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Anna Hazare released from jail after India-wide protests, begins fasting

Jan Lokapl Bill


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Please buddy, control your emotions. You are being easily manipulated by the very same media ......



No buddy IM against corruption and this Anna is the spark that lit the Powder keg.....All the media is just against Anna....for what.....I guess they must be worried about corruption also huh
 
And people like these have been selected FOREVER. If I'm not wrong, Sharad Powar has been continuously been elected to public bodies since 1967.

What do what to to do ? Indians should submit their fate to these politicians? What was the point of protests against reservations then? Elected representatives did it?

What's the point in protesting against the various scams? Elected representatives did it?

And let me repeat

What was the point in protesting against the emergency? After all Indira Gandhi was an elected representative.

This "elected representative" canard is just a way to hide our own laziness and maintain status quo !!
 
Please do not bring 'Congress-BJP' in it. You may consider him a congress or he may think you a BJP supporter. We have nothing against or in favour of any political party. We need a fullproof system which can keep check on our rulers.....BJP or Cong or Maoists...doesnt matter...

Ok. ill keep it in mind.
 
Rather than indulging in name calling or disdain, it would be benificial if you could point out to specific issues which we can debate upon. Thanx.



There is no need to debate...There is no room for corruption and no debate need to acknowledge that. Anna proposals are better than any Babus for the past 50 yrs.....we need civilian insight.....Read post 188
 
If you are actually so curious to know about this whole bill, then all you have to do is to go to the post no.-15 of this very thread.

And if your purpose is only to mislead people here, and defend these ruling bastards. then dont bother to reply to this.

The selection procedure mentioned in the Hazare version states:

6. Appointment of the Chairperson and members:
1. The Chairperson and members shall be appointed by the President on the recommendation of a selection committee.
2. Following persons shall not be eligible to become Chairman or Member in Lokpal:
(a) Any person who was ever chargesheeted for any offence under IPC or PC Act or was ever penalized under CCS Conduct Rules.
(b) Any person who is less than 40 years in age.
3. At least four members of Lokpal shall have legal background.
4. The members and Chairperson should have unimpeachable integrity and should have demonstrated their resolve and efforts to fight against corruption in the past.
5. A selection committee consisting of the following shall be set up:
a. The Chairpersons of both Houses of Parliament
b. Two senior most judges of Supreme Court
c. Two senior most Chief Justices of High Courts.
d. All Nobel Laureates of Indian Origin
e. Chairperson of National Human Rights Commission
f. Last two Magsaysay Award winners of Indian origin
g. Comptroller and Auditor General of India
h. Chief Election Commissioner
i. Bharat Ratna Award winners
j. After the first set of selection process, the outgoing members and Chairperson of Lokpal.
6. The seniormost judge of Supreme Court shall act as the Chairperson of the selection committee.
7. The following selection process shall be followed:
a. Recommendations shall be invited through open advertisements in prescribed format.
b. Each person recommending shall be expected to justify the selection of his candidate giving examples from the past achievements of the candidate.
c. The list of candidates along with their recommendations received in the format mentioned above shall be displayed on a website.
d. Each member of the selection committee, on the basis of the above material, shall recommend such number of names as there are vacancies.
e. A priority list shall be prepared with the candidate receiving recommendations from maximum number of members of selection committee at the top. The candidates recommended by same number of members shall be treated at par.
f. This priority list shall be displayed on the website.
g. Around three times the names as there are vacancies, shall be shortlisted from the top.
h. Public feedback shall be invited on the shortlisted names by putting these names on the website.
i. The selection committee may decide to use any means to collect more information about the background and past achievements of the shortlisted candidates.
j. Selection committee shall invite shortlisted candidates for discussions, video recordings of which shall be made public.
k. All the material obtained so far about the candidates shall be made available to each member of the selection committee in advance. The members shall make their own assessment of each candidate.
l. The selection committee shall meet and discuss the material so received about each candidate. The final selections for the Chairperson and members shall be made preferably through consensus.
Provided that if three or more members, for reasons to be recorded in writing, object to the selection of any member, he shall not be selected.
m. All meetings of selection committee shall be video recorded and shall be made public.
8. The Prime Minister shall recommend the names finalized by the selection committee to the President immediately, who shall order such appointments within a month of receipt of the same.
9. If any of the members of the selection committee retires while a selection process is going on, that member will continue on the selection committee till the end of that process.

But it still doesn't answer my fundamental question. How do you ensure that someone selected by NON ELECTED personnel shall be without any bias?
 
