Australia 'spied on Indonesian President Yudhoyono'

[Nike]

Germany reacted to the NSA spying allegation when Frau Merkel knew that her phone line was tapped and the same thing goes for our president too. Yudhoyono and his family's phone lines were also tapped.

I don't think that tapping a phone line that belong to a head of a diplomatically friendly country can be considered "normal" in collecting informations. It would be better for U.S to arrange an information sharing policy with Germany, and also for Australia with Indonesia.






I agree, governments of the world had been spying on each other since forever. Indonesian government has also done the same thing to Australia.

Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian


But you should understand that spying on each other is one thing, but being caught is something else.

The issue has been made public, and the public is now angry, thus forcing Indonesian government to show that it shares the same stand with the public. And I don't think that the main reason of Indonesia kicking up a big fuss is because the upcoming election, as Pres. Yudhoyono can't run again in the upcoming election. It is more like showing its dissappointment towards Abbot's lack of diplomatical skills in discussing issues like Boat People and other previous issues. This spying allegation is only a trigger to the declining diplomatic relation between Indonesia and Australia in these past 2 years. 


Lol, looks like they are trying to camouflage it. Why don't they cover it with a water tank or something more "convincing".

I assure you Indonesia does, you just don't know about it

"When he retired in 2004 Indonesian spymaster General Abdullah Mahmud Hendropriyono revealed his agency had not only tapped Australian civil and military communications and politicians' phone calls during the 1999 East Timor crisis, but had also unsuccessfully attempted to recruit Australian officials as double agents."

General says Indonesia spied on Australia and it would be 'silly' if Canberra didn't do the same | News.com.au

Yes we are spying too, and we don't trying to deny it. But what Reashot Xigwin means is Indonesia doesn't bother to spying your Prime Minister and his wife so thoroughly like what Australia does. What your country has done is at another kind of level, and that so disturbing. And what else, even though Australia Gov. know a lot about our country and our leader behavior by the means of spying and the rings of clandestine operations resulting some kind of sensitive information about us but Aus. Gov. and some of your people still think us as some backward and third world country and look down upon us just like in the past. Maybe SBY is right, our peoples, our country, our leadership need to think twice about Indonesia-Australia relationship and maybe Japan, Korea, Russia or even China will be more sincere and know some ethics when building relationship and trust with us.

 

[Viet]

Yes we are spying too, and we don't trying to deny it. But what Reashot Xigwin means is Indonesia doesn't bother to spying your Prime Minister and his wife so thoroughly like what Australia does. What your country has done is at another kind of level, and that so disturbing. And what else, even though Australia Gov. know a lot about our country and our leader behavior by the means of spying and the rings of clandestine operations resulting some kind of sensitive information about us but Aus. Gov. and some of your people still think us as some backward and third world country and look down upon us just like in the past. Maybe SBY is right, our peoples, our country, our leadership need to think twice about Indonesia-Australia relationship and maybe Japan, Korea, Russia or even China will be more sincere and know some ethics when building relationship and trust with us.

Honestly, I believe your country is overracting right now...Spying and gathering information among enemies and even friends are not uncommon. summoning the Australian embassador is okay, but further steps you have taken, including recalling your embassador, demanding apology and threathening your relationship with Australia go too far.

It is not wise to let the dispute to escalate.

 

[Viet]

Of course we spy, but not to this degree. We don't spy on an international gathering or tapped any head of state cellphone. I can say that for certain because I almost got recruited to join the BIN (Indonesian Intelligence Agency).

To use a proverb; We stole Chum, they stole Whale.

The fact that Australia spys on Indonesia shows the lack of trust, though the Australian agency might have gone too far by tapping the phone line of the First lady.

Canberra doesn't trust Jakarta

 

[帅的一匹]

China supports Jakarta in this matter without hesitation.

 

[xdrive]

China supports Jakarta in this matter without hesitation.

You are a part of the Chinese government are you?

The fact that Australia spys on Indonesia shows the lack of trust, though the Australian agency might have gone too far by tapping the phone line of the First lady.

Canberra doesn't trust Jakarta

Not at all. The U.S spied on Germany even though they are close allies. It's all about information gathering, nothing hostile.

Indonesia is just over reacting majorly to try to act tough for their election.

 

[Viet]

Not at all. The U.S spied on Germany even though they are close allies. It's all about information gathering, nothing hostile.

Indonesia is just over reacting majorly to try to act tough for their election.

well it depends on if you just gather information (listening to the air) and aggressively break into the phone line in order to get what you want. In this case, the latter I guess.

I gree Indonesia is overreacting a bit. A escalating conflict would hurt Indonesia more than Australia. Take Vietnam, we know you are gathering information in our country as well, and our reaction: VN demands explanation from Australia. That´s all. All carry out business as usual.

VN requests Australia, US to clarify spy row — TalkVietnam

China supports Jakarta in this matter without hesitation.

how? stop imports from Australia? since when China interferes in other countries? LOL

 

[jhungary]

Indonesia to us Aussie is some sort of frienemy, the prospect of spying is currently accepted as a routine procedure

In the game of intelligence gathering, everybody is doing their part, of course some would have different approach to another. It rather on how much resource you want to devote and how much you can afford

What I mean afford is not just you afford to use or build the hardware ie money, but also how much you are willing to risk

Who knows, maybe the Indonesian indeed tried to cap our PM phone, just they had not succeed.

