Australia Navy entered Indonesia waters six times

[Developereo]

I don't understand why folks want to go somewhere where they are clearly not welcome. Signals from Australia couldn't be clearer.

These are desperate people who face almost certain death if they go back, so this is worth the risk. This is borne out by the fact that over 90% of them are deemed to be genuine refugees by Australian authorities once their case is heard.

 

[Mech]

These are desperate people who face almost certain death if they go back, so this is worth the risk. This is borne out by the fact that over 90% of them are deemed to be genuine refugees by Australian authorities once their case is heard.

But why Australia ? There are so many other countries that are much more closer than Australia. Yesterday, the Abbott govt. was in talks with Cambodian administration about accepting some of the boat people.

 

[Developereo]

But why Australia ? There are so many other countries that are much more closer than Australia.

They have to go to a country which is a signatory to the UNHCR (not all countries are).

 

[Reashot Xigwin]

That's your opinion.

Either that or the RAN have the most incompetent sailors since Cat took to the sea.

 

[xdrive]

But why Australia ? There are so many other countries that are much more closer than Australia. Yesterday, the Abbott govt. was in talks with Cambodian administration about accepting some of the boat people.

Exactly. But Australia is a rich western country with a good welfare system so they desperately want to get here. Afghanistan is literally surrounded by numerous safe countries that are signatory to the convention. They ignore these countries, fly to Indonesia and then get smuggled into Australia.

They are cheats plain and simple.

 

[xdrive]

Rear Admiral James Goldrick explains what led to Australian ships entering Indonesian waters

Writing for ABC News Online, Rear Admiral James Goldrick, who retired in 2012, says the controversy resulted from officers on board the Australian ships making what is by Navy standards, a basic mistake.

"What is apparent is that units simply misinterpreted the maritime boundaries around Indonesia", he said, by relying on the standard 12 nautical mile limit of territorial waters and failing to account for a complex formula that is applied when calculating the limit of archipelago nations such as Indonesia, which comprises thousands of islands.

"Drawing what is effectively a ring around all the islands also results in everything inside the archipelago being territorial waters, regardless of ... distance from the coast," he said.

"At the edge of the boundaries, a ship can be up to 50 nautical miles (in special circumstances over 60 nautical miles) from the nearest land and still be within the territorial sea.

"It is clear from the public statements that at no time did any Australian ship approach within 12 nautical miles of Indonesian land. For whatever reason, this 12 mile limit interpretation of international law seems to have been the one that dominated - incorrectly - the planning and execution of the operation at sea."

He dismisses subsequent speculation that the ships involved, Navy frigates Stuart and Parramatta and the Customs vessel Triton, may have inadvertently strayed off course.

Rear Admiral James Goldrick explains what led to Australian ships entering Indonesian waters - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

 

[Maxtini]

Exactly. But Australia is a rich western country with a good welfare system so they desperately want to get here. Afghanistan is literally surrounded by numerous safe countries that are signatory to the convention. They ignore these countries, fly to Indonesia and then get smuggled into Australia.

They are cheats plain and simple.

So is it wrong to go to Australia to seek refuge?
I cannot fathom how seeking a better refuge like Australia is not allow?
It is clear, their countries are in a state (civil) war, seeking refuge from war is already a compelling reason for them to be admitted a refugee status regardless of whether they are rich and poor.

Are you implying that Albert Einstein is a cheat? Why did he not go to Britain, Switzerland. or France? Why would he want to fly to US?

Are you calling all these prominent refugees a cheat?
Apparently, they are all:
1. Financially well (most of them are prominent scientist, activist, and artist)
2. Go to US and rich developed countries to seek refuge thousand of miles away from their home countries
3. Most of them transit through third countries

UNHCR - Prominent Refugees

Based on your logic, they're all cheat?

Don't tell me they are accepted as refugees because they're famous artist and scientists. Or is it that they are Jews and white?

Well, that has been a compelling reason to show Australian refugee policy is based on vestigial racists "White Australian Policy".

UNHCR - Prominent Refugees
Marlene Dietrich

Profession: Actress and singer
Country of Origin: Germany
Country of Asylum: United States of America
Country of Transit: France
Date of birth: 27 December 1901
Died: 6 May 1992

Anita Donaldson

Profession: Dancer, Teacher
Country of Origin: Latvia
Country of Asylum: Germany
Country of Transit: Australia
Date of birth: 2 January 1948

Nuruddin Farah

Profession: Novelist
Country of Origin: Somalia
Country of Asylum: Nigeria
Country of Transit: Gambia; Sudan; Ethiopia; Uganda; USA; South Africa; United Kingdom
Date of birth: 24 November 1945

Governor-General of Canada Michaëlle Jean

Profession: Linguist, Journalist
Country of Origin:Haiti
Country of Asylum: Canada
Date of birth: 1968

Maryam Mursal

Profession: Singer
Country of Origin:Somalia
Country of Asylum: Denmark

Tan Le

Profession: Businesswoman,Lawyer
Country of Origin: Viet Nam
Country of Asylum: Australia
Date of birth: 1977

 

[Mr Second]

So is it wrong to go to Australia to seek refuge?
I cannot fathom how seeking a better refuge like Australia is not allow?
It is clear, their countries are in a state (civil) war, seeking refuge from war is already a compelling reason for them to be admitted a refugee status regardless of whether they are rich and poor.

