Asaram disciples threatened, tried to bribe cops: Rajasthan police

[Mritunjaya]

Snakara charya the guy lost his way - i know more about his acts than anyone here - and he did murder that guy - a little bird told me the judge got bribed handsomely to let this crook walk away .

..........sure, a little bird told me that you are gay and you like little kids. Now I know that you too have lost your way.

...here is a clue as to why he was vitimised

The Jayalalithaa government in Tamil Nadu enacted a law to ban religious conversion, in keeping with the Shankaracharya's oft-expressed concerns. The Tamil Nadu government also started to enforce a pre-existing ban on animal sacrifice in temples, echoing concerns raised by the pontiff.

BTW the Supreme Court said that there is no Prima Facie evidence against the Shankaracharya. Now unless you are alleging that he Bribed the Supreme Court I will consider your post to be the propaganda of a bigot.

 

[Mritunjaya]

BBC withdraws Offending Article on Shankaracharya - Dr Farokh Merat

On 11th November 2004 His Holiness Sri Jayendra Saraswathi, the Shankaracharya of Kanchipuram was arrested by the Tamil Nadu police allegedly for having conspired to murder Sankararaman, an employee at a temple unconnected to the Kanchi Mutt.

The very day after the Shankaracharya’s arrest a vast character assassination campaign was launched throughout India, portraying the Pontiff not only as a murderer but also as an embezzler and a womanizer. Among the English journals the most virulent attacks against Sri Jayendra Saraswathi came from Outlook magazine. The titles of some of the articles by Mr. S. Anand, Outlook’s correspondent in Chennai, are eloquently self-explanatory: “How the Gods Fall,” “Swami and Fiends” (sic), “A Sting in the Tail,” “The Baton Awaits,” “Prison Diaries of a Pontiff.” These articles are compilations almost exclusively of slanderous back alley innuendos, invariably attributed to vague police contacts and other faceless sources.

But Outlook did not stop there. The demonization of Sri Jayendra Saraswathi was to be internationalized on 28th January 2005 by no other than the editor of the magazine himself, Mr. Vinod Mehta. In a talk titled “A View from India,” the Outlook editor went on BBC Radio Four to inform English and European audiences about the “Jayendra affair.” The talk was rebroadcast two days later, on Sunday 30th January, immediately after a program of Christian church services. To Hindus who happened to be listening to BBC Radio Four on that Sunday morning, the contrast between the dignified church services and the vicious slander heaped on one of their foremost religious leaders must have been excruciatingly painful.

Two days later the talk was published as an article on the BBC website with the title of “Murder, Mystery and Politics in India.” Straight away Mr. Mehta set the tone. “The charges are a tabloid journalist"s dream - murder, sleaze, debauchery, greed and sex,” he said. The story he went on to recount was meant to illustrate each of these “charges.” But it was overwhelmingly fictitious and certain crucial details stood in contradiction with the findings of the Supreme Court of India, made public some three weeks before Mr. Mehta delivered his talk on BBC Radio Four. His tabloid dream was of his own making.

The Outlook editor did not merely indulge in fibs. His entire article was a colossal lie - by omission. On granting bail to the Shankaracharya on 10th January 2005, the Supreme Court had stated that the Tamil Nadu authorities and police had failed to submit the least prima facie evidence connecting the Pontiff to the Sankararaman killing; they had also been unable to submit any grounds of motive for the Shankaracharya to commit such an act. But Mr. Mehta passed over the Supreme Court findings as if they had never existed. The reason is obvious: the pronouncements of the Apex Court would have demolished his viciously fictitious story.

Immediately devotees of the Shankaracharya throughout the world began writing letters of complaint to the BBC. After some seven months of repeated complaints the BBC Editorial Complaints Unit authorities admitted that Mr. Mehta’s text contained “serious error and inaccuracies.” They tacitly acknowledged that apart from the alleged conspiracy to murder, none of the “charges” mentioned by Mr. Mehta were to be found in the charge sheet. On being questioned about the matter, Mr. Mehta had apparently told them that the charges of personal misconduct were listed not in the charge sheet but in the FIR (First Information Report), filed by the police shortly after the Pontiff’s arrest – another lie.

