An Era of Darkness: The British Empire in India’

[Indiran Chandiran]

I don't think you do.

Great wall was a series of strategic fortification started by Qin, many dynasties reinforced the forts even in peace times, including Qing. The tribes around Manchuria were originally the subject of Ming. They revolted due to trade disputes and Ming favoring certain tribes. look up, Seven_Grievances

China under Qin established the first centralized state in history. Zhongguo means centralized state.

Xinjiang was directly controlled by Han Dynasty. And one or two other dynasty.


RSS existed, BJP came from RSS.

The RSS is not the same as the BJP.The RSS never actively participated in the freedom struggle .The RSS was set up primarily to organise the Hindu population .To awaken them to their manifest destiny as the RSS put it. These are subtle distinctions not differences .
Please read up the history of the Jan Sangh , the RSS & the BJP.


Post Edited -
Fortifications by its very definition means protection of a group of people contained within a fort from outsiders.The Qin commenced construction of the great wall to keep the so called barbarian tribes of the north out of Zhongguo.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_dynasty


While wikipedia isn't the most reliable source of information , it does provide us with maps & the history of the extent of the Han empire which was restricted to the Tarim basin in the western most regions of the Han dynasty . Instead of beating around the bush , why don't you simply accept the fact that the Hans in that era never saw the tribes located in Manchuria & further north as part of their empire but more as barbarian tribes to be kept at bay .

The integration , if any was in fits & starts starting with the Jin , followed by the Mongols & later by the Qing dynasty who adopted the culture language law customs apparel etc of the majority Han populace gradually being Sinicised.


The extent of the Chinese empire kept changing over the course of the next 2 millenia following the Han but the present boundaries of the PRC closely corresponds to that of the Qing empire's which may have been sinicised over the course of its 300 year old reign but which was definitely not considered to be Han / Chinese / Sinic when it was first established by your own historians then .There's still a lot of disagreement in the present day over whether they ought be considered Chinese or not with the majority weighing in on they being considered so but with a significant dissenting minority.

As regards the middle kingdom , there were also significant periods in your history where your nation was severely divided into various parts bearing little or no resemblance in its territorial expanse to what it is today .The Tang empire is a good example after the Sn Lushan rebellion .

The first time your nation was united & bears a great deal of resemblance in its territorial expanse to the PRC of today was under Kubhilai Khan of the Yuan dynasty .He was as Chinese as I'm a Pakistani .

 

[nautilaceae]

The RSS is not the same as the BJP.The RSS never actively participated in the freedom struggle .The RSS was set up primarily to organise the Hindu population .To awaken them to their manifest destiny as the RSS put it. These are subtle distinctions not differences .
Please read up the history of the Jan Sangh , the RSS & the BJP.

Fortifications by its very definition means protection of a group of people contained within a fort from outsiders.The Qin commrnced construction of the great wall to keep the so called barbarian tribes of the north out of Zhonnguo.


While wikipedia isn't the most reliable source of information , it does provide us with maps & the history of the extent of the Han empire which was restricted to the Tarim basin in the western most regions of the Han dynasty . Instead of beating around the bush , why don't you simply accept the fact that the Hans in that era never saw the tribes located in Manchuria & further north as part of their empire but more as barbarian tribes to be kept at bay .

The integration , if any was in fits & starts starting with the Jin , followed by the Mongols & later by the Qing dynasty who adopted the culture language law customs apparel etc of the majority Han populace gradually being Sinicised.


The extent of the Chinese empire kept changing over the course of the next 2 millenia following the Han but the present boundaries of the PRC closely corresponds to that of the Qing empire's which may have been sinicised over the course of its 300 year old reign but which was definitely not considered to be Han / Chinese / Sinic when it was first established by your own historians then .There's still a lot of disagreement in the present day over whether they ought be considered Chinese or not with the majority weighing in on they being considered so but with a significant dissenting minority.

As regards the middle kingdom , there were also significant periods in your history where your nation was severely divided into various parts bearing little or no resemblance in its territorial expanse to what it is today .The Tang empire is a good example after the Sn Lushan rebellion .

The first time your nation was united & bears a great deal of resemblance in its territorial expanse to the PRC of today was under Kubhilai Khan of the Yuan dynasty .He was as Chinese as I'm a Pakistani

RSS gave birth to BJP. The pertinent point is, they are as Indian as Congress or AAP.

Empire anywhere built fortification for strategic purpose, even 18th century, Qing reinforced the wall.

You're going around in circles. Tarim Basin is Xinjiang, the garrison to Central Asia, was directly ruled by Han dynasty. Non-Han Chinese doesn't mean barbarian, not if they are subject of the realm, Tianxia. Tribes around Manchuria were subject/vassals of various dynasty.

The heart of Chinese land shaped by Han dynasty didn't change much. Qing being the last dynasty was the one that gave shape to modern China. There was no disagreement among Chinese historians, it was a Chinese dynasty, emperors claimed the Chinese mandate of heaven, continued the Chinese imperial system. Mongol did the same, though not as integrated. Yuan is considered Chinese dynasty by Mongol themselves, a separate entity from other Khanate.