Are you implying that Albert Einstein is a cheat? Why did he not go to Britain, Switzerland. or France? Why would he want to fly to US?

Are you calling all these prominent refugees a cheat?
Apparently, they are all:
1. Financially well (most of them are prominent scientist, activist, and artist)
2. Go to US and rich developed countries to seek refuge thousand of miles away from their home countries
3. Most of them transit through third countries

UNHCR - Prominent Refugees

Based on your logic, they're all cheat?

Don't tell me they are accepted as refugees because they're famous artist and scientists. Or is it that they are Jews and white?

Well, that has been a compelling reason to show Australian refugee policy is based on vestigial racists "White Australian Policy".

UNHCR - Prominent Refugees
Marlene Dietrich

Profession: Actress and singer
Country of Origin: Germany
Country of Asylum: United States of America
Country of Transit: France
Date of birth: 27 December 1901
Died: 6 May 1992

Anita Donaldson

Profession: Dancer, Teacher
Country of Origin: Latvia
Country of Asylum: Germany
Country of Transit: Australia
Date of birth: 2 January 1948

Nuruddin Farah

Profession: Novelist
Country of Origin: Somalia
Country of Asylum: Nigeria
Country of Transit: Gambia; Sudan; Ethiopia; Uganda; USA; South Africa; United Kingdom
Date of birth: 24 November 1945
Governor-General of Canada Michaëlle Jean

Profession: Linguist, Journalist
Country of Origin:Haiti
Country of Asylum: Canada
Date of birth: 1968

Maryam Mursal

Profession: Singer
Country of Origin:Somalia
Country of Asylum: Denmark
Tan Le

Profession: Businesswoman,Lawyer
Country of Origin: Viet Nam
Country of Asylum: Australia
Date of birth: 1977

Those are good examples, but how many good examples can you show? I quite understand xdrive since we have a nearly same problem. It doesnt mean we dont welcome others! If you respect our culture, our custom and our country, we absoltuly welcome those people, but what are they doing now? Our government has given them a equall life as local people, what they do is nothing but born Children like pigs! One, two, Three, four, five, six, seven...... and never work, never study or speak our language! Why should I pay my tax to afford those people that most of whom never respect our country, life style, custom, dont like our country, but Always want to get money from "försäkringskassan"(Insurance Fund)? And then leaving a big social and security problem? Please go back home! God gives every country an equal chance to develop! It is not my bad that make you POOR!

 

[Mr Second]

Australia firstly belongs to Australian people! If someone respects and loves Australia, loves Australian cultrue, speaks good Australian English, loves Australian Life style and custom, I think you will be welcomed in Australia! Before you guys insult locals please Think about what are those "low manner" refguees doing in Australia? Not every refugee is Einstein!

 

[Maxtini]

Those are good examples, but how many good examples can you show? I quite understand xdrive since we have a nearly same problem. It doesnt mean we dont welcome others! If you respect our culture, our custom and our country, we absoltuly welcome those people, but what are they doing now? Our government has given them a equall life as local people, what they do is nothing but born Children like pigs! One, two, Three, four, five, six, seven...... and never work, never study or speak our language! Why should I pay my tax to afford those people that most of whom never respect our country, life style, custom, dont like our country, but Always want to get money from "försäkringskassan"(Insurance Fund)? And then leaving a big social and security problem? Please go back home! God gives every country an equal chance to develop! It is not my bad that make you POOR!

Well, there are hundreds of them in UNHCR website, more if you look at US, Canada, and Australian histories~
The point is~ it is in the first place Australia and Norwegian signed the UN Convention Relating to the Status of Refugee that promise to accept them.
That's the consequences that each countries need to tackle~

If you don't want to accept them~ easy, withdraw from the convention just like any other SouthEast Asian Countries, instead of resorting to underhanded and unsympathetic move and calling them cheats or scum.

Or is it that Australia and Norway afraid of losing the high self-esteem as developed high noble countries if they withdraw from the convention?
I think that's more of the case rather the problem of the refugees themselves. The excuse of "having enough money to fly" as proof of they're not refugees is a made up excuse~ in realtity the main reason they're not welcome is because they're middle eastern, moslems, and low educated.

In effect it is just like: "Welcome artist, rich prominent scientists, musician, novelists as refugees~ You're truly refugees fleeing prosecution. Fly here!" while "Those low uneducated refugees of muslims are not welcomed, look! They could afford to fly! They must not be refugees!"

 

[Developereo]

made up excuse~ in realtity the main reason they're not welcome is because they're middle eastern, moslems

I don't know about Norway but, in Australia, the media hysteria is fueled by people who openly admit their reason for opposing asylum seekers is their race and religion. Predictably enough, many of these hate mongers work for Rupert Murdoch's News Corp..

