An act of nuclear proliferation

[toxic_pus]

Khajur, our resident Ms-Know-It-All doesn't know what constitutes a military nuclear program and what separates it from civilian nuclear program. To her, ever reactor can be used to make a 'BUM'. Hence her asinine explanation of that venn diagram.

Skull was correct after all. Our Ms-Know-It-All really doesn't understand 'complex geometric shapes'. She, I am sure, can recognize geometric shapes, but surely doesn't understand the logic behind those shapes.

 

[oceanx]

... Jai Ho' is a song, which won an Oscar recently. The phrase is a wish for well being.

We've all seen the "Slumdog", Toxinne lady - that was a joke on the "Ho" ... don't take it to heart.

 

[toxic_pus]

^^ I continue to be NOT a lady.

I can see that the latest asininity in your quiver is to post random images with the word 'virgin' in it, whether or not, it connects with the theme of the thread.

Seems, 'embarrassment' is a word missing from your dictionary.

Move on. Its time to look for a different pasture now.

 

[Screaming Skull]

Hey floater!

Missed me? Looks like good ol toxic_pus has kept you good company in my absence. Hopefully, the reality has sunk in by now? If not, well we l just hope that Santa l be a lil more gracious this Christmas.

​

Merry Christmas!

 

[Screaming Skull]

These issues were raised a few months ago as well when Simon Henderson published his original story on the alleged AQ Khan letter, and various anomalies were pointed out then as well.

Ill quote a retired Canadian Colonel who is an avid China and nuke watcher (Officer of Engineers) comments from another forum here that point out some of the glaring issues with the claims made in this alleged letter (formatting mine):


This puts the veracity of the entire letter in doubt.

Some other valid concerns he raised:



I am not suggesting that one should merely accept what OoE has said, but he raises valid points, most of which can be verified through open source material, such as the points about the reactor construction.

In this report published today in the Pakistani daily- 'The News', Dr. A.Q Khan himself has confirmed the existence of such a letter and has also confirmed the veracity of the Washington Post article. It appears that Simon Henderson was right after all. The letter was indeed written by Dr. A.Q Khan to his wife and handed over to his daughter Dr Dina Khan in 2004.

‘Musharraf passed atomic information to US’​

Wednesday, November 18, 2009

By Ali Masood Syed

LAHORE: Nuclear scientist Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan has expressed his firm conviction that former military ruler Pervez Musharraf had transferred very sensitive information relating to Pakistan’s atomic programme to the US.

Dr Khan said he was ready to record the facts before the court of law. Talking to this correspondent he confirmed the contents of the recent Washington Post story and said these were drawn from the copy of his letter, which he addressed to his wife and handed over to his daughter Dr Dina Khan in 2004 as a precautionary measure when she was leaving for Dubai. The letter had ultimately landed at Musharraf’s table after being recovered from the baggage of his daughter.

Musharraf referred to the letter in his book also and now it has appeared in the press, Dr Khan said. He said on the orders of the dictator, humiliating search operations were carried out in his residence and all documents, personal diaries and family photos were confiscated. The computerised national identity cards were returned after several written requests.

He confirmed the observations of columnist Jabbar Mirza that Musharraf was hell bent upon handing him over to the US. In this connection, Dr Khan said, the then-prime minister Mir Zafarullah Khan Jamali had himself confided that he was under severe pressure to sign his exit order, which he refused after taking the federal cabinet into confidence. He said Musharraf kept a C-130 plane ready to fulfil his nefarious designs.

Dr Khan questioned what type of justice it was that the truth was made secret for countrymen while it was transferred to the US. The nation must know that national secrets were handed over to Washington by the former president who was an American stooge, he said. He said the nation knew well who its well-wisher was.

