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Please do not conflate Mughal history with Hindu/Indian history. They were parasites of the first order bringing nothing but misery to the Indian society. No wonder in all their rule they could not establish a single university. That is why I said we suffered dark ages due to muslim rule in India. Before the Mughals came, India did not have palaces or spectacular cities, because the taxes collected were not exploitative like the Mughals did. Mughals leached out the blood from the society. So how could people develop anything relate to science. They were too caught up in survival issues.

Is it not strange that once Europeans landed in India they suddenly became master inventors. Where was this ingenuity before that? What was Austerlitz's claim? That Europe was ahead of the world in 17th century? Really? Did you see the thread on Indian inventions? He said we gave nothing to the world except Zero.

I do not understand what you mean by sporadic inventions happened in our country but did not help the country. India was the richest economy even in 1800. After 800 years of burning and being beaten up if a society is still that rich would you call that society a failure? Read the link to know how much of industry was still there in India and how much was destroyed by the British.

1857: History & Propaganda | 2ndlook

I will try to explain my views in two parts. One before the conquest of political Islam and the other before the arrival of the British in Indian Subcontinent.

Well, this is often claimed by nationalist Historians that India was a rich, affluent country before the advent of Turks and the Ghaznavides. But they repeatedly fail to assert their claim when faced by the challenges based upon the contemporary literary and travel accounts of Kalhana, Al Beruni, Babbar, Puspananda or Hemachandra Maladharisuri. The nationalist historians even fails to conquer the fact the before the advent of Islam, Indian society was based upon a feudal structure and the majority of the agrarian society were the poor peasants who were exploited and dominated by their feudal lords, greedy priests and cunning merchant classes. What I am saying is nothing of my own but depending on the contemporary sources.

Secondly, I do not understand what do you meant by the west suddenly started inventing right after they arrived in India. The Mughal administrative system was exploiting in nature and and it did no good to the commoners.But this was a continuation of the age old political and economic tradition which started long before during the end of Classical/Golden age of Guptas because the Afghan sultanate, the Mughals or the British kept the basic system of social and political governance of India practically unaltered.

PLEASE DONATE......

I just forgot it.....feeling proud that i had made a DIFFERENCE :)

Yes, you made a difference. It was an extraordinary effort from your part. Me and my family are connected with the Ramakrishna Mission since a long time, but the letter from the PMO had something different in it.
 
Well, this is often claimed by nationalist Historians that India was a rich, affluent country before the advent of Turks and the Ghaznavides. But they repeatedly fail to assert their claim when faced by the challenges based upon the contemporary literary and travel accounts of Kalhana, Al Beruni, Babbar, Puspananda or Hemachandra Maladharisuri. The nationalist historians even fails to conquer the fact the before the advent of Islam, Indian society was based upon a feudal structure and the majority of the agrarian society were the poor peasants who were exploited and dominated by their feudal lords, greedy priests and cunning merchant classes. What I am saying is nothing of my own but depending on the contemporary sources.

Let us take the example of Kalhana. The only translator of his work Aurel Stein establishes Kalhana as a guy who is impartial when dealing with history. Yet when Kalhana praises a king or an administration he is dismissed by Aurel Stein as being "the very redundant praise and flattery which by custom and literary tradition Indian authors feel obliged to bestow on their patrons."

So where a Hindu historian is praising his kings or ancestors he is resorting to flattery, but where he speaks about debauchery he is being impartial and honest. Very convenient.

Similar treatment but in the reverse is given to Muslim historians. Where they have accounted for genocide and destruction of temples, it is considered to be falsehood and boastfulness of a court historian.

So a Hindu is resorting to flattery if he says any good about his society and a Muslim is objective when he runs down on Hindu society. This is contemporary sources.

Also begs the question of how wise is it to let an European translate Sanskrit works for us. Do Hindus go and translate Quran and Islamic literature for Muslims? Or Latin works for Christians? Would they be competent enough to grasp the nuances and essence of the society? Can their impartiality be trusted?

Most of these are Wendy Doniger types whose works deserve to be put in the trash bin as there is where it belongs.

Sorry India did not have feudal system until the advent of Islam. The fact is throughout India there are no palaces or mansions which are over 1000 years old. What we have is temples and universities which are that old. There is absolutely no evidence of an exploitative Feudal system in India before Islam.

