Aukus: UK, US and Australia launch pact to counter China

[F-6 enthusiast]

 

[HttpError]

Now, China can easily give Nuclear submarines to Pakistan.

 

[F-6 enthusiast]

Okay so here's my personal opinion on this.

Nuclear Submarine Tech is very sensitive, i think US UK AU will sign some sort of intelligence sharing treaty to safeguard the secrets. The reason why france is excluded from this agreement ?


The french will be willing to sell almost everything to anyone willing to pay the price. Sometimes even to their enemies. The US UK wouldn't want this tech from reaching the hands of countries they don't completely trust, even some of their allies. Serves them right lol.

 

[Iñigo]

Australia, in the best case, will have a nuclear Submarine in 12 years, in 2034, a Submarine that does not improve Australia's position but rather worsens it and at a huge cost as it will have to sell its wine to the Muslims and its meat to the Indians

 

[White and Green with M/S]

China built first nuclear sub Type 091 in the 1960s, launched in 1970, commissioned in 1974.

Type 091 submarine - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Chinese submarine Changzheng 1 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

@waz @krash @Irfan Baloch @The Eagle

clear unsubstantiated anti China propaganda by @White and Green with M/S

I suggest a 1 week or 2 weeks ban for @White and Green with M/S as disciplinary action.

What anti China propaganda i am posting???, i am posting Facts and realties, You cloning/COPYING Soviet/Russian military hardware since mid 60s (SINO/SOVIET SPLIT), still your 60/80% military hardware design based on old Soviet designs

 

[FuturePAF]

Is this the new trio? We already have a quad.

This will force China to build up its armed forces to a whole new level. The Americans need to understand that resources aren't an issue for China. The more the Americans and its cheerleaders agitate China the more motivated China will become to face the challange. The Americans are fighting a lost war.

The full picture seems to be: the Australians will probably get at least 8 Austute class SSNs built in Australia (how much ToT is unclear) and a host of other weapons (Tomahawk cruise missiles, JASSM-ER, LRASM, PrSM and access to hypersonic missile research) but in exchange Australia will be the Cold War Equivalent of Britain; the fall back base for the US should the East Asian allies like South Korea and Japan get decimated in a conflict with China.

This also adds some teeth to the Quad; because the key will be the permanent US bases. IMHO, the quad will probably be based out of Perth.

This video sums up what happened pretty well.

 

[S10]

It's not an immediate concern. US, UK and Australia are already the more combative of the Five Eyes (Canada and NZ are less confrontational), so this is entirely expected. The announcement simply makes it official. The geopolitical implication is that tensions have reached a point of no return, and conflict is likely within the next 2 decades.

 

[MultaniGuy]

I hope countries like Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Saudi Arabia, Malaysia, and Morocco dump USA for China.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

France is not happy because, after this announcement, Australia has cancelled its submarine deal with France.

 

[ProudPak]

Notice how white stick together

I hope countries like Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Saudi Arabia, Malaysia, and Morocco dump USA for China.

Not a chance

 

[LeGenD]

Is this the new trio? We already have a quad.

This will force China to build up its armed forces to a whole new level. The Americans need to understand that resources aren't an issue for China. The more the Americans and its cheerleaders agitate China the more motivated China will become to face the challange. The Americans are fighting a lost war.

Premature judgement; let us not forget that USA is an experienced Cold War actor and an R&D powerhouse as well.

This AUKUS is a strategic masterstroke (neutral context). Australian strategic calculus have shifted overnight with this plan, and it will be no longer in the sidelines of the Pacific powerplays. This move took many by surprise and jolted China as well. QUAD is now one of the cards to play in the emerging World Order by extension.

More is happening in the Pacific lately; Japanese rightwing politics is resurging and the country is flexing its muscles as well. Japan is camped next to Taiwan in Senkaku islands as a hint.

Japan's defense minister draws red line in island dispute with China

Japan is drawing a red line around an island chain also claimed by China, pushing back at Beijing's increasingly aggressive military posturing, and setting the stage for a potential showdown between the region's two biggest powers.

www.cnn.com

With AUKUS and a more assertive Japan in tow, it will be much easier for USA to call the shots over issues of Taiwan and DPRK in coming times. This dynamic will put China on the defensive by extension. The pressure would be on China instead.

China did not become a giant overnight; China benefitted tremendously from global technological inputs and trade relations since the 1970s. China does have impressive manufacturing facilities at its disposal in the present but hostilities with USA might lead to a significant drop in global technological flows to China and this will force China to rely upon its own R&D programs for its desired ends in coming years. The pace of Chinese technological advances will not be the same therefore.

