Bell 412EP - Update

[fatman17]

Bell 412EP

Delivered;28
Current; 26
Lost; 2
On Order;30

- In service from 2005

- Note: At least 5 examples (possibly as many as 7) are operated on behalf of the Ministry of Interior's Air Wing (which see). The attrition losses occurred on 21st June 2006 & 6th February 2008. An FMS contract for a further 2 examples (plus 1 option) was awarded via the US Army on 6th May 2010, with the delivery of 2 aircraft occurring less than a fortnight later on 18th May 2010. On 15th September 2010 the DSCA notified US Congress of the possible sale to Pakistan of up to 30 more Bell 412EPs in a deal valued at $397 million, if concluded.

AFI

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan - BELL 412EP Helicopters

WASHINGTON, September 15, 2010 -- The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress on 14 September of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Pakistan of BELL 412EP Helicopters as well as associated equipment and services. The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $397 million.
The Government of Pakistan has requested a possible sale of up to thirty BELL 412EP Helicopters, spare and repair parts, support equipment, ferry services, air worthiness certification, publications and technical data, personnel training and training equipment, U.S. Government and contractor logistics, engineering, and technical support services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $397 million.
This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping to improve the security of a friendly country that has been and continues to be an important force for economic progress in South Asia and a partner in overseas contingency operations.
The proposed sale of the helicopters will increase Pakistan’s air capabilities to execute counterinsurgency operations, border security, search and rescue, and support for the civilian population in Pakistan. Pakistan, which already has Bell 412EP Helicopters in its inventory, will have no difficulty absorbing these additional helicopters into its armed forces.
The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.
The prime contractor will be Bell Helicopter in Fort Worth, Texas. There are no known offset agreements proposed in connection with this potential sale.
Implementation of this proposed sale will not require the assignment of any additional U. S. Government personnel in country. It is anticipated that two U.G. Government personnel will travel to Pakistan two times per year, one week per trip, for a period of up to five years to provide logistic support services.
There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.
This notice of a potential sale is required by law; it does not mean that the sale has been concluded.

 

[Arsalan]

a good utility helicopter to transport small group of troops.
its quick and agile and now with the machine guns and perhaps rocket bays installed, will not be requiring gunship escort.

i hope we do ge these additional 30!

regards!

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

30 bell 412EP for 397 million$$ thts too much!....why not buy some black hawks?thts a better option.

 

[fatman17]

30 bell 412EP for 397 million$$ thts too much!....why not buy some black hawks?thts a better option.

13m per plus logistic support is not a bad deal - these will be in the LAH config used for recee and light attack.

 

[ice_man]

fatman what type of light attack can you calrify? can these be armed with any type of anti tank missiles? i think Pakistan has way to many transport helicopters now but not many attack ones!

 

[fatman17]

fatman what type of light attack can you calrify? can these be armed with any type of anti tank missiles? i think Pakistan has way to many transport helicopters now but not many attack ones!

they will have door-mounted MG's and provision to fire rockets.

 

[emotionless_teenage]

30 bell 412EP for 397 million$$ thts too much!....why not buy some black hawks?thts a better option.

other that it's a good deal considering 13 million for a fully modernized Iruquois,it is also cost about half the standard UH-60M(they cost around 30 mil i think),carrying about similar amount of passenger(12,though UH-60 has higher weight carrying ceiling) and has lower operational cost and cost per flight(roughly 1/3 of the UH-60 cost)

besides USMC used this helos in afghanistan and this is the helos(other than Russian Mi-17,but they are in different class in my book)

 

[softtec]

13m per plus logistic support is not a bad deal - these will be in the LAH config used for recee and light attack.

Congrats..its a very good deal indeed. What ppl forgetting that army needs the lifting capability also in a big numbers and as necessary as for attack.

 

[Arsalan]

30 bell 412EP for 397 million$$ thts too much!....why not buy some black hawks?thts a better option.

nops,
its a good bargain,
the black hawk stuff is way too expensive and it is not also on the offer list.
moreover it do not have a lot more to offer then what we can get from the Bell.
door mounted Machine Guns, option for rocket mounts, gives it enough fire power to carry troops into hostile terrorist lands, deliver them, provide fire cover and extarct them out when the job is done.

they are a good asset, its good we are getting them in numbers!

regards!

 

[muse]

it's curious that Pakistan seem not be interested in Russian helicopters, even the Mi17 -- Wonder if this is because the Pakistanis are not interested or is it the Russian ?

 

[TaimiKhan]

it's curious that Pakistan seem not be interested in Russian helicopters, even the Mi17 -- Wonder if this is because the Pakistanis are not interested or is it the Russian ?

Pakistan is interested in Mi-17s, has ordered some for the last few years and am not fully sure, but i believe they have few on order for now also.

Problem is, requirement, do we need more of the heavy lift helicopters in the category of Mi-17s or something in medium lift category like the Bell 412s.

Answer is, we need a good amount of the medium lift category helicopters, as they are used more and are needed more compared to heavy lift category ones. And for tribal areas, and WoT operations, these Bell 412s can play a very effective role, dual role, as an attack heli also.

So we need a mix, 50-60 medium lift ones, similar number of Mi-17s type or even more, and then the light ones for high altitude air lift.

But having 50-60 Bell 412s, nearly majority of the medium lift helicopters of US origin, is very dangerous. We need as again, diversification.

30 or so Bell's, rest of the force should have been some other origin.

I am in no favor to rely on the US for such huge number of helicopters.

 

[Arsalan]

it's curious that Pakistan seem not be interested in Russian helicopters, even the Mi17 -- Wonder if this is because the Pakistanis are not interested or is it the Russian ?

sir we have been getting quite a few Mi-17 in recent times.
i will make look for old thread discussing that, i remember, they were, strangely, being provided by USA.

regards!

 

[fatman17]

it's curious that Pakistan seem not be interested in Russian helicopters, even the Mi17 -- Wonder if this is because the Pakistanis are not interested or is it the Russian ?

at least 20+Mi-17s are in the pipeline - they are med-lift/assault helos. the 412EP provides a different 'dimension' to the PAA. its main function is 'air-recce' ensuring that ground troops are not 'ambushed' and it can also clear the areas as it is armed. so the PAA like the Mi-17s as well as the 412EPs.

 

[fatman17]

sir we have been getting quite a few Mi-17 in recent times.
i will make look for old thread discussing that, i remember, they were, strangely, being provided by USA.

regards!

many Mi-17 are available in the former 'Warsaw pact' countries which are 'upgraded' and put to good use in afghanistan (from Czeck) and Pakistan (Ukraine/Romania/Russia). 4 were returned by the PAA as the 'upgraded' helos were not up-to-standard.