You take your trolling too far. An Lushan rebellion was barely 10 years, Tang lasted for 290 years. Han about 420 years. That's almost a millennium, not counting other dynasties.

Warped logic. Borders can contract or expand, but the political entity remained. Zhongguo was unified by Qin and Han as a centralized political entity. Kublai Khan didn't create Zhongguo, Chinese empire history didn't end with him either. Yes, he was Chinese national, of Mongol ethnic. His descendants live in China today. You don't have to be Han Chinese to be Chinese national.

 

[Indiran Chandiran]

RSS gave birth to BJP. The pertinent point is, they are as Indian as Congress or AAP.

It started out so. But empire anywhere built fortification for strategic purpose, various dynasties and Qing reinforced the fortification as well.

Please also refer to my previous post .I couldn't compete it earlier but have done so now.

 

[Śakra]

India northeastern 7 sisters, the people there do not look like subcontinent, before British,

Using that logic, the round-eyed Uighur aren't chinese either because they don't look anything like you lot.

 

[Götterdämmerung]

@Götterdämmerung

You can insult and vilify me all you like. But rape is rape wherever its done or by whom ever its done.

But colonial rape apologists like you have strong cognitive inertia against such and differentiate between good rapists and bad rapists just because the later was on the loosing side of the war.

For people like you Japanese rapists are bad but American soldiers who raped Japanese women are idols because they won WW2.

Sad to see such distinction, i hope sanity prevails.

I appreciate the fact atleast you are not a closeted one and proud of it.

I have to concede that you guys are argumentative, one just have to take a look at the Indian sub forum. It's either beef, caste problems, problems with practically all your neighbours, Bollywood, religion, religion, religion, religion, religion etc. For the time you wasted making silly arguments, why da foock don't guys use it to build a decent toilet for the slum dwellers?

Pathetic!

 

[Indus Pakistan]

why da foock don't guys use it to build a decent toilet for the slum dwellers?

Great advice there !

 

[lonelyman]

Using that logic, the round-eyed Uighur aren't chinese either because they don't look anything like you lot.

Unlike us, historically subcontinent kingdoms never ruled there or have any influence, you stole these lands with British help while we were weak. You guys should thank British for conquering and merging hundreds of small states together. It's like they conquered all South America countries today and merge them into one single country - South America.

 

[nautilaceae]

We were referring to the independence struggle during the British rule not present day India .Don't keeo shifting the goal posts .

Please also refer to my previous post .I couldn't compete it earlier but have done so now.

You're the one shifting the goalpost. We're referring to this; "regardless the political party, KMT and CCP are Chinese, no different from BJP(RSS) or Congress are Indian..."

So you went to Wiki for answer? I replied.

 

[ohmrlobalobayeh]

Of course the Chinese won against the Japenese.The Americans & the allies were bystanders . It was the bravery of Chairman Mao, Lin Biao & all the other grandees of the CCP who won the day while Chiang Kai Shek & the Kuomintang were busy playing pocket table tennis .

The rape of Nanjing never happened .Pu Yi was never re instated as Emperor .

Btw - the last part of your lost was eerily prescient about yourself & your countrymen .Don't you swear allegiance to the CCP before the country. This certainly wouldn't be De meaning to you or your ancestors

There's only Victory Over Japan Day 中国人民抗日战争胜利纪念日 (3 September) to commemorate the victory over the Japanese in World War 2 and National Day 国庆节 (1 October) to commemorate the founding of the People's Rebulic of China at the conclusion of the Chinese Civil War in China

There's only Independence Day (15 August) in India.

Enough said.

 

[ohmrlobalobayeh]

Please do not selectively quote me .I know for a fact all that you've written.Please refer to each & every post of all the other posters - Chinese Indian or otherwise to see why I listed what I did & please direct your posts at your compatriots .

Xinjiang wasn't a part of China during the Han dynasty - at least not the whole of it .It was a vassal state .There's a big difference between stare owned lands , vassal states , tributary states , etc .

Nobody's interested in learning Mandarin , you Wumao .Offer any non Mandarin , non Engish speaking commoner in any part of the world the opportunity to learn Mandarin & English & see what his reaction would be .

Your place in the world is East Asia & that's where you will be

The RSS is not the same as the BJP.The RSS never actively participated in the freedom struggle .The RSS was set up primarily to organise the Hindu population .To awaken them to their manifest destiny as the RSS put it. These are subtle distinctions not differences .
Please read up the history of the Jan Sangh , the RSS & the BJP.


Post Edited -
Fortifications by its very definition means protection of a group of people contained within a fort from outsiders.The Qin commenced construction of the great wall to keep the so called barbarian tribes of the north out of Zhongguo.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_dynasty


While wikipedia isn't the most reliable source of information , it does provide us with maps & the history of the extent of the Han empire which was restricted to the Tarim basin in the western most regions of the Han dynasty . Instead of beating around the bush , why don't you simply accept the fact that the Hans in that era never saw the tribes located in Manchuria & further north as part of their empire but more as barbarian tribes to be kept at bay .