The BBC remained adamant about keeping the offensive article on their website, purged of the “errors and inaccuracies.” Thanks to KanchiForum.org, the devotees of the Shankaracharya organized themselves and engaged lawyers in London. Finally, the threat of legal action compelled the BBC to remove the article, apologize and reimburse the greater part of the legal costs incurred by the Acharya’s devotees.

Two questions come to mind. Why did the BBC believe Mehta’s version of the events and refuse for a full year to remove the article from their website? And the second and far more fundamental question is: why did the mainstream media defame and demonize the revered Shankaracharya instead of investigating the facts and exposing the real culprits?

The first question can be readily answered. The BBC believed Vinod Mehta’s groundless accusations because large sectors of the media in India were mouthing the same unfounded charges against the Pontiff. The media are by and large conformist copycats. Why, after all, should the BBC send a journalist of world rank to Tamil Nadu to investigate the case – as we repeatedly urged them to do – when most of the national press in India was babbling the same lies? We battled against the BBC – a minuscule David against a gigantic Goliath – for a full year. Nevertheless, I must say a word in defence of the BBC: they were not the real culprits. They got hoodwinked not just by Vinod Mehta but by the Indian media as a whole. Having accorded them the benefit of a doubt, one can’t help wondering why the British, after having plundered, divided and departed, still feel a pathological need to humiliate the Hindus. Would the BBC have dared to allow similar calumnies against a Muslim religious leader of even the lowest ranks? No, they wouldn’t, for obvious reasons. But the gentlemen and ladies at the BBC have retained from their readings at school that devout Hindus are a peaceful and peace-loving people. They knew that calumniations against the revered Shankaracharya of Kanchi would not bring them bombs and sundry forms of violence. Hence the platform given so nonchalantly to the pseudo-secularist Vinod Mehta.

As to the second question, several explanations have been given: clever orchestration of lies and manipulation by the Tamil Nadu Chief Minister and police; collusion of the Centre for fear that Hindu-oriented parties may regain power in the next elections; money generously and secretly disbursed by the Evangelists to eliminate a Hindu religious leader actively opposing conversions.

But all this does not explain why the media engaged in such wholesale slander and why the public did not object. The media and the public are partners. It is said of a nation that it has the rulers it deserves. In the same vein it can be said that the public has the media it deserves. There is a constant give and take between the two. To be successful and survive in a competitive context, each player in the media and the press has to cater to and please its own audience. At the same time the media and the press form and educate the public – for the better or for the worse. In the end, the two are one. So the question becomes: why was a considerable portion of the population of India, and of the Hindu population itself, receptive to lies and unfounded accusations against one of the foremost religious leaders of the land, a Saint who had spent more than fifty years of his life helping the downtrodden, building and running schools, hospitals, homes for the disabled and the aged, charity organizations, and doing everything he could to maintain communal peace and harmony, notably in the grave Ayodhya issue? His profile was reversed by the media overnight, between 11/11 and 11/12 2004. Why, one wonders, did not the public demand serious journalistic investigation, evidence instead of innuendos?

It is fashionable, after the American model, to laud in flowery terms the four pillars of democracy: the executive, the legislative, the judiciary and for the last fifty-or-so years, the media/press. This is to forget the most essential component of all: the civil society. Wherever the civil society is awake, healthy and coherent, the fourfold power system works smoothly. Otherwise it does not. It is for the civil society to constantly watch the four “powers” and take them to task whenever there is injustice, abuse of power, corruption, falsehood.