He said one-sided action was taken against him during the Musharraf regime and a deliberate and well-calculated policy was implemented to brand him a culprit. It may be recalled that the letter published by the Washington Post leads to information, which proves that China helped Pakistan in the initial stages of Pakistan’s atomic programme. On the contrary, Dr Khan had started mutual cooperation by briefing the Chinese officials with regard to the European centrifuges. The letter leads to the conviction that every thing was done for the mutual interest. The letter discloses that uranium hexafluoride (UF6) was procured in return for invertors, valve flow metres, pressure gauges and other machines. After being self sufficient in 1982, Pakistan offered to return the same but the Chinese were gracious enough having asked to retain them as gift. The letter that appeared in the Washington Post is also significant because therein Dr Khan had quoted people who were alive as against accusations that he always referred to the people who were dead.

He told this correspondent that a comprehensive strategy against him and Pakistan’s atomic programme had been drawn at a secret meeting between Musharraf and former CIA director George Tenet at a hotel in New York on Sept 24, 2003. It was the meeting which both of them in their books had referred to. It is interesting that many assertions made by them are conflicting with one another.

Musharraf claimed to have recognised the Pakistani P-1 Centrifuge design shown by George and told him that it was the same manufactured under Dr Khan’s supervision. Dr Khan said these sketches were sealed in 1982-83 and at that time Musharraf had no access even up to the threshold of Kahuta plant.

Khan demanded inquiry and trial against Musharraf and his coterie. It is an open secret that Musharraf had deep-rooted contacts with Israel and God knows how many secrets he had transferred to them. He said under a planned policy the former president had transferred all responsibility over his shoulders, which he was not going to deny. But, he demanded to expose his confessional statement secured under duress or to record his statement afresh so that real facts might be revealed.

Dr Khan said he was a resident of Bhopal in India and had opted to migrate to Pakistan, dedicated his life to the country and pledged to serve Ummah. How could a person with such plans become a traitor?

It may be recalled that Dr Khan had always been a sour in the eyes of the US, India, Israel and some European countries because he had openly stated why atomic programme in Muslim world was condemned when European nations were carrying forward jointly the same. Why Pakistan was not allowed to sign atomic agreements when the US had been doing the same. He had a clear vision that atomic program should be aimed at maintaining balance of power in the world and doing away with one-sided persecutions. However, under the current circumstances he had been devoting solely to issues pertaining to health, education and other developmental projects.

‘Musharraf passed atomic information to US’

 

[oceanx]

^^ I continue to be NOT a lady.
...
Seems, 'embarrassment' is a word missing from your dictionary.

Move on. Its time to look for a different pasture now.

You virginity-obsessed tribal bunch do wear me out alright. I was going to let it slide. But since your little screecher of a friend, you know the one who had trouble copying and pasting straight has now met up with you for a little toxic rendezvous - instead of kissing and hugging each other, how about showing us you could reconcile below with your screamer bed buddy for us?

...
It shows the historical sharing of nuclear weapons knowledge among countries, ... The number 4 against India is related to the authors’ axiom that any two tests carried out simultaneously within one kilometer would be counted as one. Thus the May 11 tests count as two ... The two sub-kiloton devices tested simultaneously on May 13 are again counted as one test. With inclusion of the May 1974 test, the total number is 4. Same being the case with the number against Pakistan.
...
Next time use your prudence and bark up the right tree! (Never mind I, screamer, will barf all over the NCI even though I didn't know it from the NTI)

So care to enlighten us, Toxinne my non-lady? Why, according to the words I highlighted in red, your fellow tribal has swallowed "line, hook, and sink" without so much as a hiccup that your so-called PNE was a nuclear weapons test after all?

Any two-bit paralegal with half a dictionary can play with the "letter" of the law to try to score a perversion of the spirit of the law. We know what the substance of the agreement was while you feel free to showcase your semantics and your stitches.

Your so-called "PNE" was as crude and patently fake as a surgical hymen. Even your screamer pal implicitly accepts this in black-and-white.

As I explained, even the authors of your "Vennginity" diagrams consider your 1974 "PNE" an act of "weaponization", hence the consensus that it betrayed your benefactor's peaceable intention. Out of good conscience, the authors could not put Canada, a cuckolded party with nuclear know-how but little aspiration for weapons on that diagram of "deliberate engagement".