There is no need to debate...There is no room for corruption and no debate needed to acknowledge that. Anna proposals are better than any Babus for the past 50 yrs.....we need civilian insight.....Read post 188

And this bill has not been drafted by noobs.
People like Justics hegde, Justice Lingdoh, Ram Jethmalani, Kiran Bedi, Arvind Kejriwal and many other learned souls have spent months to finally conclude this bill.
 
What do what to to do ? Indians should submit their fate to these politicians? What was the point of protests against reservations then? Elected representatives did it?

What's the point in protesting against the various scams? Elected representatives did it?

And let me repeat

What was the point in protesting against the emergency? After all Indira Gandhi was an elected representative.

This "elected representative" canard is just a way to hide our own laziness and maintain status quo !!

Look, all I'm saying is that the answer for controlling corruption is NOT in the Lokpal bill. An institution cannot ensure transparency. It needs strong willed individuals, and we should find those individuals rather than wasting our time on this.
 
Kindly do not mislead the country: Hazare tells PM

In response to the Congress criticism that his indefinite hunger was premature, social activist Anna Hazare shot off a five-point letter to Prime Minister Dr Manmohan Singh [ Images ]. In the letter the Gandhian explains why he is continuing the hunger strike that the government has asked him to reconsider. Here's what the letter says:

Dear Dr Singh,
I have started my indefinite fast at Jantar Mantar. I had invited you also to fast and pray for a corruption free India [ Images ] on April 5. Though I did not receive any reply from you, I am hopeful that you must have done that.

I am pained to read and hear about the government's reaction to my fast. I consider it my duty to clarify the points raised on behalf of the Congress party and the government by their spokespersons, as they appear in media:

1. It is being alleged that I am being instigated by some people to sit on this fast. Dear Manmohan Singhji, this is an insult to my sense of wisdom and intelligence. I am not a kid that I could be "instigated" into going on an indefinite fast. I am a fiercely independent person. I take advice from many friends and critics, but do what my conscience directs me to do. It is my experience that when cornered, governments resort to such malicious slandering. I am pained that the government, rather than addressing the issue of corruption, is trying to allege conspiracies, when there are none.

2. It is being said that I have shown impatience. Dear Prime Minister, so far, every government has shown complete insensitivity and lack of political commitment to tackling corruption. 62 years after independence, we still do not have independent and effective anti]corruption systems. Very weak versions of the Lok Pal Bill were presented in Parliament eight times in last 42 years. Even these weak versions were not passed by Parliament. This means, left to themselves, the politicians and bureaucrats will never pass any law which subjects them to any kind of objective scrutiny. At a time, when the country has witnessed scams of unprecedented scale, the impatience of the entire country is justified. And we call upon you, not to look for precedents, but show courage to take unprecedented steps.

3. It is being said that I have shown impatience when the government has "initiated" the process. I would urge you to tell me exactly what processes are underway?

a. You say that your Group of Ministers are drafting the anti]corruption law. Many of the members of this Group of Ministers have such a shady past that if effective anticorruption systems had been in place, some of them would have been behind bars. Do you want us to have faith in a process in which some of the most corrupt people of this country should draft the anti]corruption law?

b. NAC sub]committee has discussed Jan Lok Pal Bill. But what does that actually mean? Will the government accept the recommendations of NAC sub]committee? So far, UPA II has shown complete contempt for even the most innocuous issues raised by NAC.

c. I and many other friends from India Against Corruption movement wrote several letters to you after December 1. I also sent you a copy of the Jan Lok Pal Bill on December 1. We did not get any response. It is only when I wrote to you that I will sit on an indefinite fast, we were promptly invited for discussions on March 7. I wonder whether the government responds only to threats of indefinite fast. Before that, representatives of India Against Corruption had been meeting various Ministers seeking their support for the Jan Lok Pal Bill. They met Mr Moily also and personally handed over copy of the Jan Lok Pal to him. A few hours before our meeting with you, we received a phone call from Mr Moily's office that the copy of Jan Lok Pal Bill had been misplaced by his office and they wanted another copy. This is the seriousness with which the government has dealt with Jan Lok Pal Bill.

d. Dear Dr Manmohan Singhji, if you were in my place, would you have any faith in the aforesaid processes? Kindly let me know if there are any other processes underway. If you still feel that I am impatient, I am happy that I am because the whole nation is feeling impatient at the lack of credible efforts from your government against corruption.