Let us take an example. On New Year’s Day 2006 the Calcutta Telegraph published a cartoon of Sri Jayendra Saraswathi with a dagger sticking out from under his attire dripping with blood. Just a few days before, the Prime Minister and President of India had expressed their great indignation at the offending cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad published in Europe. But about the cartoon published in their own country ridiculing one of the foremost religious leaders of the Hindus, they expressed no opinion at all. Was it because of the unfounded murder allegations against the Shankaracharya? But surely the leaders of the country must have taken note of the verdict of the Supreme Court of India I have already referred to, as well as a second verdict, dated 26th October 2005, in which the Apex Court ordered the transfer of the murder trial out of Tamil Nadu and chastised the State Government machinery for attempting to deprive the Shankaracharya and co-accused of proper legal defense, launching persecution against journalists, lawyers and members of the civil society “merely because they expressed some dissent against the arrest of the Seer, and creating “a fear psychosis in the minds of the people,” thus discouraging witnesses from testifying objectively. About all this, too, the President, the Prime Minister and the Super-Prime Minister remained deafeningly silent.

But they alone are not to blame. It is for the civil society to inundate them with letters asking: “Why such double standards?” And it is again for the civil society to flood the Telegraph and other unfair media with letters of vigorous protest demanding immediate apologies.

The sad truth is that peaceful and civilised protests are not given serious consideration by the Government, while there is immediate response to agitation and aggressive protests. This tendency on the part of the rulers, of whatever hue, leads to violence and erodes civilised values. Had the Shankaracharya’s followers taken to the streets, it would no doubt have risen both the Government and society at large from their slumber. But it is to the incalculable credit of Sri Jayendra Saraswathi that he did not veer a millimeter from the path of the holy lineage of Adi Shankara. He urged his followers to hold their peace and promised that Dharma would prevail, thus avoiding violence and bloodshed.

When a Saint of the stature of Sri Jayendra Saraswathi is slandered, it is the sacred tradition of Advaita Vedanta, the highest light of humanity, that is slandered. When the Kanchi Kamakoti Peetham is attacked, Sanatana Dharma, the root religion of all that deserves to be called religion, is attacked.

In South Africa they have a beautiful saying: People are people because of other people. Transposed to the context we are concerned with, the proverb is laden with hope. It means that if a few start taking the responsibility to act rightly, even in little ways, their action is bound to ripple and influence others, making the entire world a little more just, humane and peaceful – a return to the primeval and pristine religion: Sanatana Dharma.

 

[Enemy]

@Mritunjaya,

Blogs are not valid source.

And please stick to the topic.

 

[Mritunjaya]

@Mritunjaya,

Blogs are not valid source.

And please stick to the topic.

..... WRONG...blogs are not valid source for evidence, they are Very much a valid source for scholarly articles. Especially when it points to objective evidence all the time.

I am replying to the topic and the agenda set by you

 

[anant_s]

The word 'BABA' is originally a Farsi word for 'Father'. In India it has come to denote a 'Father Figure'. So if others looks up to someone as a "Father Figure" how does he become a "Dhongi" ?

You whole premise itself is illogical and irrational. It is you who need to look at the whole situation 'Rationally'.

Some of 'these' chaps maybe cheats or businessmen, but when did becoming a businessman in India become a crime ?

Religion is one of the Oldest "Business" in the world. That is how ALL religious order in this world become RICH. Just look up 'Roman Church' and its Budget which is in BILLIONS of $ or even Agha Khan who has Billions of $. I could go on, but you get the point.

In other nations they are above the law, but in India only Christian and Muslim Priest's are above the law. Hindu religious leaders right from VHP to Shankaracharya is very much Oppressed by the Law.

Paedophile Priest 'Exposes Satanic Vatican Rent-Boy Sex Ring'

Jesus wept

When water started trickling down a statue of Jesus Christ at a Catholic church in Mumbai earlier this year, locals were quick to declare a miracle. Some began collecting the holy water and the Church of Our Lady of Velankanni began to promote it as a site of pilgrimage.

So when Sanal Edamaruku arrived and established that this was not holy water so much as holey plumbing, the backlash was severe. The renowned rationalist was accused of blasphemy, charged with offences that carry a three-year prison sentence and eventually, after receiving death threats, had to seek exile in Finland.

Now he is calling for European governments to press Delhi into dropping the case. And on the first leg of a tour around EU capitals on Friday, he warned that India was sacrificing freedom of expression for outdated, colonial-era rules about blasphemy.