Everything you need to know about the US-China tech war

Answers to key questions about the US-China tech war, which began as a trade spat during the Trump administration but soon morphed into a broader battle over technology supremacy.

amp.scmp.com

Xi’s Gambit: China Plans for a World Without American Technology (Published 2021)

Beijing’s leaders plot a path to go it alone, vowing to spend big to fill gaps in innovation and avoid dependence on the United States and others.

www.nytimes.com

Xi Jinping risks toppling China's tech house of cards

Beijing ignores lessons of the recent past at its peril

asia.nikkei.com

One must have a look at American technological advances as well. They are absolutely significant but relevant disclosures in Public are intentionally limited. The days of F-35 marketing levels might be over.

Australia provides much strategic depth to the trio of UK, USA and Japan in the Pacific.

Indonesia and Vietnam are watching these developmemts with great interest as well.

Indonesia, Australia Enhance Defense and Covid Response Cooperation

Australia has donated 1 million AstraZeneca doses to Indonesia.

jakartaglobe.id

Let us see.

 

[applesauce]

The full picture seems to be: the Australians will probably get at least 8 Austute class SSNs built in Australia (how much ToT is unclear) and a host of other weapons (Tomahawk cruise missiles, JASSM-ER, LRASM, PrSM and access to hypersonic missile research) but in exchange Australia will be the Cold War Equivalent of Britain; the fall back base for the US should the East Asian allies like South Korea and Japan get decimated in a conflict with China.

This also adds some teeth to the Quad; because the key will be the permanent US bases. IMHO, the quad will probably be based out of Perth.

This video sums up what happened pretty well.

pretty sure china already considers Australia to be just an extension of the US. so these subs would really just be viewed as the US getting a few more subs. not too much has changed, except apparently india got thrown out of the club. considering us, Australia and uk already have defence treaties with each other.

 

[The SC]

@BON PLAN any plans on making a counter offer with the Suffren class?

This is bigger than just nuclear submarines:

US President Joe Biden will announce on Wednesday a new military technology exchange deal with Britain and Australia that is believed to be directed against China, US media reported.

Politico quoted a White House official and a US congressional employee as confirming that the deal will facilitate the exchange of information and knowledge between the three countries in key technological areas such as artificial intelligence, cyber, underwater systems and the capabilities to carry out long-range military strikes.

One of the sources indicated to the site that the deal will include a nuclear clause, under which the United States and Britain will exchange with Australia their knowledge regarding the development of nuclear defense infrastructure.

The website's sources clarified that the deal does not mention the name of China directly, but its implication lies in the Western allies taking a new step in order to confront China's growth in the military and technological fields.

Source: "Politico"

 

[Thorough Pro]

"Quad" ditched the free-rider side-kick and became a "triad"

Australia, the US and the UK have announced an historic new defence pact, proposed as the AUKUS alliance, in response to an increasingly "complex" Indo-Pacific.

The pact will will also see Australia acquire its first fleet of nuclear-powered submarines.

The first priority of the "next generation" partnership will be to deliver a nuclear-powered submarine fleet, Prime Minister Scott Morrison confirmed in a joint virtual media conference with US President Joe Biden and UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson.

View attachment 778100
Prime Minister Scott Morrison announced the new defence pact in a joint virtual media conference with Joe Biden and Boris Johnson. (Nine)


The fleet will be built in Adelaide, with the new AUKUS partnership to determine the way forward in the next 18 months.

While Australia's new submarine fleet will be nuclear powered, they will not be armed with nuclear weapons.

The move is expected to see Australia scrap a $90 billion deal with French submarine maker Naval Group struck in 2016.

Mr Morrison said Australia was not seeking to acquire nuclear weapons or develop a civil nuclear capability.

View attachment 778101
Australia is set to develop a nuclear-powered submarine fleet. (Supplied)


Mr Morrison said AUKUS was a response to an increasingly "complex" Indo-Pacific.

"This affects us all," he said.

"The future of the Indo-Pacific will impact all our futures.

"To meet these challenges, to help deliver the security and stability our region needs, we must now take our partnership to a new level."

Mr Morrison did not directly mention the Chinese government in his comments.

"This will be one of the most complex and technically demanding projects in the world," Mr Johnson said.

"Lasting for decades and requiring the most advanced technology."

View attachment 778102
None of the leaders directly mentioned China in their statements, speaking only about the "Indo-Pacific". (AP Photo/Mark Schiefelbein)


Mr Johnson said Australia was a "kindred nation" to the UK.

