Assam violence death toll rises to 21, shoot-at-sight order issued

[harpoon]

Speaking of the Indian History, coming to South ...Tipu Sulthan in our text books is a great hero who fought against the British. Why then his campaign in Malabar is glossed over and the fact that the majority troops who constituted British Army was supplied by natives aka Nizam & Marathas conveniently forgotten.

 

[Bhairava]

Speaking of the Indian History, coming to South ...Tipu Sulthan in our text books is a great hero who fought against the British. Why then his campaign in Malabar is glossed over and the fact that the majority troops who constituted British Army was supplied by natives aka Nizam & Marathas conveniently forgotten.

Exactly...and Malabar rebellion is somehow made into a revolt against the British conveniently leaving out the small detail - hell a lot of Hindus were also massacred.

 

[harpoon]

Exactly...and Malabar rebellion is somehow made into a revolt against the British conveniently leaving out the small detail - hell a lot of Hindus were also massacred.

and converted. According to wiki:

Tipu sent a letter on 19 January 1790 to the Governor of Bekal, Budruz Zuman Khan. It says:

"Don't you know I have achieved a great victory recently in Malabar and over four lakh Hindus were converted to Islam? I am determined to march against that cursed Raman Nair (Rajah of Travancore) very soon. Since I am overjoyed at the prospect of converting him and his subjects to Islam, I have happily abandoned the idea of going back to Srirangapatanam now."[38]

 

[Bhairava]

..........That is well beyond the capacity of the common reader. Just as it is not the province of a layman to enter into a judgement on judicial evidence presented, even if all of it is presented.....

I dont think you even got the point behind that post. That specific post was not a critique on how the historians do their research work - but how they present the incomplete picture to the reader. Also coming to your post, I disagree, the 'historian' is no one to decide on the intellectual capacity of the reader.

In your long winded answer you have not answered the simple question - why is that when we learn about Akbar in our history books, we learn about everything except these kind of events..that they may not jell well with the portrayal of Akbar as tolerant,secular chap ?

A witty friend of mine described the state of things in India as paradoxical. In other places, religion was at the service of nationalism; in India, it was nationalism that was at the service of religion. One might say that in other places, historians analyze religious movements and trends, and influences on society; in India, the religious examine the history of our country and seek to place it within a satisfactory framework.

Just ghosts in the dark. Nationalism at the service of religion in India ? C'mon even you know that is not the truth as far as India is concerned with all its weird definitions of "secularism"...BTW next time ask your friend which "religion" he referred to

 

[Joe Shearer]

Speaking of the Indian History, coming to South ...Tipu Sulthan in our text books is a great hero who fought against the British. Why then his campaign in Malabar is glossed over and the fact that the majority troops who constituted British Army was supplied by natives aka Nizam & Marathas conveniently forgotten.

I don't know what you are talking about. Both aspects of his rule have been noticed and identified. His magnificent gifts to Srirangapatnam Temple have also been noticed. His ill-treatment of merchants, and the excesses of his Malabar campaign are known. Where do you find it obscure?

Your point about the Nizam and the Marathas is not clear. Probably because it has been articulated incorrectly. If you explain hat you mean, it might help.

Exactly...and Malabar rebellion is somehow made into a revolt against the British conveniently leaving out the small detail - hell a lot of Hindus were also massacred.

So where has this been obscured? A general text book might not include every detail, a specific text on Tipu probably would have this information. Could you cite the texts you are taking this information from?

 

[harpoon]

I don't know what you are talking about. Both aspects of his rule have been noticed and identified. His magnificent gifts to Srirangapatnam Temple have also been noticed. His ill-treatment of merchants, and the excesses of his Malabar campaign are known. Where do you find it obscure?

I know, you know but the kid in the school who studies history in school doesn't know.
PS:I am not aware if the text books are updated from the times that I learnt history.

Your point about the Nizam and the Marathas is not clear. Probably because it has been articulated incorrectly. If you explain hat you mean, it might help.

I am not well versed like you and my source of information is just wiki:

There were over 26,000 soldiers of the British East India Company comprising about 4000 Europeans and the rest Indians. A column was supplied by the Nizam of Hyderabad consisting of ten battalions and over 16,000 cavalry, and many soldiers were sent by the Marathas. Thus the soldiers in the British force numbered over 50,000 soldiers whereas Tipu Sultan had only about 30,000 soldiers.

 

[Manas]

Speaking of the Indian History, coming to South ...Tipu Sulthan in our text books is a great hero who fought against the British. Why then his campaign in Malabar is glossed over and the fact that the majority troops who constituted British Army was supplied by natives aka Nizam & Marathas conveniently forgotten.

Many things are brush under the carpet in the name of secularism aka not hurting the sentiments of Muslims .

Coming back to the topics ,you see how the issue of the Illegal migration from BD is hushed up in the media calling them as muslim settlers as to avoid telling the complete story. Where as on Maharastra local vs non local context ,media usually writes " UP/Bihari migrants " .See secularism is taken a truly bizarre form of vote bank politics in our country

 

[Joe Shearer]

I dont think you even got the point behind that post. That specific post was not a critique on how the historians do their research work - but how they present the incomplete picture to the reader. Also coming to your post, I disagree, the 'historian' is no one to decide on the intellectual capacity of the reader.

The historian does not function in a vacuum. He writes for a specific audience. If it is a plain vanilla college textbook, covering the history of India in 1149 pages, it will have a level of detail quite different from a contribution to a learned journal, where, for instance, the epigraphical evidence of grants to a particular temple are listed, analyzed and presented.