"There is a huge contradiction in the content of the Indian constitution which guarantees freedom of speech and the blasphemy law from 1860 under then colonial rule," Edamaruku told the Guardian in an interview in Dublin.

"This blasphemy law can affect anyone in India – even a girl recently who wrote on Facebook against closing down a city because of the death of a famous local politician. She was prosecuted under the blasphemy law and another girl who 'liked' her comment on Facebook was also arrested and then charged with blasphemy."

Edamaruku, who has the support of rationalists and atheists such as Richard Dawkins, is well known in India for debunking religious myths, and was already unpopular among Indian Catholics for publicly criticising Mother Teresa's legacy in Kolkata.

When the state "miracle" was pronounced, he went to Mumbai and found that the dripping water was due to clogged drainage pipes behind the wall where it stood. His revelation provoked death threats from religious zealots and ultimately charges of blasphemy under the Indian penal code in the Mumbai high court.

"India cannot criticise Pakistan for arresting young girls for blaspheming against Islam while it arrests and locks up its own citizens for breaking our country's blasphemy laws," he said. "It is an absurd law but also extremely dangerous because it gives fanatics, whether they are Hindus, Catholics or Muslims, a licence to be offended. It also allows people who are in dispute with you to make up false accusations of blasphemy."

Edamaruku said his exposure of the weeping statue was also a contribution to public health in Mumbai as some believers were drinking the water hoping it could cure ailments. "This was sewage water seeping through a wall due to faulty plumbing," he said. "It posed a health risk to people who were fooled into believing it was a miracle."

He has been living in Finland since the summer. He was in Europe on a lecture tour in July when his partner rang to say the police had arrived at his flat. "I felt really upset because under the blasphemy law you cannot get bail until the court case begins. I would be in jail now if I had been at my apartment in Delhi," he said.

He has spurned an offer from a senior Indian Catholic bishop to apologise for the exposure of the "miracle".

"The Catholic archbishop of Bombay, Oswald, Cardinal Gracias, has said that if I apologise for the 'offence' I have caused he will see to it that the charges are dropped. This shows that he has influence in the situation but he will not use it unless I apologise, which I will not do as I have done nothing wrong," he said.

"In a way I am lucky because I have friends and supporters in Europe. I am well known in India and have the telephone numbers of at least five Indian cabinet ministers. And I have some means of fighting back. But what would happen to the common man or woman if they were accused of blasphemy? They would be sent straight to jail without any chance of bail," he said.

Edamaruku asked for "mounting international pressure", particularly from Ireland and other EU nations, on the Indian government. Delhi had the power to halt the prosecution before a court case, citing a lack of evidence to pursue it, he said.

Mick Nugent, from Atheist Ireland, the organisation hosting the Indian's visit to the republic and Northern Ireland next week, said Edamaruku's plight also underlined the need for Dublin's Fine Gael-Labour government to repeal Ireland's blasphemy law.

"Blasphemy laws are very strange because they can be both very silly and also very sinister. They are very silly because you are talking about crying statues and moving statues or Virgin Marys appearing in tree stumps in Co Limerick. But on the other hand these type of laws are used in Islamic countries to jail people or sentence them to death. Or in Sanal's case facing a jail sentence for his work exposing bogus miracles.

"The Irish government should pay attention to Sanal's case and realise they must get rid of this absurd and dangerous law. Because we shouldn't be so smug in Ireland. After all, we have had the hysteria about moving statues and a man bringing people to a shrine in Co Mayo so they can look at the sun and see the Virgin Mary."

At the onset, i must appologize, it seems i've hurt your feelings. With all sincerity, i can tell you offending religious feeling of a person in never my intention.
Coming to the topic:
I won't get into literal meaning of things, i've used the word Baba as used colloquially meaning an elderly person who preaches certain teachings. It neednot be in a negative or derogatory sense always.