Although there was no apparent "intersection" on your "certificate", there sure was a motha lode of "intercourse" - all carried on without consent and in a spirit of uttermost perversion! With "virgins" like Bharat Mata, there are no nuclear "sl^ts" out there.

Jai Ho!

 

[toxic_pus]

Ok hymen-obsessed-Ms-know-it-all, here goes nothing, once again.

You virginity-obsessed tribal bunch do wear me out alright. I was going to let it slide. But since your little screecher of a friend, you know the one who had trouble copying and pasting straight has now met up with you for a little toxic rendezvous - instead of kissing and hugging each other, how about showing us you could reconcile below with your screamer bed buddy for us?

Pretty easy actually. Watch and learn.

...
It shows the historical sharing of nuclear weapons knowledge among countries, ... The number 4 against India is related to the authors’ axiom that any two tests carried out simultaneously within one kilometer would be counted as one. Thus the May 11 tests count as two ... The two sub-kiloton devices tested simultaneously on May 13 are again counted as one test. With inclusion of the May 1974 test, the total number is 4. Same being the case with the number against Pakistan.
...
Next time use your prudence and bark up the right tree! (Never mind I, screamer, will barf all over the NCI even though I didn't know it from the NTI)

So care to enlighten us, Toxinne my non-lady? Why, according to the words I highlighted in red, your fellow tribal has swallowed "line, hook, and sink" without so much as a hiccup that your so-called PNE was a nuclear weapons test after all?

[...]

Your so-called "PNE" was as crude and patently fake as a surgical hymen. Even your screamer pal implicitly accepts this in black-and-white.

Regarding 1st highlight, Khajur has already explained it here.

Regarding 2nd highlight, the current day nuclear experts term India’s 1974 PNE as ‘nuclear weapons test’, because of the changed paradigm in defining the nature of a nuclear explosion. All erstwhile PNEs are considered as nuclear tests, not just of India’s but also of US, USSR and China’s. Today it is evident that PNEs do not have economically, as well as environmentally, viable civil applications, primarily because of radiation. Given that a PNE and a weapon test is almost the same, only difference being the objective sought to achieve and nature of the devices, it is not surprising, that the paradigm has changed.

The basic difference between a NED and nuclear weapon was that the former used to be too large and too heavy to be carried by contemporary missiles and bombers. A.Q.Khan can tell you how difficult it is to miniaturize a nuke so that it can be fitted within the limited space of a missile.

You are using current paradigm to define the paradigm that existed in 1956 and in 1974. Question is not what qualifies as nuclear weapons test today. The question is what qualified as nuclear weapons test then, in 1956 when the agreement was drafted. I had earlier explained that India was merely following the existing paradigm in 1974.

So my ‘screamer pal’ is still in the right. The ‘so called PNE’ was not only intra vires the agreement, but also within 70s norm.

Any two-bit paralegal with half a dictionary can play with the "letter" of the law to try to score a perversion of the spirit of the law. We know what the substance of the agreement was while you feel free to showcase your semantics and your stitches.

You mean that the whole of Canada doesn’t even have ‘half a dictionary’. That’s sad. I guess it figures why your ptrbhumi is so lousy in drafting a legal document. Now that you can’t make a case out of the fine print of that agreement, you have resorted to the ‘spirit’ of law. Well, the ‘spirit’ of the law is reflected in the fine print of an agreement. Given that the fine print was not violated by any stretch of imagination, India’s PNE was pretty much in the ‘spirit’ of law. USSR and France were convinced that it was in the ‘right’ spirit of the law.

Unless you can prove that the nuclear explosion of 1974 was in fact not a PNE, as it was understood then, the ‘spirit’ of the law continues to be maintained.

Go ahead. Make my day, and night, and week end.

As I explained, even the authors of your "Vennginity" diagrams consider your 1974 "PNE" an act of "weaponization", hence the consensus that it betrayed your benefactor's peaceable intention. Out of good conscience, the authors could not put Canada, a cuckolded party with nuclear know-how but little aspiration for weapons on that diagram of "deliberate engagement".