Remember, this is the same Australian media which turned a convicted drug smuggler like Schapelle Corby into a sympathetic national hero, and had a very racist portrayal of Indonesia in the matter.

The Australian media was furious that a bunch of brown/yellow Asian men should dare to punish a white Western woman for drug smuggling.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

One torpedo....and they'll never enter again

 

[Mr Second]

Well, there are hundreds of them in UNHCR website, more if you look at US, Canada, and Australian histories~
The point is~ it is in the first place Australia and Norwegian signed the UN Convention Relating to the Status of Refugee that promise to accept them.
That's the consequences that each countries need to tackle~

If you don't want to accept them~ easy, withdraw from the convention just like any other SouthEast Asian Countries, instead of resorting to underhanded and unsympathetic move and calling them cheats or scum.

Or is it that Australia and Norway afraid of losing the high self-esteem as developed high noble countries if they withdraw from the convention?
I think that's more of the case rather the problem of the refugees themselves. The excuse of "having enough money to fly" as proof of they're not refugees is a made up excuse~ in realtity the main reason they're not welcome is because they're middle eastern, moslems, and low educated.

In effect it is just like: "Welcome artist, rich prominent scientists, musician, novelists as refugees~ You're truly refugees fleeing prosecution. Fly here!" while "Those low uneducated refugees of muslims are not welcomed, look! They could afford to fly! They must not be refugees!"

You are right because the refugee policy is nothing but an advertisement for norsk government, but as normal norsk people, we must take our pension, life quality, social security into account! As I said, our government give them an equal life as local people, solve their problems on daily life as they've just getten out from a cruel treatment. As a host, it is the best manner to our new refugee guest! But what are they doing in our country? Come on, you say that because they dont cost your pension, they dont decrease your life quality! "Welcome artist, rich prominent scientists, musician, novelists as refugees" This is absolutly right!!! Or your country needs those people who are low educated?

 

[Mr Second]

Well, there are hundreds of them in UNHCR website, more if you look at US, Canada, and Australian histories~
The point is~ it is in the first place Australia and Norwegian signed the UN Convention Relating to the Status of Refugee that promise to accept them.
That's the consequences that each countries need to tackle~

If you don't want to accept them~ easy, withdraw from the convention just like any other SouthEast Asian Countries, instead of resorting to underhanded and unsympathetic move and calling them cheats or scum.

Or is it that Australia and Norway afraid of losing the high self-esteem as developed high noble countries if they withdraw from the convention?
I think that's more of the case rather the problem of the refugees themselves. The excuse of "having enough money to fly" as proof of they're not refugees is a made up excuse~ in realtity the main reason they're not welcome is because they're middle eastern, moslems, and low educated.

In effect it is just like: "Welcome artist, rich prominent scientists, musician, novelists as refugees~ You're truly refugees fleeing prosecution. Fly here!" while "Those low uneducated refugees of muslims are not welcomed, look! They could afford to fly! They must not be refugees!"

I dont know where you are from, but remember one thing! Our money and fortune dont drop from sky! Maybe you think Norway has nothing but only oil and fish. So please take the oil from the deep sea! How many countries can do that now? Those refugee countries, they have very huge amount of recources, and as I said "God gives every country a same time!" Japan has no rescources but still can be a high developed country, I dont want to call the name, to some countries, you should shamed on yourselves, but not stay here and shout for unfair! I always think people are different. To those countries and people who has become refugee but still enjoy a lazy life everyday, I have no Words to say!

 

[Maxtini]

You are right because the refugee policy is nothing but an advertisement for norsk government, but as normal norsk people, we must take our pension, life quality, social security into account! As I said, our government give them an equal life as local people, solve their problems on daily life as they've just getten out from a cruel treatment. As a host, it is the best manner to our new refugee guest! But what are they doing in our country? Come on, you say that because they dont cost your pension, they dont decrease your life quality! "Welcome artist, rich prominent scientists, musician, novelists as refugees" This is absolutly right!!! Or your country needs those people who are low educated?

I dont know where you are from, but remember one thing! Our money and fortune dont drop from sky! Maybe you think Norway has nothing but only oil and fish. So please take the oil from the deep sea! How many countries can do that now? Those refugee countries, they have very huge amount of recources, and as I said "God gives every country a same time!" Japan has no rescources but still can be a high developed country, I dont want to call the name, to some countries, you should shamed on yourselves, but not stay here and shout for unfair! I always think people are different. To those countries and people who has become refugee but still enjoy a lazy life everyday, I have no Words to say!

What do you think is the cause of refugees?
We are not talking about people escaping poverty~ they're not refugees
We are talking people escaping war and persecution~ they're refugees

And is it not surprising that most of it is the western countries policy that cause conflict. Iraq? Iran? Afghanistan? Mali? Syria? Pakistan?
You don't simply intervene, bomb strike a countries, and expecting no refugees flocking in front of your border.