I agree conducting a business is no crime, but doing it in an unethical manner certainly is. When certain person, in the name of having divine powers start cheating people, this represents, to me, moral decadence something our society can do without.
There is no dearth of imposters who in the name of having super-natural powers, cheat people.
If a crime is committed for which Asaram has been arrested, it needs to be condemned and the guilty be punished severly. The case is in investigation and hence wrong to assume things or pass judgements, but as a law abiding citizen, this isn't an unjustified demand.

 

[Mritunjaya]

At the onset, i must appologize, it seems i've hurt your feelings. With all sincerity, i can tell you offending religious feeling of a person in never my intention.

Why did you feel you have 'hurt my feelings' ? I stick to stating facts and don't really take anyone's 'feelings' into account, including my own. Let us stick to facts then.

I won't get into literal meaning of things, i've used the word Baba as used colloquially meaning an elderly person who preaches certain teachings. It neednot be in a negative or derogatory sense always.

Again you say you use the word 'baba' to mean elderly person, which is exactly what I said. The problem is you calling them 'Dhongi'. If someone decides to consider the other person as elderly either in age, knowledge, spiritually then how can you call it 'dhongi' or even if the other person pretends to be elderly then how is it a problem ? Women pretend to be 'younger' all the time, would you go around calling them 'Dhongi' ? THAT is the derogatory connotation YOU gave.

The other problem is you calling something 'rational' when it follows no rule of Logic or inference.

I agree conducting a business is no crime, but doing it in an unethical manner certainly is. When certain person, in the name of having divine powers start cheating people, this represents, to me, moral decadence something our society can do without.

Again you contradict yourself. Unethical behavior or business is ALSO not necessarily a Crime. Advertising that claim 'Boost is the secrete of Sachin Tendulkar's energy' is also unethical , but it is perfectly Legal to show that ad to unsuspecting kids.

This ad seems to indicate that drinking Boost seems to give the drinker 'supernatural' power and is cheating people.

Second point is that ANY religion that claims that God spoke to them and says there is a Heaven or Hell is unethical practice as they provide NO PROOF of the same. As per you own "logic" this then represents a 'moral decadence in society'.

Your 'logic' then would then dictate that ALL Religious books are unethical and immoral since there is no empirical evidence of any of the claims the book make.

There is no dearth of imposters who in the name of having super-natural powers, cheat people.
If a crime is committed for which Asaram has been arrested, it needs to be condemned and the guilty be punished severly. The case is in investigation and hence wrong to assume things or pass judgements, but as a law abiding citizen, this isn't an unjustified demand.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Nature imitates to survive, and if man/women is part of nature, you can be sure he/she will imitate too. Not acknowledging this is again to deny the nature order of things.

As to Asaram, I really have no clue about what happened and neither do I have an unnatural interest in that case. I am debating a much larger point.

 

[anant_s]

Why did you feel you have 'hurt my feelings' ? I stick to stating facts and don't really take anyone's 'feelings' into account, including my own. Let us stick to facts then.



Again you say you use the word 'baba' to mean elderly person, which is exactly what I said. The problem is you calling them 'Dhongi'. If someone decides to consider the other person as elderly either in age, knowledge, spiritually then how can you call it 'dhongi' or even if the other person pretends to be elderly then how is it a problem ? Women pretend to be 'younger' all the time, would you go around calling them 'Dhongi' ? THAT is the derogatory connotation YOU gave.

The other problem is you calling something 'rational' when it follows no rule of Logic or inference.



Again you contradict yourself. Unethical behavior or business is ALSO not necessarily a Crime. Advertising that claim 'Boost is the secrete of Sachin Tendulkar's energy' is also unethical , but it is perfectly Legal to show that ad to unsuspecting kids.

This ad seems to indicate that drinking Boost seems to give the drinker 'supernatural' power and is cheating people.

Second point is that ANY religion that claims that God spoke to them and says there is a Heaven or Hell is unethical practice as they provide NO PROOF of the same. As per you own "logic" this then represents a 'moral decadence in society'.

Your 'logic' then would then dictate that ALL Religious books are unethical and immoral since there is no empirical evidence of any of the claims the book make.



Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Nature imitates to survive, and if man/women is part of nature, you can be sure he/she will imitate too. Not acknowledging this is again to deny the nature order of things.

As to Asaram, I really have no clue about what happened and neither do I have an unnatural interest in that case. I am debating a much larger point.

I would've loved this conversation on some appropriate forum but nevertheless heres what my belief about faith and religion are:

1. Every person having faith in God and having a wish to attain Nirvana or Moksh (as is called in Hindu religion) tries to achieve it in a way described in religious texts. Common practices include meditation, prayers, recital of holy text and so on. Now as for praying, some of us donot believe in God having any Form and meditate HIM as some source of Positive Energy or Light.
2. In conducting such practices, it is adviced to learn the path or method from a learned person. I prefer to call such a person GURU. The word BABA is used in several texts so denote such a teacher or person.
3. Now comes the part on how do you get to know if a person is qualified to teach you. A lot of elderly people who practice meditation tell me that you can actually see an Aura around such a person and you can connect with him spiritually instantly.

now comes the part where you are objecting to some words:

4. I've had first hand experience in rural areas, where crooks claim to have powers (such as healing someone, solving worldly problems etc) and all they master in is cheating the people. I call them DHONGI BABAs, you may choose other word. The moot point is they cheat on people's faith.

5. When a person finds a connect with GOD and starts experiencing spiritual upliftment, wordly pleasures are of little meaning to him. Such a person is really content with what he has with him. In such a state, don't you think a person lusting for money, power, materialistic deeds is actually a pretender?

6. To me cheating (by bluffing, lying ) is unethical. Your example of Boost powering Sachin cannot be proved. I cannot contradict Sachin, may be Boost is actually the reason behind in 25,000 odd runs. they never claim my son will also achieve similar feats by drinking Boost, so there is anything illegal in that, i doubt.
7. Finally, Religious beliefs are a matter of faith and personal matters. When i sit down to meditate, i find a connect with God. To me that is the greatest proof of HIS existence.

 

[[Bregs]]

This crook baba is gone now as laws changed after Delhi rape case, he will pay this time for making peoples fool n committing sin

 

[Mritunjaya]

I would've loved this conversation on some appropriate forum but nevertheless heres what my belief about faith and religion are:

1. Every person having faith in God and having a wish to attain Nirvana or Moksh (as is called in Hindu religion) tries to achieve it in a way described in religious texts. Common practices include meditation, prayers, recital of holy text and so on. Now as for praying, some of us donot believe in God having any Form and meditate HIM as some source of Positive Energy or Light.
2. In conducting such practices, it is adviced to learn the path or method from a learned person. I prefer to call such a person GURU. The word BABA is used in several texts so denote such a teacher or person.
3. Now comes the part on how do you get to know if a person is qualified to teach you. A lot of elderly people who practice meditation tell me that you can actually see an Aura around such a person and you can connect with him spiritually instantly.

now comes the part where you are objecting to some words:

4. I've had first hand experience in rural areas, where crooks claim to have powers (such as healing someone, solving worldly problems etc) and all they master in is cheating the people. I call them DHONGI BABAs, you may choose other word. The moot point is they cheat on people's faith.

5. When a person finds a connect with GOD and starts experiencing spiritual upliftment, wordly pleasures are of little meaning to him. Such a person is really content with what he has with him. In such a state, don't you think a person lusting for money, power, materialistic deeds is actually a pretender?

6. To me cheating (by bluffing, lying ) is unethical. Your example of Boost powering Sachin cannot be proved. I cannot contradict Sachin, may be Boost is actually the reason behind in 25,000 odd runs. they never claim my son will also achieve similar feats by drinking Boost, so there is anything illegal in that, i doubt.
7. Finally, Religious beliefs are a matter of faith and personal matters. When i sit down to meditate, i find a connect with God. To me that is the greatest proof of HIS existence.

Let me point out the absurdity in what you claim is 'logic'.