You may disagree as much as you please, but a copy of History of India for Dummies will read at a different level from the Advanced History of India, written by Majumdar, Raychaudhuri and Datta, and that itself will read at a different level from The Bhasha Poshini of K. M. Panicked, or the Mysore Gazeteer. They are not written for the same audience. Nor are physics textbooks; what makes you think you are more competent to evaluate history texts? Because it is written without symbols?

In your long winded answer you have not answered the simple question - why is that when we learn about Akbar in our history books, we learn about everything except these kind of events..that they may not jell well with the portrayal of Akbar as tolerant,secular chap ?

We learn about these precisely from history books. Perhaps books that you have personally read, but it must be obvious even to your gas-free brain that the information got to you from somewhere, and that was not a message in a bottle.

Just ghosts in the dark. Nationalism at the service of religion in India ? C'mon even you know that is not the truth as far as India is concerned with all its weird definitions of "secularism"...BTW next time ask your friend which "religion" he referred to

Rather a good summary of the Hindutva position.

 

[TopCat]

Yes, it will. You are not invited to the party. Fear not.

More likely you will take the thought to your grave.



For someone from a country that is surely at the darker end of the skin tone in the subcontinent, following a supposedly "egalitarian" ideology (that BTW has a word for Africans meaning slave) and for a people who suffered horribly at the hands of their "own fellows" because of their darker skin color among other reasons, you have a pretty interesting obsession with skin color.

We have all seen the contempt your Westen Pakistanis had because of your physical attributes, despite the "egalitarianism"!

So you think Bangladeshis are "Aryans"? Your fellow claimed they are "Dravidians" and Science is proving there is no difference.

Is it because of the 0.000523976% of some exotic genes from Mars?

YOur frustration is evident... Are you a Dravir??? LOL

 

[bronxbull]

Exactly...and Malabar rebellion is somehow made into a revolt against the British conveniently leaving out the small detail - hell a lot of Hindus were also massacred.

Moplah rebellion,the fake bullshit.Those lot deserve to get slaughtered.

I don't know what you are talking about. Both aspects of his rule have been noticed and identified. His magnificent gifts to Srirangapatnam Temple have also been noticed. His ill-treatment of merchants, and the excesses of his Malabar campaign are known. Where do you find it obscure?

Your point about the Nizam and the Marathas is not clear. Probably because it has been articulated incorrectly. If you explain hat you mean, it might help.



So where has this been obscured? A general text book might not include every detail, a specific text on Tipu probably would have this information. Could you cite the texts you are taking this information from?

He is a barbaric ruler like others before him,thats all.

Good riddance.

 

[The_Showstopper]

Exactly...and Malabar rebellion is somehow made into a revolt against the British conveniently leaving out the small detail - hell a lot of Hindus were also massacred.

Well since you seem to be unaware of history dear, Mappillas revolted against Brits. In initial phase no hindu was harmed. But circumstances changed and it took a ugly turn when Mappillas came to know that the hindu zamindars are collaborating with Brits. Why forget that?? Every thing is not as black or white as you state. I understand that people like you when given a chance will vilify every thing which is Islamic...

I also see how media keeps parroting Laxmibai, Mangal Pandey etc for 1857 rebellion but conveniently forgets to mention that it was mostly fought by UP, Bengali and Bihari muslims. Why do you think Marathas fought the rebellion under the Mughal banner??

 

[Sashan]

Now the discussions are mentioning Mappillas revolt, I would want to point out what a hypocrite Gandhi is. Gandhi actively supported Khilafat movement by Ali brothers knowing fully well the massacre was happening in Malabar. Leaders like Anne Besant and Ambedkar called out this hypocrisy.

 

[Joe Shearer]

YOur frustration is evident... Are you a Dravir??? LOL

Dravidian is not a racial category. It is a language group.

Moplah rebellion,the fake bullshit.Those lot deserve to get slaughtered.



He is a barbaric ruler like others before him,thats all.

Good riddance.

That is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. My question is not answered, presumably because you see that it cannot be.

Why do you say that these aspects of his rule have not been reported?

Now the discussions are mentioning Mappillas revolt, I would want to point out what a hypocrite Gandhi is. Gandhi actively supported Khilafat movement by Ali brothers knowing fully well the massacre was happening in Malabar. Leaders like Anne Besant and Ambedkar called out this hypocrisy.

You will probably find it incredibly painful to reflect that Jinnah opposed this asinine act of Gandhi, and warned, as a responsible and senior Congress leader and follower of Gokhale, that introducing communalism into politics would have terrible consequences.

 

[harpoon]

Well since you seem to be unaware of history dear, Mappillas revolted against Brits. In initial phase no hindu was harmed. But circumstances changed and it took a ugly turn when Mappillas came to know that the hindu zamindars are collaborating with Brits. Why forget that?? Every thing is not as black or white as you state. I understand that people like you when given a chance will vilify every thing which is Islamic...

Since you seem to be an expert in history, why then all Hindus in that area was targetted...I am sure not all Hindus were Zamindars there. The Hindus were murdered, converted and even temples desecrated by having cows slaughtered inside the temple premises by Muslims. According to Anne Beasant:

"They Moplahs murdered and plundered abundantly, and killed or drove away all Hindus who would not apostatise. Somewhere about a lakh (100,000) of people were driven from their homes with nothing but their clothes they had on, stripped of everything. Malabar has taught us what Islamic rule still means, and we do not want to see another specimen of the Khilafat Raj in India."[21]

But again this was whitewashed by our 'secular' historians and converted Malabar Revolt into some great movement against British in our school text books.

That is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. My question is not answered, presumably because you see that it cannot be.

Why do you say that these aspects of his rule have not been reported?

.

AFAIK its not reported in school text books.

 

[Bang Galore]

He is a barbaric ruler like others before him,thats all.

Good riddance.

Your opinion, not shared by most people in the old Mysore state where Tipu Sultan is still hugely respected.