Secondly, I do not understand what do you meant by the west suddenly started inventing right after they arrived in India. The Mughal administrative system was exploiting in nature and and it did no good to the commoners.But this was a continuation of the age old political and economic tradition which started long before during the end of Classical/Golden age of Guptas because the Afghan sultanate, the Mughals or the British kept the basic system of social and political governance of India practically unaltered.

What do you mean it was a continuation of age old means? Were the universities all over India exploitative in nature? How many universities did the Delhi Sultanate and Mughals build if they were continuing with the age old political and economic tradition of Guptas. Was it an age old tradition in India to burn and kill noncombatants in war? Was it an age old tradition in India to make eunuchs out of boys in thousands? How many mausoleums like Taj Mahals did the Indian kings build if they were exploitative and taxing their poor country for their glory.

What happened to Alexander’s loot from India …? | 2ndlook

The Europeans were stealing and appropriating inventions by other civilizations is what I meant by inventing right after they arrived in India. The so called Renaissance leading to democracy and liberty is as rubbish as anything else. Europe remained Feudal and perpetrators of mass inhumanity.

Cultural Dacoity | 2ndlook
 
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Secondly, I do not understand what do you meant by the west suddenly started inventing right after they arrived in India. The Mughal administrative system was exploiting in nature and and it did no good to the commoners.But this was a continuation of the age old political and economic tradition which started long before during the end of Classical/Golden age of Guptas because the Afghan sultanate, the Mughals or the British kept the basic system of social and political governance of India practically unaltered.



Yes, you made a difference. It was an extraordinary effort from your part. Me and my family are connected with the Ramakrishna Mission since a long time, but the letter from the PMO had something different in it.

The first significant contact between India and West occurred with Alexander the Great I think. I remember Aristotle tutoring Alexander?

The Greeks already had illustrious civilizational hallmarks. Sophocles and Aristophanes as dramtists and atirists. Athens as an imperfect mob democracy.

You had Pythagoras and Archimedes.

Then you have the Roman Empire who were the spiritual successors. They subjugated the Germanic tribes and Modern Day Britiain, bringing a semblance of civilization with them.

The mayans, despite their savagery in their religious sacrifices were excellent Astronomers.

As to the West's dominance, they were at the right place at the right time.

It took Oghadai's Mongolians to get the Europeans to look at a world outside of their borders.

@scorpionx @Indischer

your opinion on my post
 
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The first significant contact between India and West occurred with Alexander the Great I think. I remember Aristotle tutoring Alexander?

The Greeks already had illustrious civilizational hallmarks. Sophocles and Aristophanes as dramtists and atirists. Athens as an imperfect mob democracy.

You had Pythagoras and Archimedes.

Then you have the Roman Empire who were the spiritual successors. They subjugated the Germanic tribes and Modern Day Britiain, bringing a semblance of civilization with them.

The mayans, despite their savagery in their religious sacrifices were excellent Astronomers.

As to the West's dominance, they were at the right place at the right time.

It took Oghadai's Mongolians to get the Europeans to look at a world outside of their borders.

@scorpionx @Indischer

your opinion on my post

I will return tomorrow.Leaving for work. Give you a detailed reply tomorrow. BTW, it's a good post but just watch your head. @Hermione is watching us.:-)
 
The first significant contact between India and West occurred with Alexander the Great I think. I remember Aristotle tutoring Alexander?

The Greeks already had illustrious civilizational hallmarks. Sophocles and Aristophanes as dramtists and atirists. Athens as an imperfect mob democracy.

You had Pythagoras and Archimedes.

Then you have the Roman Empire who were the spiritual successors. They subjugated the Germanic tribes and Modern Day Britiain, bringing a semblance of civilization with them.

The mayans, despite their savagery in their religious sacrifices were excellent Astronomers.

As to the West's dominance, they were at the right place at the right time.

It took Oghadai's Mongolians to get the Europeans to look at a world outside of their borders.

@scorpionx @Indischer

your opinion on my post

Right on most counts. What you've posted are factually accurate, and hence don't deserve a 'second opinion', so to speak.

Though, I'll say that the emergence of Magna Carta had a big big role in shaping up European Nationalism, and consequently their renaissance.
 
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