The integration , if any was in fits & starts starting with the Jin , followed by the Mongols & later by the Qing dynasty who adopted the culture language law customs apparel etc of the majority Han populace gradually being Sinicised.


The extent of the Chinese empire kept changing over the course of the next 2 millenia following the Han but the present boundaries of the PRC closely corresponds to that of the Qing empire's which may have been sinicised over the course of its 300 year old reign but which was definitely not considered to be Han / Chinese / Sinic when it was first established by your own historians then .There's still a lot of disagreement in the present day over whether they ought be considered Chinese or not with the majority weighing in on they being considered so but with a significant dissenting minority.

As regards the middle kingdom , there were also significant periods in your history where your nation was severely divided into various parts bearing little or no resemblance in its territorial expanse to what it is today .The Tang empire is a good example after the Sn Lushan rebellion .

The first time your nation was united & bears a great deal of resemblance in its territorial expanse to the PRC of today was under Kubhilai Khan of the Yuan dynasty .He was as Chinese as I'm a Pakistani .

 

[MadDog]

Punjab was annexed after second Anglo Sikh war and the fall of Sikh Empire , Punjab was under Maharaja Ranjit Singh in 1830.

Sindh was annexed in 1843, Punjab was annexed in 1849...and KPK and Balochistan later on, now imagine thats barely a 100 year rule until 1947. In those 100 years, the entire infrastructure and educational/judicial/military/bureaucratic system they gave is unprecedented by any ruler in the last 1000 years, with exception of Sher Shah Suri who did tremendous work.

 

[Śakra]

Unlike us, historically subcontinent kingdoms never ruled there or have any influence,

Oh really?

The ancient Sanskrit texts such as the Mahabharata epic mentions Manipur, where Arjuna meets and falls in love with Chitragada.[20][23] Shiva and Parvati are part of the legendary Khamba-Thoibi love story in Manipur tradition.[20][24]

Medieval era Manipuri manuscripts discovered in 20th century, particularly the Puya, evidence that Hindus arrived from the Indian subcontinent with royal marriages at least by the 14th century, and in centuries thereafter, from what is now modern Assam, Bengal, Uttar Pradesh, Dravidian kingdoms, and other regions.[27] Another manuscript suggests that Muslims arrived in Manipur in the 17th century, from what is now Bangladesh, during the reign of Meidingu Khagemba.[27]

The Indian epic, the Mahabharata; ancient religious texts, the Puranas; and the Edicts of Ashoka – stone pillar inscriptions of the emperor Ashoka dating from the third century BCE – all mention Tripura.[9]

There were several Muslim invasions of the region from the 13th century onward,[14] which culminated in Mughal dominance of the plains of the kingdom in 1733,[14] although their rule never extended to the hill regions.[14] The Mughals had influence over the appointment of the Tripuri kings .

According to a late text, Kalika Purana (c. 9th–10th century AD), the earliest ruler of Assam was Mahiranga Danav of the Danava dynasty, which was removed by Naraka of Mithila who established the Naraka dynasty. The last of these rulers, also Naraka, was slain by Krishna. Naraka's son Bhagadatta became the king, who (it is mentioned in the Mahabharata) fought for the Kauravas in the battle of Kurukshetra with an army of kiratas, chinas and dwellers of the eastern coast.

Samudragupta's 4th century Allahabad pillar inscription mentions Kamarupa (Western Assam)[16] and Davaka (Central Assam)[17] as frontier kingdoms of the Gupta Empire.

Davaka was later absorbed by Kamarupa, which grew into a large kingdom that spanned from Karatoya river to near present Sadiya and covered the entire Brahmaputra valley, North Bengal, parts of Bangladesh and, at times Purnea and parts of West Bengal.[18]

Ruled by three dynasties Varmanas (c. 350–650 CE), Mlechchha dynasty (c.655–900 CE) and Kamarupa-Palas (c. 900–1100 CE), from their capitals in present-day Guwahati (Pragjyotishpura), Tezpur (Haruppeswara) and North Gauhati (Durjaya) respectively. Country was 10,000 li (6000 km) in circuit and capital city Pragjyotishpura was about 30 li (18 km). All three dynasties claimed their descent from Narakasura, an immigrant from Aryavarta.[19]

 

[ohmrlobalobayeh]

Sindh was annexed in 1843, Punjab was annexed in 1849...and KPK and Balochistan later on, now imagine thats barely a 100 year rule until 1947. In those 100 years, the entire infrastructure and educational/judicial/military/bureaucratic system they gave is unprecedented by any ruler in the last 1000 years, with exception of Sher Shah Suri who did tremendous work.

u guys should be grateful to the British. WIthout them, there would be no India and in its place, there would probably have been 4-5 separate national entities at its best today.

Greater Pakistan(including the whole of Kashmir in the west,, Greater Bangla in the east, an entity in the north, Maratha in the middle and 1 more in the south(Dravidia?)

 

[SarthakGanguly]

decent toilet for the slum dwellers

Blasphemy

 

[Mugwop]

British weren't nearly as bad as other colonizers in African and Caribbean countries