@Wholegrain

You missed one big chapter on East Timor I don't know if you just forgetting about it or you just don't want to say it

Without Australia, East Timor will not even exist today, if you have to quote the Australian green those leftist to justified your point, then bee prepare to receive all the Arab brethren you got in Australia, cause they are dead set against Islam

 

[nufix]

Honestly, I believe your country is overracting right now...Spying and gathering information among enemies and even friends are not uncommon. summoning the Australian embassador is okay, but further steps you have taken, including recalling your embassador, demanding apology and threathening your relationship with Australia go too far.

It is not wise to let the dispute to escalate.

summoning Australian ambassador: checked
demanding explanation: checked
getting explanation: not checked
getting Abbot's refusal: checked

Even Obama apologized to his allies in Europe over spying allegations, Abbot in the other hand was beelittling this case. It becomes a little bit personal for our president.

Indonesia to us Aussie is some sort of frienemy, the prospect of spying is currently accepted as a routine procedure


In the game of intelligence gathering, everybody is doing their part, of course some would have different approach to another. It rather on how much resource you want to devote and how much you can afford

What I mean afford is not just you afford to use or build the hardware ie money, but also how much you are willing to risk

Who knows, maybe the Indonesian indeed tried to cap our PM phone, just they had not succeed.

It is not actually about "the spying", it is actually about 'what follows after being caught spying".

like I said, spying on each other is one thing, but being caught is something else. And also like you said, information gathering through intelligence agency requires a will to devote resources, included the risks, not only money but also relationship with the country that Australia was spying on, especially when it got caught.

Do not blame Indonesia for being overacted (though it is), do you think the government should not look like supporting the people's stand? what government would lose their face in front of their own folks? Blame Australia for being caught and blame Abbot for his lack of apology, after all, what Indonesian government demanded from Australia was actually no different than what Germany asked from U.S (Explanation and Apology).

 

[帅的一匹]

Indonesia to us Aussie is some sort of frienemy, the prospect of spying is currently accepted as a routine procedure

In the game of intelligence gathering, everybody is doing their part, of course some would have different approach to another. It rather on how much resource you want to devote and how much you can afford

What I mean afford is not just you afford to use or build the hardware ie money, but also how much you are willing to risk

Who knows, maybe the Indonesian indeed tried to cap our PM phone, just they had not succeed.

@Wholegrain

You missed one big chapter on East Timor I don't know if you just forgetting about it or you just don't want to say it

Without Australia, East Timor will not even exist today, if you have to quote the Australian green those leftist to justified your point, then bee prepare to receive all the Arab brethren you got in Australia, cause they are dead set against Islam

Why your flag in PRC? Which city you stay in Australia?

 

[jhungary]

Why your flag in PRC? Which city you stay in Australia?

Why not? And why do you want to know?
有什麼關係呢?

 

[Snomannen]

Why not? And why do you want to know?
有什麼關係呢?

有咖，你多尐同人哋吹水話曬畀大家知你家底，等人哋同你祈福保你全家幸福．

Translate: Good morning, how are you? I am fine, thank you.

 

[jhungary]

summoning Australian ambassador: checked
demanding explanation: checked
getting explanation: not checked
getting Abbot's refusal: checked

Even Obama apologized to his allies in Europe over spying allegations, Abbot in the other hand was beelittling this case. It becomes a little bit personal for our president.



It is not actually about "the spying", it is actually about 'what follows after being caught spying".

like I said, spying on each other is one thing, but being caught is something else. And also like you said, information gathering through intelligence agency requires a will to devote resources, included the risks, not only money but also relationship with the country that Australia was spying on, especially when it got caught.

Do not blame Indonesia for being overacted (though it is), do you think the government should not look like supporting the people's stand? what government would lose their face in front of their own folks? Blame Australia for being caught and blame Abbot for his lack of apology, after all, what Indonesian government demanded from Australia was actually no different than what Germany asked from U.S (Explanation and Apology).

You missed my point, in fact if Australia are close friend and allies, Indonesian deserve an apology, seeing how your government and our government work on the asylum issue, I would say Indonesia is neither Australia close friend or allies.

In term of politics, Australia regretted these type of situation, but apologise for it have its slim chance.

I mean did US apologised for spying in china when the PLAAF intercepted the RP-3 off hainan resulting the rowing of both RP-3 and J-8 that sent up to intercept？

This is my point

有咖，你多尐同人哋吹水話曬畀大家知你家底，等人哋同你祈福保你全家幸福．

Translate: Good morning, how are you? I am fine, thank you.

係尐定係啲?

 

[Snomannen]

The weak apologies.

係尐定係啲?

緊係尐啦，筆劃少咁Ｘ多而且又正規，明明有個好寫好用嘅［尐］尐傻凱仔係要寫成鬼死咁複雜嘅［啲］．

Translate: No I did not touch myself last night.

 

[sincity]

Australia one accused China of spying but themselves not just spying but openly place a phone bug to eave drop on other nation ambassador phone conversation.

 

[帅的一匹]

里晒边哪？Australian Cantonese?