Of course they do. They are following the current paradigm. That’s why they have specifically mentioned that India’s PNE in 1974 has been considered as ‘nuclear weapon test’ in their calculations.

‘Out of good conscience’ you say. That is one pathetic show of how you are still struggling to figure out, why these authors are giving Bharat mata the certificate of ‘virginity’.

Well boo-hoo.

Although there was no apparent "intersection" on your "certificate", there sure was a motha lode of "intercourse" - all carried on without consent and in a spirit of uttermost perversion! With "virgins" like Bharat Mata, there are no nuclear "sl^ts" out there.

Once again, it is not a self-certificate. The certificate comes with pretty neutral and authoritative stamps on it. These experts seem to think that all that ‘motha lode of intercourse’ was merely your fantasy.

Btw, you seem to know a lot about 'sl^ts'.

Jai Ho!

Jai Ho

 

[oceanx]

...

You are using current paradigm to define the paradigm that existed in 1956 and in 1974. ...

Just the kind of sophistry I fully anticipated. What little else could you brew? So can we "paradigm-shift" a little way's back? How about branding the "Fat Man" a "PNE" as well since IMO the plutonium therein brought peace to the Pacific?

Look Toxinne - my "non-lady", we know what we know. Feel free to "paradigm-shift" a carrot to give you back what it cost you. Spin and spit to the whole world why you are a "VBS" (Virgin-By-Stitches) for all I care.

Do excuse us for hanging on to our "argumentum ad iudicium" just a little while longer.

When facts speak against you, "white-wash" the facts . If impossible to "white-wash", use soap:

Chai Ho!

 

[toxic_pus]

Just the kind of sophistry I fully anticipated. What little else could you brew?

Why brew something when the world prefers this one. Unfortunately though, the recipe is not mine. You are giving me too much credit.

Btw, if you were that good in anticipation, you would have left this thread a long time back. So save your ‘I knew it all along’ dance routine.

So can we "paradigm-shift" a little way's back? How about branding the "Fat Man" a "PNE" as well since IMO the plutonium therein brought peace to the Pacific?

Only a bumbling idiot would do that. Are you one?

Look Toxinne - my "non-lady", we know what we know.

Look hymen-obsessed-gender-challenged-Ms-know-it-all, we know what you think you know.

Feel free to "paradigm-shift" a carrot to give you back what it cost you. Spin and spit to the whole world why you are a "VBS" (Virgin-By-Stitches) for all I care.

Given that the whole world, barring a few I-can’t-tell-a-weapons-program-from-a-civil-program-but-I-know-it-alls, do believe in the indigenous origin of India’s nuclear weapon, we don’t have to ‘spin and spit’. It is only when we meet some of those masturbating lobotomized nitwits ejaculating lies and disinformation, that we have to ‘spit’. We still don’t need to ‘spin’ because, we do stand on firm ground.

Btw, I wonder if you didn’t care so much why you continue to lick our spit.

Do excuse us for hanging on to our "argumentum ad iudicium" just a little while longer.

But I thought you didn’t care.

When facts speak against you, "white-wash" the facts . If impossible to "white-wash", use soap:

You must be right. Who else knows more, how to ‘white-wash’ facts.

Your initial allegation was that India ‘stole’ uranium/plutonium from Canada. The fact is that India had never procured Uranium/Plutonium from Canada. Next allegation was that India had contravened the CIRUS agreement. The fact is that the agreement doesn’t contain anything that explicitly prohibits nuclear explosion. Next allegation was that India had betrayed the ‘spirit’ of the agreement. The fact is that since the nuclear device could only be used as a weapon if the enemy allowed the Indian scientists and engineers to carry their precious cargo and equipments in a convoy of trucks, right into their territory, set it up and then set it off, while our friendly enemy sat on the sidelines enjoying chai biskoot (tea & biscuit), the nuclear device was indeed a NED as per the contemporary understanding and hence the test was not a nuclear weapon test, again, as per contemporary understanding. Which means that the agreement was maintained en toto, in letter and spirit of the times.

Your ‘white-washed’ facts versus our facts

Chai Ho!

2 sugar and no milk, please.