4. What are we asking for? We are not saying that you should accept the Bill drafted by us. But kindly create a credible platform for discussions -- a joint committee with at least half members from civil society suggested by us. Your spokespersons are misleading the nation when they say that there is no precedent for setting up a joint committee. At least seven laws in Maharashtra [ Images ] were drafted by similar joint committees and presented in Maharashtra Assembly. Maharashtra RTI Act, one of the best laws of those times, was drafted by a joint committee. Even at the centre, when 25,000 tribals came to Delhi [ Images ] two years ago, your government set up a joint committee on land issues within 48 hours. You yourself are the Chairperson of that committee.

This means that the government is willing to set up joint committees on all other issues, but not on corruption. Why?

5. It is being said that the government wants to talk to us and we are not talking to them. This is utterly false. Tell me a single meeting when you called us and we did not come. We strongly believe in dialogue and engagement. Kindly do not mislead the country by saying that we are shunning dialogue.

We request you to take some credible steps at stemming corruption. Kindly stop finding faults and suspecting conspiracies in our movement. There are none. Even if there were, it does not absolve you of your responsibilities to stop corruption.


Kindly do not mislead the country: Hazare tells PM - Rediff.com India News
 
The selection procedure mentioned in the Hazare version states:



But it still doesn't answer my fundamental question. How do you ensure that someone selected by NON ELECTED personnel shall be without any bias?

You know that's a good point but I have more faith and trust in the civilian activists involved in drafting this policy.....they are stand up citizens and have been working damn hard for India....in a way that any elected official has no done in a long, long time. I trust them to tweak the selection procedure. Give them time....
 
And this bill has not been drafted by noobs.
People like Justics hegde, Justice Lingdoh, Ram Jethmalani, Kiran Bedi, Arvind Kejriwal and many other learned souls have spent months to finally conclude this bill.

Congratulations. It is people like you who are the bane of this country IMO.

Rather than debating the bill, you are more concerned with WHO drafted it. Don't you think that's stupid?
 
The selection procedure mentioned in the Hazare version states:



But it still doesn't answer my fundamental question. How do you ensure that someone selected by NON ELECTED personnel shall be without any bias?

So u want guarantee for this ?
Can you guarantee me that you are not going to suicide in next hour ?
Can you guarantee me this earth will not be attacked by aliens next month ?
Can you guarantee me my bus wont get late tomorrow..?

what the hell are u talking ..??
where is your brain man.

The only reason why this bill is being demanded is becoz we want a neutral agency to tackle corruption.
Moreoevr the power will not be in the hand of one man. There will be a group of 10(?) people who will take the final decision.
 
Congratulations. It is people like you who are the bane of this country IMO.

Rather than debating the bill, you are more concerned with WHO drafted it. Don't you think that's stupid?
And honestly speaking. its people like you who are real problem in this country.
Corruption is rampant in this country. rulers are looting left n right.
and in middle of all this some learned souls have come out with a possible practical solution to curb this menace, and all you have to do is to find excuses ???
This is ridiculous.
 
The only reason why this bill is being demanded is becoz we want a neutral agency to tackle corruption.
Moreoevr the power will not be in the hand of one man. There will be a group of 10(?) people who will take the final decision.

Do you know how many people are there in the CPC executive committee? 9.

Do you want India to be another China?
 
Look, all I'm saying is that the answer for controlling corruption is NOT in the Lokpal bill. An institution cannot ensure transparency. It needs strong willed individuals, and we should find those individuals rather than wasting our time on this.

No, independent institutions are the cornerstone of any democracy. Instead of waiting for a messiah it's better to build an institution. This bill calls for an institution on the lines of:

2. Like Supreme Court and Election Commission, they will be completely independent of the governments. No minister or bureaucrat will be able to influence their investigations.


^This is obviously in layman's terms. But the above institutions are fairly independent

Do you know how many people are there in the CPC executive committee? 9.

Do you want India to be another China?

Plain trolling
 
Look, all I'm saying is that the answer for controlling corruption is NOT in the Lokpal bill. An institution cannot ensure transparency. It needs strong willed individuals, and we should find those individuals rather than wasting our time on this.

We have been looking for strong willed individuals for 50 bloody yrs......our ppl the poor and old have suffered....and not a single babu gave a damn.....Obviously corruption stymied any search into strong willed individuals.....Once this mechanism is in place and running, I am sure we figure it out....with Anna and the other activists. You know what i noticed....all these activists never said anything bad for the Cenre to implement regarding numerous issues ranging from environment to education and etc. But the Babus always found a reason to stop it in its tracks. For that simple reason, I will blindly support these guys over any babu anyway....
 
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