. You still didn't answer a straight forward question I laid in front of you.

The west today consists of really progressive people(also muslim women) from all ideologies, cultures,and religions. They can vote , stand up,choose, discuss and have opinions like here in this forum but Do we listen to the "votes" in favor of this ban that comes from Muslim women, or is that politically incorrect? Are we more concerned about our "populistic" viewpoint, than taking actions for those in deep need for protection and a safe human life Jana?

Why are you ignoring the Majority of the Muslim Women who actually voted in favor of this bill? There are more than 5 Million Muslims in France and this bill would not have passed without the majority of Muslims themselves voting for such a bill. Now that the bill has successfully been passed, you now have a grudge against people or the majority of the people voting? Isn't that what Democracy is about? You hate the government imposing things on you right? Are you willing to Stand up for ME when I can't ******* go to Garrison Park on Shami Road in Peshawar so i can take a jog in my shorts in this hot weather since shorts are banned in a military park

But hey its the law right

Certain things are just not meant to be progressive no matter how tolerent you are of other cultures and I for one believe that the Burqa and full face covering is one of those degrading things that hold the world back from progressing period but than again I am being hypocritical because I am forcing my view on others which I understand.

And tomorrow they will force women to be naked in summer as men can go naked completely so that there is equality between men and women ??

Oh Please Grow up... no one forces anyone to be naked.. have you ever been to the West? You think everyone is ******* around on the streets? The fact that you think that way is laughable if you ask me and is probably the worst kind of stereotyping and generalization I have seen.

 

[BelligerentPacifist]

...
2/ identity: people are used to see people face when they speak or see in the street....

People are also used to hearing others over the telephone. Getting used to is easy, the thing is they don't want their culture to change.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

if its a full face covering then it should be banned(security resons).if it’s a head and hair covering like christian sisters it must be allowed.

 

[Durran3]

People are also used to hearing others over the telephone. Getting used to is easy, the thing is they don't want their culture to stay.

Define French Culture for me please.. sorry but integrating retarded cultures doesn't benefit anyone except the person with the retarded culture. If you told me to integrate cutting of hands which is the Saudi Culture into Pakistan you'd be a laughing stock or that retarded Afghan culture where they run around on horses passing around a poor dead baby calf

 

[Spring Onion]

You really want to talk about Human Rights Jana in France without looking at Pakistan? First of all many people consider it rude that when you talk to them and you don't show your face, I personally find it rude forget the people in France. You still didn't answer a straight forward question I laid in front of you.

The west today consists of really progressive people(also muslim women) from all ideologies, cultures,and religions. They can vote , stand up,choose, discuss and have opinions like here in this forum but Do we listen to the "votes" in favor of this ban that comes from Muslim women, or is that politically incorrect? Are we more concerned about our "populistic" viewpoint, than taking actions for those in deep need for protection and a safe human life Jana?

Why are you ignoring the Majority of the Muslim Women who actually voted in favor of this bill? There are more than 5 Million Muslims in France and this bill would not have passed without the majority of Muslims themselves voting for such a bill. Now that the bill has successfully been passed, you now have a grudge against people or the majority of the people voting? Isn't that what Democracy is about? You hate the government imposing things on you right? Are you willing to Stand up for ME when I can't ******* go to Garrison Park on Shami Road in Peshawar so i can take a jog in my shorts in this hot weather since shorts are banned in a military park

But hey its the law right

Certain things are just not meant to be progressive no matter how tolerent you are of other cultures and I for one believe that the Burqa and full face covering is one of those degrading things that hold the world back from progressing period but than again I am being hypocritical because I am forcing my view on others which I understand.



Oh Please Grow up... no one forces anyone to be naked.. have you ever been to the West? You think everyone is ******* around on the streets? The fact that you think that way is laughable if you ask me and is probably the worst kind of stereotyping and generalization I have seen.

Oh so if we find it rude when they talk to us without a covered face and we d intact a law in this regard will they not be crying loud violation of human rights.


2. You and likes of Sarkozy are doing stereotyping and generalization when they say all burqa-clad women are terrorists or extremists and that the attire can determine backwardness or progress. This is the most silly thing.

3. Please go and check the number of those Muslim women in France who wear full veil or burqa the number is not much and If France is so much concerned about SECURITY then its easy for France to have consensus on Muslim women who wear the attire, keep their data in record and monitor them instead of coming up with silly bans

 

[Hussein]

People are also used to hearing others over the telephone. Getting used to is easy, the thing is they don't want their culture to stay.

how to compare
- the important matter in French culture to see people eyes to eyes. the expression of the face is always described when people meet. when you live in a place you should respect the culture of the country.
- having a mobile or a ring or whatever you can as object
is it a joke?

again there is a big difference between burqa and weil
weil is not forbidden you can see many in the streets and people are not insulting them.

 

[Durran3]

Since you refuse to answer a simple question Jana i'll post another one for you.

While we busy ourselves in discussing the ubiquitous veil issue in countries like France and in secular Muslim republics like Turkey, bemoaning the discrimination faced by Muslim women who use the veil, we conveniently forget that in most Muslim countries women who believe that modest dressing prescribed by the faith can also be demonstrated without the use of a veil, why is it that those women who demonstrate modest dressing WITHOUT the use of veil come under scrutiny all the time by retarded orthadox conservative men of our society?