1. You start the post by using the word 'FAITH'..... that by its very definition is a Belief NOT based on Truth.

2. You then use the word GOD...... that by its very definition is something that is beyond 'proof' and 'logic' and rational thought.

3. You then use the world ADVISED..... that too is defined as opinion of someone and is not backed by any empirical proof or validated in any way.

4. You then use the words 'elderly people tell me' ....that too indicates an opinion that is merely 'hear say'. (not even admissible in court)

5. You then yourself indicate that you cannot or have never seen 'Aura' ...... indicating an illogical need to have a blind belief.

6. You then use the word 'HIM'....... indicating a Male presence that is not evidenced by any proof.

7. You then use the word 'SPIRITUALLY' .....that too by its very definition is intangible or without any material. (hence cannot be measured or proved)

8. You then talk about 'connecting' with something that is neither tangible, nor evidenced anywhere nor proved by inference. This connection itself cannot be seen, measured or proved.

You see the Absurdity of what you claim is 'LOGIC' ?

Your whole 'Logic' and much famed 'Rationality' is now exposed to be based on BLIND BELIEF.


9. Now it is much more Logical to believe in a Cook who can serve you BOOST that may boost your energy. It is now far more logical to believe people you can later hold accountable for any or some of their promises, unlike promises of an intangible 'god'. By your own definition it can be proven that those people's action is FAR MORE LOGICAL and RATIONAL than your own premise of blindly believing in something or someone who can never be held accountable.

10. Another of your claim is that when someone finds a connection with god (both of which cannot be evidenced), the resultant person now looses interest in the world. This is your blind belief and is not Rational nor Logical. There is no evidence of any connection between god and people's desire to renounce society. If renouncing society is the measure then patients exhibiting depression who withdraw from society can be classified as 'sanyasi'. That withdrawal is the only thing that can be measured in either case. Both God and the 'connect' cannot be proved or evidenced.

11. Every advertisement you see on TV is a lie. No amount of AXE is going to make girls run towards you nor is Fair and Lovely going to make you Fair or Lovely. The point was about things that is unethical is not necessarily Illegal. Its not about Sachin and Boost.

12. Your last point just reconfirms your 'blind belief' ...yet you have no qualms in calling others faith the object of their faith as 'Dhongi'.

One has to conclude that ONLY your Faith is True, Others Faith are False. Guess what we call such people........

In any case if you do not get this point now, you are never going to get it and continuing this debate will then become a waste of time for me.

 

[manlion]

all the Hindu saffron brigade should do the same - get castrated for good of mankind

An Indian holyman castrated himself in an apparent protest against the arrest of a popular spiritual leader on sex charges, police said Thursday.

Baba Premdas, 60, was found bleeding late Wednesday in northern Uttar Pradesh state after severing his genitals in what reports said was a protest at last week's arrest of Asaram Bapu, a self-styled Hindu holyman.

"Why he did it is not clear. Some say it was because of Bapu's arrest, some say it was because he feared ending up in Bapu's situation. No one knows," said Alankrita Singh, chief of police of the city of Amethi.

 

[kurup]

These Godmen and their supporters are a disgrace for Hinduism and India .

If they are found violating the law , jail them and if involved in criminal activities , hang them .

 

[Mritunjaya]

These Godmen and their supporters are a disgrace for Hinduism and India .

If they are found violating the law , jail them and if involved in criminal activities , hang them .

Why the double standard in seeking 'hanging' for godmen involved in criminal activities ? ...... is IPC not enough ?

.......Hinduism and India are both far too large and deep to be disgraced by the acts of a few.

Maybe for those who seeks validation in the eyes of others and have fragile self image, such news will be enough to shake it. But for the rest of us these aberrations still remain fringe elements.

When genuine saints like Swami Jayendra Saraswati is victimized and the vast majority of Hindus keep silent or rejoice in this vile act, that is when Hinduisms and India is really disgraced.

The vacuum left by such giants will be then filled by others. All those who are impotent to defend Hinduisms have no moral authority to comment on the act of others.

all the Hindu saffron brigade should do the same - get castrated for good of mankind

An Indian holyman castrated himself in an apparent protest against the arrest of a popular spiritual leader on sex charges, police said Thursday.