He said the decision to acquire nuclear submarines, which only a handful of countries possessed, was a "momentous decision".

All three leaders hailed the strength of the Australia-US-UK alliance.

Mr Morrison said the three nations saw the world through a "similar lens"

"We have always believed in a world that favours freedom, that respects human dignity, the rule of law, the independence of sovereign states and the peaceful fellowship of nations," he said.

"And while we've always looked to each other to do what we believe is right, we have never left each other."

View attachment 778103
Australia has been forging new ties in the Indo-Pacific, including the Quad, which also includes the US, India and Japan. (AP)


He labelled Mr Johnson and Mr Biden "great friends of freedom".

Mr Johnson said AUKUS was a "new chapter" of the countries' existing friendship.

"The UK, Australia and the US will be joined even more closely together, reflecting the measure of trust between us, the depths of our friendship and the enduring strength of our shared values of freedom and democracy," he said.

"Australia is one of our oldest friends, a kindred nation and a fellow democracy and a natural partner in this enterprise."

Mr Biden said the three nations had fought together for "more than a century".

"This is about investing in our greatest source of strength, our alliances, and updating them and to better meet the threats of today and tomorrow," he said.

"It's about connecting America's existing allies and partners in new ways and amplifying our ability to collaborate, recognising there is no reasonable divide separating the interests of our Atlantic and Pacific partners."

Mr Morrison is due to travel to Washington, DC, next week to meet with Mr Biden, Prime Minister Narendra Modi of India and Prime Minister Yoshihide Suga of Japan as part of the Quad partnership.

Security in the South China Sea was a key topic when the Quad leaders held their first virtual meeting in March.


FULL STATEMENT FROM JOINT LEADERS

As leaders of Australia, the United Kingdom, and the United States, guided by our enduring ideals and shared commitment to the international rules-based order, we resolve to deepen diplomatic, security, and defense cooperation in the Indo-Pacific region, including by working with partners, to meet the challenges of the twenty-first century. As part of this effort, we are announcing the creation of an enhanced trilateral security partnership called "AUKUS" -- Australia, the United Kingdom, and the United States.

Through AUKUS, our governments will strengthen the ability of each to support our security and defense interests, building on our longstanding and ongoing bilateral ties. We will promote deeper information and technology sharing. We will foster deeper integration of security and defense-related science, technology, industrial bases, and supply chains. And in particular, we will significantly deepen cooperation on a range of security and defense capabilities.

As the first initiative under AUKUS, recognizing our common tradition as maritime democracies, we commit to a shared ambition to support

Australia in acquiring nuclear-powered submarines for the Royal Australian Navy. Today, we embark on a trilateral effort of 18 months to seek an optimal pathway to deliver this capability. We will leverage expertise from the United States and the United Kingdom, building on the two countries' submarine programs to bring an Australian capability into service at the earliest achievable date.

The development of Australia's nuclear-powered submarines would be a joint endeavour between the three nations, with a focus on interoperability, commonality, and mutual benefit. Australia is committed to adhering to the highest standards for safeguards, transparency, verification, and accountancy measures to ensure the non-proliferation, safety, and security of nuclear material and technology. Australia remains committed to fulfilling all of its obligations as a non-nuclear weapons state, including with the International Atomic Energy Agency.

Our three nations are deeply committed to upholding our leadership on global non-proliferation.

Recognizing our deep defense ties, built over decades, today we also embark on further trilateral collaboration under AUKUS to enhance our joint capabilities and interoperability. These initial efforts will focus on cyber capabilities, artificial intelligence, quantum technologies, and additional undersea capabilities.

The endeavour we launch today will help sustain peace and stability in the Indo-Pacific region. For more than 70 years, Australia, the United Kingdom, and the United States, have worked together, along with other important allies and partners, to protect our shared values and promote security and prosperity. Today, with the formation of AUKUS, we recommit ourselves to this vision.

PM hails nuclear sub deal with stark warning of 'new era' for region

www.9news.com.au

And Chinese trolls and bots were screaming hot Chinese sanctions were going to make Australia such a poor country. LOL

 

[Beidou2020]

What anti China propaganda i am posting???, i am posting Facts and realties, You cloning/COPYING Soviet/Russian military hardware since mid 60s (SINO/SOVIET SPLIT), still your 60/80% military hardware design based on old Soviet designs

What’s wrong with copying well established designs of a military superpower?

Military weapons are there to achieve strategic objectives of a country. China getting militarily stronger is the only objective. You acquire those weapons by any means necessary. These are not iPhones.