You and likes of Sarkozy are doing stereotyping and generalization when they say all burqa-clad women are terrorists or extremists and that the attire can determine backwardness or progress. This is the most silly thing.

From what I have seen the women who are fully dressed in black clads have a very skewed version of the world and are generally very militant in nature why else would they defy all cultures and dress in full Black Clads. They are no different than those ultra orthadox Jewish people in Israel who are one of the most violent bunch. Who else would you find in a place like Lal Masjid or in the Jamat-e-Islami party? certainly not the progressive women. I have yet to meet a women who is extremely educated, is ambitious, very career oriented, extremely social, believes in social liberty dress in Black Clad covering herself from head to toe.

 

[Cheetah786]

Ladies and gentleman it's there country and they have the right to pass any law they like including telling you what to wear if U do not like the law you are welcome to leave(which i can guarantee you non of these so called shuttlecock burqa wearing fanatics will)

Janna jee you keep talking about France telling people what to wear yet you do not question this practice carried on in Muslim countries.

 

[billi]

There were reports that taliban trying to put bombs in women breasts.....So now you'll give authority to police to press anyones boobs???????

ill be the police.. maut ho to aisa ho jaaye .. LOL

 

[SQ8]

The best solution would be to have extra checks for women in Burqa.. they must also realize the current issues and acquiesce to the checking.

And offense intented.. women in Burka's STINK!!.. had to sit next to one in a waiting room for a doctor... lady can afford a iphone but not deo's.. PHEW!!

 

[Spartacus_Σπάρτα&#95]

All the ingredents of a war discriminate ppl u dont like then fiind reasons to kill them.
France has always been a raciest culture
their population of blacks have risen to alarming level in france they are finding ways to reduce them.

Food for Thought (FACTS)

France exports 5.8 Billion $ of designer "BURKA" to Islamic nation's

 

[Hussein]

All the ingredents of a war discriminate ppl u dont like then fiind reasons to kill them.
France has always been a raciest culture
their population of blacks have risen to alarming level in france they are finding ways to reduce them.

Food for Thought (FACTS)

France exports 5.8 Billion $ of designer "BURKA" to Islamic nation's

what you say is totally bullshit
when you don't know a country don't insult all people of the country
by easy fantasm

like any european country (but less than russia where black are beaten) the job employment is not in favor of black people. in us it is the same. still country needing to change.
my country is even worst towards black people.

to say france is especially racist is stupid. live there before making such statement.

 

[Spartacus_Σπάρτα&#95]

what you say is totally bullshit
when you don't know a country don't insult all people of the country
by easy fantasm

like any european country (but less than russia where black are beaten) the job employment is not in favor of black people. in us it is the same. still country needing to change.
my country is even worst towards black people.

to say france is especially racist is stupid. live there before making such statement.

BBC NEWS | Europe | First French racism poll released

More than half of black people in France believe they have been victims of discrimination in everyday life, a new survey suggests

It found that 56% of black people believed they suffered racial discrimination at least from time to time, and 61% had experienced it during the past year.

french definition for black >red big lips,black black skin,white google eyes.

"west is a racist society"

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/65747-complicated-lives-saudi-royal-family.html
this thread is a living proof of racism this incident does happen every day in the west but why publish it? just because she is a rich african Ethiopian girl???

 

[Spring Onion]

Racism, feminism and banning the veil

The vote in the French lower house to ban the wearing of the face veil in public is a dangerous development in the intensification of Islamophobia in Europe (Racism veiled as liberation, 15 July). That it has been proclaimed as a victory for women's rights makes it all the more appalling.

Racism is being legitimised by giving it a feminist spin.

Banning the veil, or any other sort of Islamic dress, has nothing to do with liberating women. Liberation, if it is to mean anything, is about self-determination. This must include choice about how to live and dress. It is a myth that women only wear the veil because men force them to. Many women wear the veil in defiance of their parents. Why? Because they see it as a statement of pride in their religious identity and a refusal to be cowed by state-endorsed demonisation of Islam.


If there are women forced to wear the veil by a male family member, how will the state forcing them not to wear it help? Such enforcement can never be progressive. The result will be that, far from being liberated, such women may become completely excluded from public life. It has become mainstream common sense to denounce Islam as somehow uniquely backward and oppressive. For those of us who genuinely believe in challenging oppression and fighting for women's liberation, we see it for what is, racism. Across Europe the only beneficiaries of such laws will be the far right.



Judith Orr

Author, Sexism and the System

• There may be a small minority of women who wear the face veil in France, but I have lived in East Ham for 10 years and over this time I have noticed an increase in the number of women covering their faces. On a practical level, teachers in the local nursery are often worried when a parent collects a child as they are unable to identify the parent. They do not know who is behind the mask. Sometimes it is right for society to stand up and say certain freedoms have to be curtailed for the benefit of the common good. The smoking ban in public places is an example. The freedom to cover your face with a mask is not a freedom worth protecting.

Ian Adams

London

• Madeleine Bunting castigates France for proposing a law banning full face veiling in public. She feels Muslim women are entitled to wear niqabs or burqas in public as a statement of cultural identity. For the vast majority of people in this country, let alone France, full-face veiling is an affront to long-standing cultural norms – in exactly the same way as a western woman publicly wearing brief shorts and a halter top would offend sensibilities in most Muslim countries.

Nick Blackstock

Bradford

Letters: Racism, feminism and banning the veil | World news | The Guardian