Baba Premdas, 60, was found bleeding late Wednesday in northern Uttar Pradesh state after severing his genitals in what reports said was a protest at last week's arrest of Asaram Bapu, a self-styled Hindu holyman.

"Why he did it is not clear. Some say it was because of Bapu's arrest, some say it was because he feared ending up in Bapu's situation. No one knows," said Alankrita Singh, chief of police of the city of Amethi.

LTTE and your kind has already been castrated by Sri Lanka and India

 

[kurup]

Why the double standard in seeking 'hanging' for godmen involved in criminal activities ? ...... is IPC not enough ?

What double standards are you talking about ???

.......Hinduism and India are both far too large and deep to be disgraced by the acts of a few.

Hinduism and India may be large and deep but those who bring disgrace how small it is , need to be removed.

Maybe for those who seeks validation in the eyes of others and have fragile self image, such news will be enough to shake it. But for the rest of us these aberrations still remain fringe elements.

First sentence = cr@p .

Second sentence = and I am advocating for these fringe elements to be removed .

When genuine saints like Swami Jayendra Saraswati is victimized and the vast majority of Hindus keep silent or rejoice in this vile act, that is when Hinduisms and India is really disgraced.

Please don't compare the likes of Asaram and Sai Baba like godmen to swami's like Jayendra Saraswati or Vivekananda .

There is simply no comparison .

The vacuum left by such giants will be then filled by others. All those who are impotent to defend Hinduisms have no moral authority to comment on the act of others.

What moral authority do you have ??

Writing cr@p on a internet defence site and name calling others because they do not tow your line is not going to bestow upon you some great authority .

 

[Mritunjaya]

What double standards are you talking about ???
Hinduism and India may be large and deep but those who bring disgrace how small it is , need to be removed.

First sentence = cr@p .

Second sentence = and I am advocating for these fringe elements to be removed .

Please don't compare the likes of Asaram and Sai Baba like godmen to swami's like Jayendra Saraswati or Vivekananda .

There is simply no comparison .

What moral authority do you have ??

Writing cr@p on a internet defence site and name calling others because they do not tow your line is not going to bestow upon you some great authority .

1. I have already indicted the double standard by asking why IPC was not enough. It is for you to explain why hanging and not regular IPC.

2. Fringe elements cannot be removed......there is always fringe elements in everything, in every society, in every community, in every religion. The exist on the 'fringe' hence the name. Life is not binary logic i.e. yes or no.

3. I have said when Hinduisms gets maligned after the arrest of genuine saints then others will take their place. What part do you not understand ?

4. You are the one holding trial in your mind and passing judgement. I have not done neither, hence it is you who is required to have moral authority before posting your judgement, not me. Do you understand such simple logic ?

 

[kurup]

1. I have already indicted the double standard by asking why IPC was not enough. It is for you to explain why hanging and not regular IPC.

2. Fringe elements cannot be removed......there is always fringe elements in everything, in every society, in every community, in every religion. The exist on the 'fringe' hence the name. Life is not binary logic i.e. yes or no.

3. I have said when Hinduisms gets maligned after the arrest of genuine saints then others will take their place. What part do you not understand ?

4. You are the one holding trial in your mind and passing judgement. I have not done neither, hence it is you who is required to have moral authority before posting your judgement, not me. Do you understand such simple logic ?

1. I said if involved in criminal activities , they should be hanged . I think for most crimes IPC is soft on the culprits . Hanging only for the rarest of the rarest cases .WTF is that .

2. Fringe elements can be removed .They will come from time to time . Not taking action is not the answer .

3. Hinduism is not a hollow religion that it requires some fringe element to take the guard . Moreover these godmen are no saints . They are using Hinduism for their personal benefits .

4. Do you understand simple words . I did not passed any judgement . Look up the meaning of ' if ' .

If they are found violating the law , jail them and if involved in criminal activities , hang them .